SEGAbits Forums
Gaming => General Gaming Discussion => Topic started by: Sharky on February 07, 2010, 12:17:26 pm
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Sega Japan are showing their arcade software hand at the upcoming AOU 2010 event in Japan, including games like BorderBreak, Shining Force Cross, Mushi King, Virtua Fighter 5R Ver.C and many more!
I took the trouble to list all of their games and give a short discription,
please feel free to comment on the article and tell me im awesome!
http://www.segabits.com/?p=65 (http://www.segabits.com/?p=65)
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I hope that VF5R VC is the last VF5R game, and maybe Sega will consider then porting it to home consoles.
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Well it seems to actually be called;
'Virtua Fighter 5R ver.c: Final Battle Audition'
Which seems to hint at it being the final version.
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Well it seems to actually be called;
'Virtua Fighter 5R ver.c: Final Battle Audition'
Which seems to hint at it being the final version.
Thats good if true. I really hope my theory of Sega waiting until the Final version before porting is true. It would certainly shut up a lot of VF fans who are screaming blue murder that Sega hates all it's fans and is trying to kill Virtua Fighter because one game hasn't been ported to home consoles yet.
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So is it really a new game or just a big upgrade of 4? It honestly looks really similar.
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So is it really a new game or just a big upgrade of 4? It honestly looks really similar.
Do you mean an upgrade of 5?
VF5R Is just an upgrade of VF5 with 2 more characters and a lot of ballence tweeks, then they keep tweeking it until its 'perfect' that is the 'versions'.
This is VF5R Ver.c Which is possibly the final tweeked version of VF5R.
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Do you mean an upgrade of 5?
I am pretty sure he meant Virtua Fighter 4, the release of 5 we got on consoles did not add much to the series at all, in fact it removed a lot of features that were actually pretty basic.
VF5R has new levels that are actually not big squares this time around. They have all kinds of shapes now! And some change from round to round, neat! It also has new and waaaay better music, as well as the option to choose every song from all of the previous games in the series, excellent addition!
One of the "New" characters is Taka-Arashi from Virtua Fighter 3 (the only character from the series to ever be removed).
I am hoping MadeMang is right here. I would be the happiest guy on the planet if it happened and they had good additions to the home release, like Virtua Fighter 4 Evolution did.
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Actually I did mean 5, but I do like 4 better (Evolution, anyway). But it does sound like what 5 should have been, rather than less features for the sake of graphics.
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Another AOU, another year I get let down by no new Super Hang-On :(
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I really don't know what's up Virtua Fighter fans' asses. We still haven't gotten House of the Dead IV on home consoles, even for download, and that was five years ago. Not to mention, House of the Dead usually does as well (or better) at retail.
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Give me Planet Harriers and HOTD4 before a slightly upgraded VF5 ;)
This IS an official Sega site right? Do what I say!!!!!!!
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Slightly upgraded? It is a completely new game. The only thing it kept from the other release were the models and some of the animations.
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I really don't know what's up Virtua Fighter fans' asses. We still haven't gotten House of the Dead IV on home consoles, even for download, and that was five years ago. Not to mention, House of the Dead usually does as well (or better) at retail.
Yeah, but HOTD has had three to four releases within that period if you count the spin offs and collection games. VF hasn't seen nothing since its initial home release.
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Sega newest lineup at the show.
[SENGOKU TAISEN] promo video only.
[SHINING FORCE CROSS VerB] Spring (new race, enemies ,story, etc)
[VIRTUA FIGHTER 5 Final Showdown] Summer
[BOARDER BREAK Ver1.5] Spring (Valkyria Chronicles 2 collabo)
[PROJECT DIVA ARCADE] June/650.000 yen
[AMINo.3] July/748.000 yen (this game is fantastic and my fav after VF)
[ARABIAN JEWEL] July/4.350.000 yen (very cheap! Let's buy one)
[UFO BALANCE CATCHER] July/898.000 yen
Miku held all the attentions at the show.
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LET'S GO iSLAND LOST ON THE ISLAND OF SPICE
(http://http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/img/gmw/docs/350/232/118.jpg)
(http://http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/img/gmw/docs/350/232/120.jpg)
Miku Arcade
(http://http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/img/gmw/docs/350/232/04.jpg)
(http://http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/img/gmw/docs/350/232/12.jpg)
(http://http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/img/gmw/docs/350/232/16.jpg)
They are using VF5 high definition graphic engine on her.
(http://http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/img/gmw/docs/350/232/126.jpg)
Yeah! She made a live show at Sega booth. How? Well... look at the pics. She was there!
More at the links:
http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/ne ... 50232.html (http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/news/20100219_350232.html)
http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/ne ... 50342.html (http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/news/20100219_350342.html)
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Sega have a really really goodline up this year! Even better then most years. Theres no way they wont make a profit.
SENGOKU TAISEN, Virtua Fighter 5 Final, Shining Force Cross, Boader Break and Lets go Island I would love to get my hands on!
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LET'S GO iSLAND LOST ON THE ISLAND OF SPICE looks incredible , so does Shinning Cross . How can SEGA push boards like Lindberg (VF 5 Final looks better than any next gen beat them up) and RingEdge when thier spec's are nothing to the 360 and PS3 , only to them fall flat on their ass for most Console efforts I do not know , More so when most of the next gen consoles all use PC CPU's or GPU to power them .
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Sega have a really really goodline up this year! Even better then most years. Theres no way they wont make a profit.
SENGOKU TAISEN, Virtua Fighter 5 Final, Shining Force Cross, Boader Break and Lets go Island I would love to get my hands on!
VF5S is the only title on that list that holds any intrest for me. Most of the others are specific to the tastes of their country of origin .
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LET'S GO iSLAND LOST ON THE ISLAND OF SPICE looks incredible , so does Shinning Cross . How can SEGA push boards like Lindberg (VF 5 Final looks better than any next gen beat them up) and RingEdge when thier spec's are nothing to the 360 and PS3 , only to them fall flat on their ass for most Console efforts I do not know , More so when most of the next gen consoles all use PC CPU's or GPU to power them .
Well obviously Sega would do better with their own hardware than other peoples'. That's just the way its always been.
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Sega have a really really goodline up this year! Even better then most years. Theres no way they wont make a profit.
SENGOKU TAISEN, Virtua Fighter 5 Final, Shining Force Cross, Boader Break and Lets go Island I would love to get my hands on!
VF5S is the only title on that list that holds any intrest for me. Most of the others are specific to the tastes of their country of origin .
Not even Border Break or Shining Force Cross?
Lets go Jungle was all kinds of silly fun so I can't wait for Island!
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Well obviously Sega would do better with their own hardware than other peoples'. That's just the way its always been.
But these days SEGA own Arcade hardware uses Windows, PC CPU's and GPU to power them , and back a few years ago , I thought SEGA more than most pushed the X-box and the Cube to its limits.
Its just seems a bit strange to see SEGA push (what is PC hardware ) its Arcade boards so hard , yet have a bit of a hardtime with its console efforts , bar 1 or 2 games
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Sega have a really really goodline up this year! Even better then most years. Theres no way they wont make a profit.
SENGOKU TAISEN, Virtua Fighter 5 Final, Shining Force Cross, Boader Break and Lets go Island I would love to get my hands on!
VF5S is the only title on that list that holds any intrest for me. Most of the others are specific to the tastes of their country of origin .
Not even Border Break or Shining Force Cross?
Lets go Jungle was all kinds of silly fun so I can't wait for Island!
No BB is crap, didn't like the game. SFC is basically not even ashamed of ripping off the look of Kingdom Hearts. Project Diva are for otaku and wouldn't translate here as many of other recent sega arcade titles. LGJ is fine even Gunman but not the type of gun game i'd like to play anymore.
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2 videos from the show:
[youtube:4od9rkzc]E0aJL2-bt4c[/youtube:4od9rkzc]
[youtube:4od9rkzc]Y9MDy4LMyEU[/youtube:4od9rkzc]
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This videoshow is very impressive ; thanx STORM!.
If only SEGA JAPAN was so prolific in the consumer area!
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Well obviously Sega would do better with their own hardware than other peoples'. That's just the way its always been.
But these days SEGA own Arcade hardware uses Windows, PC CPU's and GPU to power them , and back a few years ago , I thought SEGA more than most pushed the X-box and the Cube to its limits.
Its just seems a bit strange to see SEGA push (what is PC hardware ) its Arcade boards so hard , yet have a bit of a hardtime with its console efforts , bar 1 or 2 games
The PS3 is a bitch to program for, though, isn't it? And most Sega games are probably designed and built on PS3, with the PS3 in mind, because most Sega Japan games are designed for Japan, which obviously spanks the X360 in said region.
Another problem is that, yes, the PS3 is a bitch to program on, you should also remember that a lot of the efforts we see on the next gen consoles are fairly rushed products, like Yakuza.
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Well obviously Sega would do better with their own hardware than other peoples'. That's just the way its always been.
But these days SEGA own Arcade hardware uses Windows, PC CPU's and GPU to power them , and back a few years ago , I thought SEGA more than most pushed the X-box and the Cube to its limits.
Its just seems a bit strange to see SEGA push (what is PC hardware ) its Arcade boards so hard , yet have a bit of a hardtime with its console efforts , bar 1 or 2 games
The PS3 is a bitch to program for, though, isn't it? And most Sega games are probably designed and built on PS3, with the PS3 in mind, because most Sega Japan games are designed for Japan, which obviously spanks the X360 in said region.
Another problem is that, yes, the PS3 is a bitch to program on, you should also remember that a lot of the efforts we see on the next gen consoles are fairly rushed products, like Yakuza.
Everybody says that about the PS3 , SEGA more than most should be used to hardware that's hard to program for and using multi CPU's, even old Coin Up's like Power Drift used 3 to 4 CPU's to power it .
Most other developers (even Japanese ones) are now using the PS3 well , yet SEGA isn't , while it's Arcade Teams just rip the piss with stunning looking games , I can't believe how good LOST ON THE ISLAND OF SPICE looks .
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2 videos from the show:
[videos]
Awesome, thanks Storm!
Such a fantastic show! Sega clearly went all out this year, they knew nobody was going to touch them.
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Looks kind of like the Project Diva arcade title might be set up to possibly go to the PS3 at some point in the future with the whole "x", "o", "square", "triangle" button thing.
Is Revolution 2 some kind of follow up to Sakura Wars or something?
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Well obviously Sega would do better with their own hardware than other peoples'. That's just the way its always been.
But these days SEGA own Arcade hardware uses Windows, PC CPU's and GPU to power them , and back a few years ago , I thought SEGA more than most pushed the X-box and the Cube to its limits.
Its just seems a bit strange to see SEGA push (what is PC hardware ) its Arcade boards so hard , yet have a bit of a hardtime with its console efforts , bar 1 or 2 games
The PS3 is a bitch to program for, though, isn't it? And most Sega games are probably designed and built on PS3, with the PS3 in mind, because most Sega Japan games are designed for Japan, which obviously spanks the X360 in said region.
Another problem is that, yes, the PS3 is a bitch to program on, you should also remember that a lot of the efforts we see on the next gen consoles are fairly rushed products, like Yakuza.
Exactly. And another factor. If people are going to use the argument that the arcade teams can make a blinding game as an example to beat another stick at the consumer division then maybe they should realise that the arcade teams are still working on Sega hardware while the consumer teams aren't. The reason these arcade games are great looking because they're designed to be so they show off their technology and catch the eye of the buyers. The consumer division doesn't have that job anymore and it doesn't matter how long it is, these guys were pratically raised since they joined sega to believe that sega hardware tech is the best in the buisness for over 20 years(and in reality longer than that) You can't suddenly turn off that when you are suddenly working on a system that isn't the system you were trained to build games on.
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Exactly. And another factor. If people are going to use the argument that the arcade teams can make a blinding game as an example to beat another stick at the consumer division then maybe they should realise that the arcade teams are still working on Sega hardware while the consumer teams aren't. The reason these arcade games are great looking because they're designed to be so they show off their technology and catch the eye of the buyers. The consumer division doesn't have that job anymore and it doesn't matter how long it is, these guys were pratically raised since they joined sega to believe that sega hardware tech is the best in the buisness for over 20 years(and in reality longer than that) You can't suddenly turn off that when you are suddenly working on a system that isn't the system you were trained to build games on.
That's an old Argument , that died out with NA@MI II . These days SEGA use off the shelf PC tech , to Power Their Arcade games . To make Games for SEGA Arcade Boards is to program a PC , be it CPU, Be it GPU and right down to Windows.
SEGA have now had years of Experienced on using PC tech now , to Power its games since Chihiro , then Lindberg and now RingEdge respectively . Yet that knowledge and tech doesn’t look like it was passed down to the consumer Teams. SEGA long before most Japanese developers , set up a PC division too .
SEGA Japan should be way ahead on other Japanese developers when it comes to getting the best of the Next Gen consoles really (with their use of PC Tech) and really use its Arcade teams Tech& know how of using PC's, to help out the Consumer Teams. In just the same way SEGA used it's Arcade Teams to help out with or even Join the Saturn Consumer Teams , and getting the best out of Dual CPU's very early on.
Also it’s in SEGA interests to make their Consumer games look as good as possible , and have far better R&D tech and engines to call on
SEGA Consumer Teams need better direction , better R&D support , and in cases of Yakuza , or Sonic more development time for the games .
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Exactly. And another factor. If people are going to use the argument that the arcade teams can make a blinding game as an example to beat another stick at the consumer division then maybe they should realise that the arcade teams are still working on Sega hardware while the consumer teams aren't. The reason these arcade games are great looking because they're designed to be so they show off their technology and catch the eye of the buyers. The consumer division doesn't have that job anymore and it doesn't matter how long it is, these guys were pratically raised since they joined sega to believe that sega hardware tech is the best in the buisness for over 20 years(and in reality longer than that) You can't suddenly turn off that when you are suddenly working on a system that isn't the system you were trained to build games on.
That's an old Argument , that died out with NA@MI II . These days SEGA use off the shelf PC tech , to Power Their Arcade games . To make Games for SEGA Arcade Boards is to program a PC , be it CPU, Be it GPU and right down to Windows.
SEGA have now had years of Experienced on using PC tech now , to Power its games since Chihiro , then Lindberg and now RingEdge respectively . Yet that knowledge and tech doesn’t look like it was passed down to the consumer Teams. SEGA long before most Japanese developers , set up a PC division too .
SEGA Japan should be way ahead on other Japanese developers when it comes to getting the best of the Next Gen consoles really (with their use of PC Tech) and really use its Arcade teams Tech& know how of using PC's, to help out the Consumer Teams. In just the same way SEGA used it's Arcade Teams to help out with or even Join the Saturn Consumer Teams , and getting the best out of Dual CPU's very early on.
Also it’s in SEGA interests to make their Consumer games look as good as possible , and have far better R&D tech and engines to call on
SEGA Consumer Teams need better direction , better R&D support , and in cases of Yakuza , or Sonic more development time for the games .
No it has not. The lindbergh is still built by sega. So was the three boards before that. A sega spin on existing tech but still created by sega nonetheless. Your argument is flawed because of two things. You don't suddenly wash away 20 years of company propaganda just like that. Sega is not like Capcom or other third parties who has experience in developing and switching many cpu platforms. Up to 2001 the consumer teams didn't have that option and most of these guys now don't come from a garage programmer mentality like they did back in the seventies and early eighties. Second point, The consumer teams are in fact leading. No one has come up with titles like Yakuza or Valykria chronicles which both use unique software tech and engine for their titles. And of course Panzer Dragoon Orta, JSRF among others weren't too shabby either as you yourself keep saying. Their problem with is that the majority of these games haven't translated into strong sales as well as lacking the punch that use to define the sega games of old. That factor alone added to the fact that they are developing on a rival system which essentially in certain cases borrowed ideas from their own hardware isn't exactly a confidence booster.
You can keep playing for attention by being the only one to criticise most Segabit gamers want to get their hands on, or blame a guy who happened to lead two teams with a succesful franchise as being the one who ruined Sonic. That's all it is attention seeking and not really getting to any of the facts.
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No it has not. The lindbergh is still built by sega
That is no different to MS and the X-box . None of the tech inside the X-Box was designed by MS, It was for the best part , all off the shelf PC Tech
No different to PC boards Arcade Boards that SEGA now use .
The days of custom tech like with Model 3 or NA@MI II are long gone
And of course Panzer Dragoon Orta, JSRF among others weren't too shabby either as you yourself keep saying.
Yes Smilebit were SEGA former PC Division , and Hench why Smilebit were very quickly able to push the PC based X-Box . That's my point
Sega is not like Capcom or other third parties who has experience in developing and switching many cpu platforms.
Not quite . SEGA been around for a long time , it used and worked on many systems . SEGA more than any Japanese developer should be ahead of the game. It's consoles and Arcade boards have used Western designed CPU, GPU's, they used Windows , and even Coin Up's like Power Drift had over 4 CPU's to power it . SEGA needs to use its Arcade know how to its Advantage and start sharing it between the teams , and start to make better Multi Platform game engines , ones that use the PC, but can be translated down to the consoles.
No one has come up with titles like Yakuza or Valykria chronicles which both use unique software tech and engine for their title
Valykrie I would be agree on, its software shader program has yet to be better . Yakuza tech is old hat , and is simply outclassed by the likes of Mass Effect 2 , Heavy Rain for graphics ,and the likes of FALLOUT for scope .
You take out the brilliant Cut Scenes , and in game its old tech in terms of shaders and animations
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That is no different to MS and the X-box . None of the tech inside the X-Box was designed by MS, It was for the best part , all off the shelf PC Tech
No different to PC boards Arcade Boards that SEGA now use .
The days of custom tech like with Model 3 or NA@MI II are long gone
Really, then by that defination you can say that on all Sega systems since none of them used processors and some tech not unique to Sega. Again the argument is mute because the arcade teams are the ones building titles on sega created hardware,in a market sega has always been the top of. Completly a different situation as a third party. The question is more of a mental problem rather than physical.
And of course Panzer Dragoon Orta, JSRF among others weren't too shabby either as you yourself keep saying.
Yes Smilebit were SEGA former PC Division , and Hench why Smilebit were very quickly able to push the PC based X-Box . That's my point
PDO didn't really push the Xbox. let's not exaggerate.
Sega is not like Capcom or other third parties who has experience in developing and switching many cpu platforms.
Not quite . SEGA been around for a long time , it used and worked on many systems . SEGA more than any Japanese developer should be ahead of the game. It's consoles and Arcade boards have used Western designed CPU, GPU's, they used Windows , and even Coin Up's like Power Drift had over 4 CPU's to power it . SEGA needs to use its Arcade know how to its Advantage and start sharing it between the teams , and start to make better Multi Platform game engines , ones that use the PC, but can be translated down to the consoles.
Again. once you enter Sega or any other games company in a junior level in any terms of design you are taught the company values of approching that method. Sega was a console maker for over 20 years and before that still creating hardware for arcades. If you have been taught that philosphy and then suddenly forced to create titles for a rival machine of course you are going to find it diffucult. The problem with your argument is that you are trying to convinve people that the consumer teams aren't up to scratch. Well looking at what Sega has done on the DS,The Wii the Xbox and PS3 they are doing EXACTLY what you are accusing them of not doing.
Valykrie I would be agree on, its software shader program has yet to be better . Yakuza tech is old hat , and is simply outclassed by the likes of Mass Effect 2 , Heavy Rain for graphics ,and the likes of FALLOUT for scope .
You take out the brilliant Cut Scenes , and in game its old tech in terms of shaders and animations
Nonsense. Last time i looked the MFE or whatever its called was only been used since this gen and no one has come closed to that facial detail. But again Sega is just using the main Yakuza engine to gain back their investment from it from its multiple sequels, like they would have done with Shenmue and like many other companies do with their respective engines. I don't know why you are signilling Sega out for doing the same like everyone else does.
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There is nothing Custom SEGA tech inside either Lindberg or RingEdge , that the simple truth of the matter. However the GPU inside the STV-V and Saturn was SEGA and Unique to SEGA , and while boards like NA@MI II , Model 3 , used off the shelf CPU’s, their GPU were far from that (in NA@MI II case its (Geometry Processor). Panzer Dragoon Orta it is still one of the best looking X-Box games ever made , and all running at a near perfect 60 fps , not many games came close to Orta , it was pushing and using the X-Box to its fullest .
NCL started out a Card company , companines move on and Adapt , they just have too, what did SEGA start out as , becasue it wasn't Consumer or Arcade Videogames that's for sure.
The like of Id/Epic wouldn't lower them self to work on consoles a few years ago , so would many PC developers , now they're all on the next gen systems SEGA Needs to use all the best bits from its Arcade teams , and wake up to making game engines on PC's and then ported them down to consoles , and making far better use of Multi Thread CPU's , not just for this gen , but the next gen too
And as for the last part, I don't really like Mass Effect II , but its characters and in-game animation is way ahead for Yukuza's, never mind Heavy rain .
When one 1st saw Shemmue or to a point Yakuza 1 , it was Truly breath taking to see that many characters on screen and a world so detailed ,
But now we’re in age of GTA IV, Mass Effect II , Assassin's Creed II ECT , all witht Mass Open worlds , lovingly detailed , and populated with a huge number of characters . The teams just need to do far better , and really push the bar . Sonic Team will , to a point so can AM#2 , but the rest of the Consumer Teams really need to start using the power of the next gen far better , and push the PS3 or 360 as much as their Teams can push the like of Lindberg
And I 'll leave it at that
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Just like old times...
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There is nothing Custom SEGA tech inside either Lindberg or RingEdge , that the simple truth of the matter. However the GPU inside the STV-V and Saturn was SEGA and Unique to SEGA , and while boards like NA@MI II , Model 3 , used off the shelf CPU’s, their GPU were far from that (in NA@MI II case its (Geometry Processor). Panzer Dragoon Orta it is still one of the best looking X-Box games ever made , and all running at a near perfect 60 fps , not many games came close to Orta , it was pushing and using the X-Box to its fullest .
NCL started out a Card company , companines move on and Adapt , they just have too, what did SEGA start out as , becasue it wasn't Consumer or Arcade Videogames that's for sure.
The like of Id/Epic wouldn't lower them self to work on consoles a few years ago , so would many PC developers , now they're all on the next gen systems SEGA Needs to use all the best bits from its Arcade teams , and wake up to making game engines on PC's and then ported them down to consoles , and making far better use of Multi Thread CPU's , not just for this gen , but the next gen too
And as for the last part, I don't really like Mass Effect II , but its characters and in-game animation is way ahead for Yukuza's, never mind Heavy rain .
When one 1st saw Shemmue or to a point Yakuza 1 , it was Truly breath taking to see that many characters on screen and a world so detailed ,
But now we’re in age of GTA IV, Mass Effect II , Assassin's Creed II ECT , all witht Mass Open worlds , lovingly detailed , and populated with a huge number of characters . The teams just need to do far better , and really push the bar . Sonic Team will , to a point so can AM#2 , but the rest of the Consumer Teams really need to start using the power of the next gen far better , and push the PS3 or 360 as much as their Teams can push the like of Lindberg
And I 'll leave it at that
Nonsense what you are talking about with NCL have no bearing to this debate. What you are really saying is that Sega should sell out their principles and be like everyone else. Well sorry I and many others wouldn't want to see that happen. I like the fact that Sega can create different engines for different games. I like the fact that they could form a team just to work on one specific title in which you yourself have taken your username based on one of these small teams that benefited from this practice.And again Val and RGG3 and 4 do stand out as great looking PS3 titles.
And you better check your history again mate because Sega started out as an arcade games company they haven't differed from that. Only difference now is that arcades are electronic compared to the norm of what they were in the 50s and mid sixties. And don't use the hawaii link either because the company SEGA started with Rosen not with those other jerkoffs.
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There is nothing Custom SEGA tech inside either Lindberg or RingEdge , that the simple truth of the matter. However the GPU inside the STV-V and Saturn was SEGA and Unique to SEGA , and while boards like NA@MI II , Model 3 , used off the shelf CPU’s, their GPU were far from that (in NA@MI II case its (Geometry Processor). Panzer Dragoon Orta it is still one of the best looking X-Box games ever made , and all running at a near perfect 60 fps , not many games came close to Orta , it was pushing and using the X-Box to its fullest .
NCL started out a Card company , companines move on and Adapt , they just have too, what did SEGA start out as , becasue it wasn't Consumer or Arcade Videogames that's for sure.
The like of Id/Epic wouldn't lower them self to work on consoles a few years ago , so would many PC developers , now they're all on the next gen systems SEGA Needs to use all the best bits from its Arcade teams , and wake up to making game engines on PC's and then ported them down to consoles , and making far better use of Multi Thread CPU's , not just for this gen , but the next gen too
And as for the last part, I don't really like Mass Effect II , but its characters and in-game animation is way ahead for Yukuza's, never mind Heavy rain .
When one 1st saw Shemmue or to a point Yakuza 1 , it was Truly breath taking to see that many characters on screen and a world so detailed ,
But now we’re in age of GTA IV, Mass Effect II , Assassin's Creed II ECT , all witht Mass Open worlds , lovingly detailed , and populated with a huge number of characters . The teams just need to do far better , and really push the bar . Sonic Team will , to a point so can AM#2 , but the rest of the Consumer Teams really need to start using the power of the next gen far better , and push the PS3 or 360 as much as their Teams can push the like of Lindberg
And I 'll leave it at that
Well its not really fair to compare a narrow arcade game to a massive game like Yakuza 4. As beautiful as Let's Go Spice Island is, it is hardly as big a game as anything the consumer teams are pumping out.
You're comparing rail shooters to SRPGS and Adventure games. How the hell is that fair?
There is also the issue of time. Amusement Vision is pumping out relatively high quality high budget products every year, as well as the more and more mediocre Super Monkey Ball games. Sonic Team manages about a Sonic game every year now, plus a Phantasy Star game every two years, and the odd game like Billy Hatcher or NiGHTS about once every three or four.
These games, all of them (except PSU) were very rushed games, because frankly, Sega is biting off more than it can chew. Its release schedule is too damn frantic. The only team I see not overstepping itself, of the Consumer Divisions, is Overworks, who seems to have a pretty good balance. I really hope, though, they don't milk Valkyrie as much as they did Sakura Taisen, and turn a great series to shit.
In stark contrast, the AM teams are damn near lazy with their output. What has AM-2 really done this generation?
They've ported Virtual On to the X360, developed Virtua Fighter 5 and milked it for all its worth, barely remade Daytona, given us a Gundam ripoff and a mediocre looking Shining game. That's not exactly pushing the envelope TA. Oh, did AM-2 do Sega Race TV, or was that AMPlus? In either event, its hardly groundbreaking.
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There is nothing Custom SEGA tech inside either Lindberg or RingEdge , that the simple truth of the matter. However the GPU inside the STV-V and Saturn was SEGA and Unique to SEGA , and while boards like NA@MI II , Model 3 , used off the shelf CPU’s, their GPU were far from that (in NA@MI II case its (Geometry Processor). Panzer Dragoon Orta it is still one of the best looking X-Box games ever made , and all running at a near perfect 60 fps , not many games came close to Orta , it was pushing and using the X-Box to its fullest .
NCL started out a Card company , companines move on and Adapt , they just have too, what did SEGA start out as , becasue it wasn't Consumer or Arcade Videogames that's for sure.
The like of Id/Epic wouldn't lower them self to work on consoles a few years ago , so would many PC developers , now they're all on the next gen systems SEGA Needs to use all the best bits from its Arcade teams , and wake up to making game engines on PC's and then ported them down to consoles , and making far better use of Multi Thread CPU's , not just for this gen , but the next gen too
And as for the last part, I don't really like Mass Effect II , but its characters and in-game animation is way ahead for Yukuza's, never mind Heavy rain .
When one 1st saw Shemmue or to a point Yakuza 1 , it was Truly breath taking to see that many characters on screen and a world so detailed ,
But now we’re in age of GTA IV, Mass Effect II , Assassin's Creed II ECT , all witht Mass Open worlds , lovingly detailed , and populated with a huge number of characters . The teams just need to do far better , and really push the bar . Sonic Team will , to a point so can AM#2 , but the rest of the Consumer Teams really need to start using the power of the next gen far better , and push the PS3 or 360 as much as their Teams can push the like of Lindberg
And I 'll leave it at that
Well its not really fair to compare a narrow arcade game to a massive game like Yakuza 4. As beautiful as Let's Go Spice Island is, it is hardly as big a game as anything the consumer teams are pumping out.
You're comparing rail shooters to SRPGS and Adventure games. How the hell is that fair?
There is also the issue of time. Amusement Vision is pumping out relatively high quality high budget products every year, as well as the more and more mediocre Super Monkey Ball games. Sonic Team manages about a Sonic game every year now, plus a Phantasy Star game every two years, and the odd game like Billy Hatcher or NiGHTS about once every three or four.
These games, all of them (except PSU) were very rushed games, because frankly, Sega is biting off more than it can chew. Its release schedule is too damn frantic. The only team I see not overstepping itself, of the Consumer Divisions, is Overworks, who seems to have a pretty good balance. I really hope, though, they don't milk Valkyrie as much as they did Sakura Taisen, and turn a great series to shit.
In stark contrast, the AM teams are damn near lazy with their output. What has AM-2 really done this generation?
They've ported Virtual On to the X360, developed Virtua Fighter 5 and milked it for all its worth, barely remade Daytona, given us a Gundam ripoff and a mediocre looking Shining game. That's not exactly pushing the envelope TA. Oh, did AM-2 do Sega Race TV, or was that AMPlus? In either event, its hardly groundbreaking.
i think AM2 is doing great and still one of best studios out there
VF5 with all it's releases is still considered as the best fighter you could ever played
i wouldn't call Border Break as Gundam ripoff ! the game played totally different and it's Awesome for all i care + it was really challenging game for this team to make , the gameplay is just insane and fast (reminds me of Halo)
Shining Force Cross looks very colorful with really beautiful art designs , music is great and the game shaping to be the best game in the series since the saturn days , there is alot of uploaded gameplay videos in nico nico donga site that you can check it out for yourself .
also you skipped games like After Burner Climax , R-Tuned & Q of D VS
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I would also add that I don't think VF5 is 'milked to death', it's only recieved 2 updates so far, and they've both been very significant ones at that. They've had the revisions for balance changes and new content, but thats just showing excellent support, and fighting games need that more than most games.
Also, wasn't it AM3 that ported VOOT to XBLA? Maybe I'm wrong.
As for Sega Race TV, I think that was AM+ not AM2, but I'm not certain either.
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I would also add that I don't think VF5 is 'milked to death', it's only recieved 2 updates so far, and they've both been very significant ones at that. They've had the revisions for balance changes and new content, but thats just showing excellent support, and fighting games need that more than most games.
Also, wasn't it AM3 that ported VOOT to XBLA? Maybe I'm wrong.
As for Sega Race TV, I think that was AM+ not AM2, but I'm not certain either.
VOOT originally created by AM3 but the XBLA port handling was by AM2
and yes SEGA Race-TV is the only game released by AMplus so far
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I would also add that I don't think VF5 is 'milked to death', it's only recieved 2 updates so far, and they've both been very significant ones at that. They've had the revisions for balance changes and new content, but thats just showing excellent support, and fighting games need that more than most games.
Also, wasn't it AM3 that ported VOOT to XBLA? Maybe I'm wrong.
As for Sega Race TV, I think that was AM+ not AM2, but I'm not certain either.
VOOT originally created by AM3 but the XBLA port handling was by AM2
and yes SEGA Race-TV is the only game released by AMplus
Oh wow, I thought it was AM3 doing the porting. No wonder the port was fucking outstanding, it's by the Gods of Game Development!
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Well its not really fair to compare a narrow arcade game to a massive game like Yakuza 4. As beautiful as Let's Go Spice Island is, it is hardly as big a game as anything the consumer teams are pumping out.
You're comparing rail shooters to SRPGS and Adventure games. How the hell is that fair?
There is also the issue of time. Amusement Vision is pumping out relatively high quality high budget products every year, as well as the more and more mediocre Super Monkey Ball games. Sonic Team manages about a Sonic game every year now, plus a Phantasy Star game every two years, and the odd game like Billy Hatcher or NiGHTS about once every three or four.
These games, all of them (except PSU) were very rushed games, because frankly, Sega is biting off more than it can chew. Its release schedule is too damn frantic. The only team I see not overstepping itself, of the Consumer Divisions, is Overworks, who seems to have a pretty good balance. I really hope, though, they don't milk Valkyrie as much as they did Sakura Taisen, and turn a great series to shit.
In stark contrast, the AM teams are damn near lazy with their output. What has AM-2 really done this generation?
They've ported Virtual On to the X360, developed Virtua Fighter 5 and milked it for all its worth, barely remade Daytona, given us a Gundam ripoff and a mediocre looking Shining game. That's not exactly pushing the envelope TA. Oh, did AM-2 do Sega Race TV, or was that AMPlus? In either event, its hardly groundbreaking.
So you want to talk fairness ?. I don't think one can really square that one and compare Yakuza III/IV to AM#2 , when more staff work on a single Yakuza game , than work @ AM#2 in total , but whatever
As for Output what have New R&D (or what ever they called now) done this gen , 2 sub Bar Monkey Ball games , and 3 Yakuza games .
You want to to list the total number of Lindberg games and RingEdge games developed by AM#2 ?. I'm sure they've pumped just a bit more, and imo games graphically far better too .
SEGA Consumer Teams haven't been inthe same league Arcade Teams , and the consumer Teams can do shameless rip-off's too with Brain Assist (That's not really new :roll: ) and a poor update of NiGHTS , I don't think those game pushing the envelope.
Overworks and Sonic Team are the bright sparks left in the consumer ranks , but lets face it the only reason why Val hasn't been milked as much as Sukura , is because the game sold nowhere near as good
Also, wasn't it AM3 that ported VOOT to XBLA? Maybe I'm wrong
I don't think AM#3 have ever ported VO series to any home system
Nonsense what you are talking about with NCL have no bearing to this debate.
NCL did start out making cards , SONY didn't start out making consoles or games, same for MS, that's for sure . Like I say all companies change and adapt over the years
Sega should sell out their principles and be like everyone else
Sadly that is the SEGA of today , nothing new in their line up, nothing world leading in terms of tech either.
better check your history again mate because Sega started out as an arcade games company they haven't differed from that
They started out importing , didn't they . 'Video' Arcade games or Console games weren't quite around in the 50's . And Yakuza tech is massive outclassed by a number of tiles and more and more ones from other Japanese developers .
I will say the Tech for Canvas and Hedgehog is very impressive , especially the HedgeHog Tech . SEGA should make far better use of tech like that
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So you want to talk fairness ?. I don't think one can really square that one and compare Yakuza III/IV to AM#2 , when more staff work on a single Yakuza game , than work @ AM#2 in total , but whatever
So's what your point? You said the arcade teams are getting better support and then you just contridict yourself by saying that the Yakuza games had more staff IE more support IE more money spent on it which means that one of the consumer teams are getting support.
As for Output what have New R&D (or what ever they called now) done this gen , 2 sub Bar Monkey Ball games , and 3 Yakuza games .
You want to to list the total number of Lindberg games and RingEdge games developed by AM#2 ?. I'm sure they've pumped just a bit more, and imo games graphically far better too .
SEGA Consumer Teams haven't been inthe same league Arcade Teams , and the consumer Teams can do shameless rip-off's too with Brain Assist (That's not really new :roll: ) and a poor update of NiGHTS , I don't think those game pushing the envelope.
Brain assit and Brain Trainer was started by Sega in the first place. Nintendo was theone that "stole" the idea and made millions from it. NIGHTS was technically a western game since it was made under SOA via Sonic Team USA. And JB's right SFC is Quest Of D with new characters,BB is a rip off and VF has gone the cash in route while everything else is either a card game so they can sell cartoons and merchandise or some redemption game. There hasn't been a totally new IP from Sega arcade divisions for a long while now.
Overworks and Sonic Team are the bright sparks left in the consumer ranks , but lets face it the only reason why Val hasn't been milked as much as Sukura , is because the game sold nowhere near as good
Half a million sales isn't bad in anyone's book. And ST a bright spark? Now you are having a laugh.
NCL did start out making cards , SONY didn't start out making consoles or games, same for MS, that's for sure . Like I say all companies change and adapt over the years They started out importing , didn't they . 'Video' Arcade games or Console games weren't quite around in the 50's . And Yakuza tech is massive outclassed by a number of tiles and more and more ones from other Japanese developers .
I will say the Tech for Canvas and Hedgehog is very impressive , especially the HedgeHog Tech . SEGA should make far better use of tech like that
Rubbish. NCL Sony and MS didn't adapt they went into the games industry to cash in. MS and Sony still have their eggs in their core industries. Sega has ALWAYS been in the arcade game industry. Importing and retooling arcade games as well as creating new ones DURING the 50s.
Sega should sell out their principles and be like everyone else
Sadly that is the SEGA of today , nothing new in their line up, nothing world leading in terms of tech either.
That's always been Sega of yesterday and today. And you berate them for no tech yet you just praised Val. :roll:
And as for sega arcade hardware I guess you missed the boat on AURORA too. Again the LB and RE are not glorified PCs but Sega's spin of that tech. So just give it up.
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I'm saying SEGA Arcade teams make better use of the tech they're give to work on . the Arcade teams seem better able to use PC Tech and use of next gen shaders and HDR ECT , and John thinks If it’s not fair to compare Arcade games to Homes games, then it shouldn’t be fair to compare AM#2 to a Consumer product that was made with far more staff and much bigger budget .
I really don't know why you get this idea that SEGA came up with the brain training concept , because that will be a new one of a few people . And as for the Arcade teams milking , they're not different or worse than Consumer Teams . How many more versions of Monkey ball, Sonic, Sakura , Yakuza do you want ? , and what's Supestar's tennis , All Star Sonic racing , they're just Virtual Tennis , and Mario Kart in different clothing . I see nothing from the Consumer teams that's original then and a complete lack of anything that can be classed as new IP from the consumer Teams .
NCL Sony and MS didn't adapt they went into the games industry to cash in
That's no different from SEGA turning to 'Video' games to cash in, Videogames weren't massive when NCL started to turn to videogames either .
And as for sega arcade hardware I guess you missed the boat on AURORA too. Again the LB and RE are not glorified PCs but Sega's spin of that tech
What that Arcade boards that's hardly ever been used , and powered by PowerVR That' used in a host of other products like Mobiles ECT. I'm sorry there's no SEGA tech there
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I'm saying SEGA Arcade teams make better use of the tech they're give to work on . the Arcade teams seem better able to use PC Tech and use of next gen shaders and HDR ECT , and John thinks If it’s not fair to compare Arcade games to Homes games, then it shouldn’t be fair to compare AM#2 to a Consumer product that was made with far more staff and much bigger budget .
I really don't know why you get this idea that SEGA came up with the brain training concept , because that will be a new one of a few people . And as for the Arcade teams milking , they're not different or worse than Consumer Teams . How many more versions of Monkey ball, Sonic, Sakura , Yakuza do you want ? , and what's Supestar's tennis , All Star Sonic racing , they're just Virtual Tennis , and Mario Kart in different clothing . I see nothing from the Consumer teams that's original then and a complete lack of anything that can be classed as new IP from the consumer Teams .
NCL Sony and MS didn't adapt they went into the games industry to cash in
That's no different from SEGA turning to 'Video' games to cash in, Videogames weren't massive when NCL started to turn to videogames either .
And as for sega arcade hardware I guess you missed the boat on AURORA too. Again the LB and RE are not glorified PCs but Sega's spin of that tech
That Arcade boards that's hardly ever been used , and powered by PowerVR That' used in a host of other products like Mobiles ECT. I'm sorry there's no SEGA tech there[/quote]
And ST a bright spark? Now you are having a laugh
No I'm serious , They are too . Sonic Team are going to suprise a lot of people , they're a Team that's stating to get it , and put right a lot of wrongs
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SFC Ver.B official Trailer
[youtube:2m6d218b]adIw6JaXCWg[/youtube:2m6d218b]
I'm saying SEGA Arcade teams make better use of the tech they're give to work on . the Arcade teams seem better able to use PC Tech and use of next gen shaders and HDR ECT , and John thinks If it’s not fair to compare Arcade games to Homes games, then it shouldn’t be fair to compare AM#2 to a Consumer product that was made with far more staff and much bigger budget .
this .
AM2 knows well how to take advantage of any hardware they are working with .
just imagine them working on PS3 or 360 on a big-budget title !
but sadly SEGA will not give them another chance again after the failure of Shenmue :(
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That and, well, the arcade division is making more money than the consumer division :P
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Let me get drunk and I will respond in kind. However, let me begin by saying, of course the arcade games have better graphics. They are arcade games. They are more compact and generally aren't open ended at all. They are easier to make. Because they require less depth, they can make the games more shiny.
Aki- yeah, that's a giant surprise. How much does it cost to invest in, say Virtua Fighter, as opposed to Yakuza? And let's not forget that the arcade team's success is also generated at home. Virtua Fighter makes plenty of money on the consoles, where Yakuza isn't released in the arcade. The AM divisions can have their fingers in both pies. Also to consider, Sega has new sales every time they tweak Virtua Fighter or Quest of D. There isn't a Yakuza 3.1 C, or Yakuza 3 Evolution, or Yakuza 3 Online, or Yakuza 3 R.
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Aki- yeah, that's a giant surprise. How much does it cost to invest in, say Virtua Fighter, as opposed to Yakuza? And let's not forget that the arcade team's success is also generated at home. Virtua Fighter makes plenty of money on the consoles, where Yakuza isn't released in the arcade. The AM divisions can have their fingers in both pies. Also to consider, Sega has new sales every time they tweak Virtua Fighter or Quest of D. There isn't a Yakuza 3.1 C, or Yakuza 3 Evolution, or Yakuza 3 Online, or Yakuza 3 R.
You're telling me that even with a close to 6 million seller, another one that sold over a million and another title that sold over half that, SEGA's consumer division's profits is all going to Yakuza? It’s not, they have been downright terrible at trying to make a profit recently, even with a host of big sellers. Imagine in how much of a loss they would have been if they didn't have Mario & Sonic at the Winter Olympic Games to bail them out.
I would also like to know what arcade game that isn't Virtua Fighter has been brought to the console by SEGA recently? I'd also like to inform you it was not Virtua Fighter that spurred profit for SEGA's arcade divison, it was mainly the sales of Shining Force Cross and more significantly, Border Break, which is also a big budgeted arcade title.
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Shining Force Cross is a flop. Nobody is playing it. Sega forced their operators to buy it and else...
For information, Star Horse made way more money to Sega than Virtua Fighter 2 did at it's golden ages in 199?... can't remember the date ;P
Some key members of AM3 are now in AM2, since AM3 does not exists anymore, and they are the persons who done the convertion of Virtual-On to the XB360, not only AM2 members.
About Sega at AOU 2010, the fact is that this is one of the worst lineup ever on Sega's history, even when the titles looks fine and hot and still making money.
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Let me get drunk and I will respond in kind. However, let me begin by saying, of course the arcade games have better graphics. They are arcade games. They are more compact and generally aren't open ended at all. They are easier to make. Because they require less depth, they can make the games more shiny.
Yakuza isn't that much of a open ended game , and there's plenty of open ended games that feature far better graphics in game than Yakuza , So I'm not sure of that point . One could say Yakuza is nothing more than Shenmue in new clothing that AM#2 developed title, that while was about as open as Yakuza game world , featured some of the best graphics around , that many had seen at the time .
Mass Effect II , GTA IV , AC 1& II all feature better in game graphics than Yakuza III, and in GTA IV and AC case they're years old now
Some key members of AM3 are now in AM2, since AM3 does not exists anymore, and they are the persons who done the convertion of Virtual-On to the XB360, not only AM2 member
AM#3 are still around and have always worked with AM#2 on the Virtual On series, AM#2 are in VO II credits for example . Speaking of AM#2 and BD, Bordered Break Producer Shimoda-san , that lead the VO II port to LIVE Arcade .
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Aki- yeah, that's a giant surprise. How much does it cost to invest in, say Virtua Fighter, as opposed to Yakuza? And let's not forget that the arcade team's success is also generated at home. Virtua Fighter makes plenty of money on the consoles, where Yakuza isn't released in the arcade. The AM divisions can have their fingers in both pies. Also to consider, Sega has new sales every time they tweak Virtua Fighter or Quest of D. There isn't a Yakuza 3.1 C, or Yakuza 3 Evolution, or Yakuza 3 Online, or Yakuza 3 R.
You're telling me that even with a close to 6 million seller, another one that sold over a million and another title that sold over half that, SEGA's consumer division's profits is all going to Yakuza? It’s not, they have been downright terrible at trying to make a profit recently, even with a host of big sellers. Imagine in how much of a loss they would have been if they didn't have Mario & Sonic at the Winter Olympic Games to bail them out.
I would also like to know what arcade game that isn't Virtua Fighter has been brought to the console by SEGA recently? I'd also like to inform you it was not Virtua Fighter that spurred profit for SEGA's arcade divison, it was mainly the sales of Shining Force Cross and more significantly, Border Break, which is also a big budgeted arcade title.
Okay, I'm fucking drunk and ready to tango, bitch.
No, I'm not saying that. I am saying that consumer games cost a whole hell of a lot more to develop than some arcade game. Valkyrie of the Battlefield, Yakuza, all of those Sonic games, things like Phantasy Star Universe, all those shitty handheld games, the investment Sega makes into outside development games like Resonance of Fate, Bayonetta, Aliens Versus Predator, Alpha Protocol, Sonic Chronicles and so on. Three of those games are RPGs, and god knows they aren't cheap.
We also need to consider money spent on games that have yet to see the light of day (or never will) like the mysterious Silicon Knights game (their services probably cost a pretty goddamn penny to begin with, not to mention the actual cost of developing the game that never made money) or the Aliens RPG which must have cost a decent amount. Even supposing they only spent one hundred thousand dollars on the initial contract, that's one hundred thousand dollars never recouped because the game never came out. Then we have Fifth Phantom Saga.
Consumer games cost more. That's more or less the way it is. They all take up a bunch of money to develop. In some cases (Phantasy Star Universe, Golden Axe) even the long term profitable ones don't look that way on the sheets, because they don't manage to recoup those losses immediately. Things like rereleases and using the existing tech to make other games (PS Portable) help out in that regard, but the results aren't shown black and white on the balance sheet during a fiscal year.
Phantasy Star Universe was a big reason the Consumer Division lost money from about 2003 to about 2006, and when it came out in bombed hard. Three years of loss on the game was not recouped during fiscal year 2006, so it looks like a loss. In reality, Phantasy Star Universe made money over a longer period of time with things like the monthly charge, DLC (assuming it has some on the X360), as well as providing a very solid basis for two games that sold as well as the original.
Virtua Fighter is nothing to sneeze at and you know it, Aki. They made enough money off the arcades alone to cover the cost of porting the sonbitch to the consoles. So they practically printed money with its console release, and you can bet your ass they will again with some sort of Virtua Fighter 5R package that will come out.
Virtual On is another fine example. It sold fairly well and made plenty of money. They didn't even have to pay to advertise and press discs. AfterBurner will be the same way. OutRun 2 on the XBLA was probably counted as being from the arcade division on the balance sheets because the game is ultimately AM-2's. Ghost Squad would have been another cheap as hell port of an extremely popular arcade game that sold, what, 700,000 units? Hardly chump change.
As Storm so lovingly pointed out, SFC sold like shit.
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About Sega at AOU 2010, the fact is that this is one of the worst lineup ever on Sega's history, even when the titles looks fine and hot and still making money.
Nonsense...
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Let me get drunk and I will respond in kind. However, let me begin by saying, of course the arcade games have better graphics. They are arcade games. They are more compact and generally aren't open ended at all. They are easier to make. Because they require less depth, they can make the games more shiny.
Yakuza isn't that much of a open ended game , and there's plenty of open ended games that feature far better graphics in game than Yakuza , So I'm not sure of that point . One could say Yakuza is nothing more than Shenmue in new clothing that AM#2 developed title, that while was about as open as Yakuza game world , featured some of the best graphics around , that many had seen at the time .
Mass Effect II , GTA IV , AC 1& II all feature better in game graphics than Yakuza III, and in GTA IV and AC case they're years old now
Some key members of AM3 are now in AM2, since AM3 does not exists anymore, and they are the persons who done the convertion of Virtual-On to the XB360, not only AM2 member
AM#3 are still around and have always worked with AM#2 on the Virtual On series, AM#2 are in VO II credits for example . Speaking of AM#2 and BD, Bordered Break Producer Shimoda-san , that lead the VO II port to LIVE Arcade .
I'm comparing Yakuza to the efforts of the arcade divisions, which, by comparison, are shallow worlds with shiny graphics.
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I'm comparing Yakuza to the efforts of the arcade divisions, which, by comparison, are shallow worlds with shiny graphics.
Yakuza 3 isn't a patch on Shenmue II in my eye's :P . But I'll compare Yakuza 3 and SEGA Japan consumer games to efforts of other consumer games for other 3rd parties in the interest of fairness .
Tech wise , behind in many ways , Open world wise ? behind the times , Online ? again behind the times , New IP wise nothing really new there .
Good games wise , well its not really been brilliant this past year for SOJ , in my view, in fact its been shit .
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No, that wouldn't be fair. You were calling out the consumer division as compared to the arcade division. You said the consumer division can't push hardware while the arcade division can.
My point was that that isn't fair because the arcade division isn't making games nearly as elaborate, so obviously their products look better.
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No, that wouldn't be fair. You were calling out the consumer division as compared to the arcade division. You said the consumer division can't push hardware while the arcade division can.
My point was that that isn't fair because the arcade division isn't making games nearly as elaborate, so obviously their products look better.
Oh no worries I'll compare SEGA Consumer effort to their Arcade efforts anyday of the week , and its no contest gamewise or GFX wise , and AM dept have over the years made very Elaborate games , like with SEGA GT , Shenmue series of games , and they did features some great graphics too
I don't share your views on Elaborate games either . Monkey Step and Roll, Sonic VS Mario Winter elaborate games ?, yet they look really poor (in fact I say Monkey Ball II looks better), and Val II is hardly the best looking RPG on the PSP
Yakuza III isn't any more open than Shenmue , and nothing as open as the lastest Open RPG's like Mass Effect II, Fallout III , and yet In-Game its graphics are nowhere near as good as the likes of those, never mind GTA IV .
Don't tell me Yakuza IV will change all that , now with added weather effects and being able to fight and run on the Roof tops . Shame AM#2 did that years ago in Shenmue 1 and II .
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Jonboy you are missing the point. SEGA's arcade division made profit with two major releases only in Japan, SEGA's console division made less profit with three major console releases (Two worldwide) I'd also like to pointout, the arcade divison's financial breakdown are all on arcade sales, no console sales at all.
Take out Mario & Sonic's profits, which would probably fall into well over $150 million profit for SEGA, SEGA's consumer teams would not have been making any money if they did not have that behemoth applied to them you could imagine how much loss they would be in. The same should be applied in 2008 and 2009 when it was the original that spurred sales on in their consumer teams.
The consumer teams have SEGA's biggest brand, but complete mismanagement of the series has caused the series to receive three bombs, Sonic Chronicles, Sonic and the Black Knight and Sonic Unleashed.
As for consumer games costing a whole lot more, Sonic Unleashed doesn't even go past $15 million in budget and that's SEGA's biggest IP, wonder how cheap other games are. The only series that has had more money poured into it is the Yakuza series. Yes you can say "They have X" number of games coming out, but the simple fact is that most of their games miss the target from sales expectations, some (Sonic mainly, Golden Axe, Super Monkey Ball) through their quality and design.
As Storm so lovingly pointed out, SFC sold like shit.
No, it didn't. SEGA used their new method of payment to get operators to purchase it and it sold very well, selling over 2,000 units isn’t considered “shit”
You are also listening to the guy who is predicting Armageddon for the company.
Besides, the producer of Phantasy Star Portable 2 was expecting a million seller, so I can say that sold poorly too.
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Sold the machines and what!? Nobody is giving a shit for SFC...
In time, where the hell this is a Shining game? Where are the magicians? The centaurs? The beastmen? It's completely ridiculous.
And why this lineup is one of the worst? Because there are only sequels, titles from domestic market, licensed characters, updates, nothing new... there are nothing new!
On the kids games, Sega still losing for Pokemon and Dragon Quest, even after releasing a lot of nice titles like Gettenka. I hope the new Mushiking make some success, like before.
The Transformers game sounds promising too, but it's licensed product...
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Sold the machines and what!? Nobody is giving a shit for SFC...
Again that is not the point I was making.
Jonboy said the game sold like shit, this statement is incorrect because the game did not actually sell like shit, because it sold at least over 2,000 units. If users are not coming back to try the game is a completely different statement to make (And one I did not point out) but SEGA feels happy enough to make an update for the game so there is some indication of them being happy with the title.
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BB.TV Vol.008 ( Displaying Ver1.5 )
[youtube:1e36rla0]FQaKS7rCPHw[/youtube:1e36rla0]
i can see some new animations ! at 0:34 & 01:48
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I'm sure they are not happy with SFC; they are just trying to save the title, since they have "killed" Quest of D to shift it for SFC... but the users(almost from Quest of D) are not happy with SFC.
Don't need to say what the Shining series fans think about this title... ;p
Again, there is no AM3 anymore. There are only 2 AM departments: AM1 and AM2. Sega's President(Usui Okitane) is the "leader" of both teams himself; he is doing all the job cause he can do it.
The arcade market in Japan still falling down, sadly. Medals arcade games are the best way to make money nowadays... Sakura Taisen Pachinko machine(which is a medal arcade game) made more money than Dragon Quest 9 made for Square Enix ;p
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Are you turning into the new Cube?
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No, STORM is right. Shining Force Cross looks like a shitfest. I do not even know why they are calling it a Shining game... It has nothing related to the series in it. It should have just been Phantasy Star Arcade or something.
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No, STORM is right. Shining Force Cross looks like a shitfest. I do not even know why they are calling it a Shining game... It has nothing related to the series in it.
That shouldn't surprise you, the Shining Force name has been dragged through the mud so many times since SFIII I wouldn't be surprised if Aliens Vs Predator was released in Japan as Shining Force Pillow or something.
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No, STORM is right. Shining Force Cross looks like a shitfest. I do not even know why they are calling it a Shining game... It has nothing related to the series in it.
That shouldn't surprise you, the Shining Force name has been dragged through the mud so many times since SFIII I wouldn't be surprised if Aliens Vs Predator was released in Japan as Shining Force Pillow or something.
Aliens? GROSS! Shining is about cute naked boys that ride their swords like skateboards.
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While i think its pretty stupid that they called it Shining Force, game looks awesome on the AOU trailer.
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While i think its pretty stupid that they called it Shining Force, game looks awesome on the AOU trailer.
Agreed . The trouble for me is the use of 'Force', not so much Shining (shinning Wisdom played nothing like a Force game ECT) , but they again we had Shining 'Force' games on the PS2 , that play nothing like the Camelot 'Force' classics .
Game looks awesome , with lovely vibrate colourful graphics, great bosses and what seems a rock solid 60 fps . AM#2 are class
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While i think its pretty stupid that they called it Shining Force, game looks awesome on the AOU trailer.
Agreed . The trouble for me is the use of 'Force', not so much Shining (shinning Wisdom played nothing like a Force game ECT) , but they again we had Shining 'Force' games on the PS2 , that play nothing like the Camelot 'Force' classics .
Game looks awesome , with lovely vibrate colourful graphics, great bosses and what seems a rock solid 60 fps . AM#2 are class
can't agree more .
what matter is how good the game really is .
i don't care if it didn't capture the classical form of shining , neither the PS2 shitty games did . and it's not AM2's responsibility to do it in the first place .
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Why not just make a new series then? Seriously, it obviously looks nothing like the old Shining games, but it does not even look like the horrendous PlayStation 2 ones either. Where are the wolfmen, hawkmen, centaurs and men with big beards? Were there ever even any floating islands in a Shining game before?
I agree that the level art is great, fantastic even, but why must they change the franchise's style so much when they can just as easily call it a new franchise?!?
ARRRRGGGGGHHHH!!
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Game looks awesome , with lovely vibrate colourful graphics, great bosses and what seems a rock solid 60 fps . AM#2 are class
Hey not trying to be a dick, but I'm guessing you're foreign and English is a second language for ya. You're damn good enough at it that you really can't tell, but thought I'd give a tip and point out the word you're looking for is "vibrant" not "vibrate." :-)
Or...you knew that and it was just a typo and I look like a twatwaffle.
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I'm saying SEGA Arcade teams make better use of the tech they're give to work on . the Arcade teams seem better able to use PC Tech and use of next gen shaders and HDR ECT , and John thinks If it’s not fair to compare Arcade games to Homes games, then it shouldn’t be fair to compare AM#2 to a Consumer product that was made with far more staff and much bigger budget .
I really don't know why you get this idea that SEGA came up with the brain training concept , because that will be a new one of a few people . And as for the Arcade teams milking , they're not different or worse than Consumer Teams . How many more versions of Monkey ball, Sonic, Sakura , Yakuza do you want ? , and what's Supestar's tennis , All Star Sonic racing , they're just Virtual Tennis , and Mario Kart in different clothing . I see nothing from the Consumer teams that's original then and a complete lack of anything that can be classed as new IP from the consumer Teams .
Really? The fact sega with the help of the guy who originated the concept used in brain training made a toy based on it via sega toys which became a hit and came out a year and a half before nintendo's version? And don't tell me that nintendo was the first because it was a game, If Sega didn't do that brain training game nintendo wouldn't have bothered with making their own version of the game AND bringing the creator to endorse it. In the last three years now, Sega has done nothing but updates with a few new titles on top. This is actually the worst lineup at an AOU in recent memory. Look at the games. Dominated by redemption machines but we'll leave that out, We have a few gambling games like Arabian jewel,several games that's only designed to get little boys and girls to part with their cash on cards toys and watch the cartoons. And none of them are pushing the hardware that they use since they're don't use lindbergh. And if they are using lindbergh that contradicts everything you've been saying about the arcade teams are leading the way.
We have one new light gun game, We have a sequel to a previous light gun game, and a bunch of revisions plus a spin off which is exactly like the game its spinning off from except this time its set in fuedal japan and not based on the romance of three kingdom storyline.
The arcade division has actually gone into decline creativily while the consumer division have actually been revitilised and coming out with some strong software. We are also seeing sega reemerge as a strong publisher with games coming out from some great studios from thwe west and the east. The arcade division has not come out with a great engine in years now nor have they come out with a balls to the walls arcade game like they use to. So your stance that the consumer division is suffering is laughable when the opposite seems to be happening. Your attack on Yakuza is to do with your dislike of nagoshi and nothing more. At the moment the consumer division are now coming out with the games that sega fans want to play. The arcade division was wowing people five years ago. Now the reverse is happening. They've become exactly what the consumer division was doing lacking great AAA titles and suronding themselves with strictly japanese type games during the PS2/xbox/GBA era.
NCL Sony and MS didn't adapt they went into the games industry to cash in
That's no different from SEGA turning to 'Video' games to cash in, Videogames weren't massive when NCL started to turn to videogames either .
Apart from Sega was always in the arcade games buisness, the others weren't. Try again,next time harder.
That Arcade boards that's hardly ever been used , and powered by PowerVR That' used in a host of other products like Mobiles ECT. I'm sorry there's no SEGA tech there
I guess you should have told the new mushi King and whatever title are called that. And auora is technically the last sega customised board with sammy's participation.
And ST a bright spark? Now you are having a laugh
No I'm serious , They are too . Sonic Team are going to suprise a lot of people , they're a Team that's stating to get it , and put right a lot of wrongs
No they are not. when will you learn that a proposed great game doesn't mean the team is a great spark. Until they can come out with a dozen great games then i'll be more inclined to agree with you.
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The fact sega with the help of the guy who originated the concept used in brain training made a toy based on it via sega toys which became a hit and came out a year and a half before nintendo's version? And don't tell me that nintendo was the first because it was a game
News to me , and why didn't SEGA make a game out of it then , before NCL? Also I'll never ever say NCL were the 1st , they were quite a few on the PC , I' sure some on the CDI too, years ago . NCL made it work , and made it into a Phenomenon. For that I've got to give them credit (and that hurts btw) .
This is actually the worst lineup at an AOU in recent memory. Look at the games
I am , and it looks sheer class , and SEGA best showing in the Arcades since the launch of Lindberg
And if they are using lindbergh that contradicts everything you've been saying about the arcade teams are leading the way.
How ? its PC tech in every shape way and form . Its also vastly out powered, by the likes of 360 and the PS3 (christ shake, its a Mid range Pentium 4 , with a GeForce 6 card ) . Yet VS fighters developed from the ground up, for the 360 (DOA IV) or PS3 (Tekken 6) don't look as good as VF 5 imo , never mind when VF 5 Final ships .
That's the sheer class of AM#2 , and there's never been a better character model than Eileen in any Vs 3D Fighter imo
[youtube:356f598r]tgzZV7_zwfk[/youtube:356f598r]
Playing that make me so proud of the AM#2 , they're just a class above the rest.
We have one new light gun game, We have a sequel to a previous light gun game
Yeah and they all look class , and imo the likes of Too Spicy took Gun Games to a new level . That game is a class act
The arcade division has actually gone into decline creativily while the consumer division have actually been revitilised and coming out with some strong software
What new IP have we had from SEGA R&D Consumer Teams ? this generation . 2 sequels to Yakuza , and 1 Spin off ,4 Sonic Games (never mind the HH versions) , and 1 new IP in Val, 2 Monkey Ball sequels . I'm not really seeing much new there at all .
Maybe if one includes the likes of Project Rub or some of the other IP for HH. Well the Arcade teams have also tried new stuff like with the likes of Block Pipo. Which is quite anylike any Arcade game I 've seen before .
Your attack on Yakuza is to do with your dislike of nagoshi and nothing more
Do I praise the 1st two Moneyball games ?, Do I love SpikeOut ? , do I love and rate the 1st two Yakuza games ?
I think the answer is a Big YES to all , and all games where Nagoshi-san was Producer .
My trouble with Yakuza on the next gen, is the series is being run into the ground , with yearly updates and very poor tech - given the spend and size of the Teams that make the games , I expect better
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How ? its PC tech in every shape way and form . Its also vastly out powered, by the likes of 360 and the PS3 (christ shake, its a Mid range Pentium 4 , with a GeForce 6 card ) . Yet VS fighters developed from the ground up, for the 360 (DOA IV) or PS3 (Tekken 6) don't look as good as VF 5 imo , never mind when VF 5 Final ships .
That's the sheer class of AM#2 , and there's never been a better character model than Eileen in any Vs 3D Fighter imo
EXACTLY! AM2 did a phenomenal work with what it could be possible within the Lindbergh specs .
and the funny thing is as you said VF5 with all it's entries puts other fighting games to shame .
Do I praise the 1st two Moneyball games ?, Do I love SpikeOut ? , do I love and rate the 1st two Yakuza games ?
I think the answer is a Big YES to all , and all games where Nagoshi-san was Producer .
My trouble with Yakuza on the next gen, is the series is being run into the ground , with yearly updates and very poor tech - given the spend and size of the Teams that make the games , I expect better
i don't hate Yakuza but you are right , i started to feel the same .
games like Yakuza shouldn't be a yearly product , it's not some sports games or something ! they need at least two years to make some significant changes , engine and gameplay wise .
but right now the franchise is suffering from been old & the same thing all over again year after another .
some small changes will make me happy , but not enough happy .
time by time i may lose any interest I've had for this franchise .
also a team like this with one of the best talents within the company should puts in a good use , 5 Years and 5 RGG Games ? Really ?
but i am hoping that they didn't waste 5 years without some new IP's in progress at least .
so i still have hopes for this year that we may see something inserting and fresh form them .
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News to me , and why didn't SEGA make a game out of it then , before NCL? Also I'll never ever say NCL were the 1st , they were quite a few on the PC , I' sure some on the CDI too, years ago . NCL made it work , and made it into a Phenomenon. For that I've got to give them credit (and that hurts btw) .
Yawn, none of those games was based on Kawashima concept. Sega toys version is based on the actual device he created and it was a hit. Not that you'd know anything about since your history is very patchty when it comes to Sega. The Sega toy version was a hit, all nintendo did was build on that and release it on a popular machine which was a hit worldwide. And as for your last question? Really, You can say that on a lot of things on why didn't Sega do this or that.
This is actually the worst lineup at an AOU in recent memory. Look at the games
I am , and it looks sheer class , and SEGA best showing in the Arcades since the launch of Lindberg
No it doesn't. You are only intrested in that Let's go island game. The majority of the games at that show are kid games using underpowered boards and glorified fruit machines.
And if they are using lindbergh that contradicts everything you've been saying about the arcade teams are leading the way.
How ? its PC tech in every shape way and form . Its also vastly out powered, by the likes of 360 and the PS3 (christ shake, its a Mid range Pentium 4 , with a GeForce 6 card ) . Yet VS fighters developed from the ground up, for the 360 (DOA IV) or PS3 (Tekken 6) don't look as good as VF 5 imo , never mind when VF 5 Final ships .
That's the sheer class of AM#2 , and there's never been a better character model than Eileen in any Vs 3D Fighter imo
If you're going to answer someone's post don't bypass the question with an answer that had nothing really to do with the question. Again, one more time games like Arabian Jewel looks so wow doesn't it. :roll: And so does those girl dancing games and project diva. You've lost the debate mate, give it up. Pointing out three traditional arcade Sega games does not vindicate the dozen or so games that are using underpowered boards like the quiz titles and kiddie stuff and the others which are hardly pushing the lindbergh at all because they're simple revisions. Sorry but no arcade gamer thinks this is Sega's best line up.
The arcade division has actually gone into decline creativily while the consumer division have actually been revitilised and coming out with some strong software
What new IP have we had from SEGA R&D Consumer Teams ? this generation . 2 sequels to Yakuza , and 1 Spin off ,4 Sonic Games (never mind the HH versions) , and 1 new IP in Val, 2 Monkey Ball sequels . I'm not really seeing much new there at all .
Maybe if one includes the likes of Project Rub or some of the other IP for HH. Well the Arcade teams have also tried new stuff like with the likes of Block Pipo. Which is quite anylike any Arcade game I 've seen before .
Yet the consumer division has come up with new game engines.
what new engine has the arcades actually created this gen? NONE! And wait what new IP have the arcades come up with huh? At least the games be they sequels are something new and not a rehash of the same game released a year ago which the arcade division are the most guilty of.
Do I praise the 1st two Moneyball games ?, Do I love SpikeOut ? , do I love and rate the 1st two Yakuza games ?
I think the answer is a Big YES to all , and all games where Nagoshi-san was Producer .
My trouble with Yakuza on the next gen, is the series is being run into the ground , with yearly updates and very poor tech - given the spend and size of the Teams that make the games , I expect better
Yearly updates? Don't make me laugh, this is the only new sequel that's appeared this gen after 3, RGGKENZEN was a spin off. And don't bother covering your dislike for nagoshi since you've made it clear on more than one occassion. If anybody been running anything to the ground was sonic team and Naka during his tenure and you didn't hardly criticise them on that. now all of a sudden you're trying to make out that Yakuza is being run into the ground?
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none of those games was based on
Kawashima concept. Sega toys version is based on the actual device he created and it was a hit.
SIGH.... I’m simply pointing out that the concept of brain training games isn’t new, I seem to remember a few of the BBC Micro for starters . If SEGA did make a Brain Training game before 2005, then Kudos to SEGA
Shame they didn’t see the potential , before NCL to make take it to the consumer teams for the HH and made into the phenomenon it became with NCL , that is a lot of money that could have been SEGA’s.
Again, one more time games like Arabian Jewel looks so wow doesn't it. And so does those girl dancing games and project diva. You've lost the debate mate, give it up. Pointing out three traditional arcade Sega games does not vindicate the dozen or so games that are using underpowered boards like the quiz titles and kiddie stuff and the others which are hardly pushing the lindbergh at all because they're simple revisions. Sorry but no arcade gamer thinks this is Sega's best line up.
1st off, I could point out that even RingWide is far more powerful than the Wii or PSP , which SEGA consumer Teams of late, like to use ,and what isn’t kiddy about Monkeyball Blitz , or step & Roll , both of whoch are hardly using Cutting Edge tech.
I could also point, that the likes of Jewel , is SEGA keeping its Arcade mechanical and Video Arcade games Heritage alive, which you seem to be so proud of ?. Never mind that , SAMMY which you support , own's SEGA, is a bloody Pachinko and Slot machine company :roll: .
Yet the consumer division has come up with new game engines.
I’ll hazard a guess , and say that VF 5 is running on a different engine to R Tuned Street Racing, that Virtual Tennis 3, is running on a Different engine, to Lets Go Jungle , that Too Spicy, is running on a different engine, to Race TV and I really could go on .
Only to say that... I couldn’t careless, if a same engine is used , as long as the tech behind that engine is great , for eample... I’ve no problem with a same engine powering AC & Prince of Perisa, or the same engine powering Resident Evil 5 & Lost Planet II , I want SEGA to share its best engines , always have since the Saturn days . Now I’ll just say that SEGA Arcade Teams , are doing a great Job of making great engines , for not the most powerful hardware in the world .
Yearly updates? Don't make me laugh, this is the only new sequel that's appeared this gen after 3, RGGKENZEN was a spin off. And don't bother covering your dislike for nagoshi since you've made it clear on more than one occassion. If anybody been running anything to the ground was sonic team and Naka during his tenure and you didn't hardly criticise them on that. now all of a sudden you're trying to make out that Yakuza is being run into the groud
I don’t know why I bother , I really don’t . I’ve already said and made the distinction one was a Spin off, ok? Just all means post me the dates that Yakuza Kenzan shipped in Japan , when Yakua III shipped in Japan , and when Yakuza IV is to ship in Japan . If that’s not yearly updates I don’t know what is .At least the games be they sequels are something new and not a rehash of the same game released a year ago which the arcade division are the most guilty of.
No it doesn't. You are only intrested in that Let's go island game.
????. What’s really new about Monkeyball Blitz, or Step and Roll, what really new about the new Yakuza games ?. Nothing much new there , and it’s not like in 1999, AM#2 didn’t make its own Yakuza game . You strip the game to its bare bones , and the gameplay is pretty much the same , even down to being able to play games in the Arcades .
What brand new IP have we got from the consumer Teams ?
You ‘ve no idea what games I’m looking forward, because you’ve mentioned hardly any of them .But if you ‘must’ know, I think Both Border Break , Lets Go Island look brilliant , VF 5 Final looks simply class, I’m loving the style and charm of both Shining Cross and Gunman Medal . On the Consumer side from R&D Japan , I'm looking forward to AfterBurner & Sonic on LIVE Arcade .
Oh and no I don't like Nagoshi-san , but that doesn't stop one from praising a person or company . I dislike NCL with a passion , not a fan of Shigeru Miyamoto at all. I've always praised the Mario games though , and hold Mario IV up as sheer gaming perfection, just like Galaxy .
I love Moneyball & SpikeOut too , in fact I was playing Spikeout just the other night on LIVE (both Nagoshi-san productions) . That's the difference , with me, I'll give credit where it's due , even if I don't like the company or Team
Now unless you're willing to debates the points fairly ,I'll not bother to respond to your post & and bad twists
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SIGH.... I’m simply pointing out that the concept of brain training games isn’t new, I seem to remember a few of the BBC Micro for starters . If SEGA did make a Brain Training game before 2005, then Kudos to SEGA
Shame they didn’t see the potential , before NCL to make take it to the consumer teams for the HH and made into the phenomenon it became with NCL , that is a lot of money that could have been SEGA’s.
Nobody said it was new concept,I was talking about a specific version. You're the one who had to try and spin it and make it look like you know what you were talking about when It has no bearing in the discussion at all. You were just showing off as usual.
1st off, I could point out that even RingWide is far more powerful than the Wii or PSP , which SEGA consumer Teams of late, like to use ,and what isn’t kiddy about Monkeyball Blitz , or step & Roll , both of whoch are hardly using Cutting Edge tech.
SMB is more of a game anyone could play, a kid or adult could play it. Sonic is the same. Lilipri Yubi Puru Hime Chen,Mushi King, Dinosaur king and the like however are specifically aimed at children, like RGG is aimed at adults and so on and so on. Not really much on variety since these card games are dominating now.
I could also point, that the likes of Jewel , is SEGA keeping its Arcade mechanical and Video Arcade games Heritage alive, which you seem to be so proud of ?. Never mind that , SAMMY which you support , own's SEGA, is a bloody Pachinko and Slot machine company :roll:
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Yeah you'd be right if we were talking about UFO Catcher but since Arbian Jewel, Ami no and a few others use video screen graphics its hardly mindblowing tech that's been used to create them, just like the card titles. Something i have been saying all along. But of course you have to sideline the issue with me and others who happento disagree with you. And I never supported Sammy either so grow up. But the deal that happened hasn't been all bad for Sega which is all i care about really.
I’ll hazard a guess , and say that VF 5 is running on a different engine to R Tuned Street Racing, that Virtual Tennis 3, is running on a Different engine, to Lets Go Jungle , that Too Spicy, is running on a different engine, to Race TV and I really could go on .
The VF5 engine came out nearly four years ago now. VT3 the same and most of the titles you have named are the same too,the revisions are all based on an existing engine. So try again.
Only to say that... I couldn’t careless, if a same engine is used , as long as the tech behind that engine is great , for eample... I’ve no problem with a same engine powering AC & Prince of Perisa, or the same engine powering Resident Evil 5 & Lost Planet II , I want SEGA to share its best engines , always have since the Saturn days . Now I’ll just say that SEGA Arcade Teams , are doing a great Job of making great engines , for not the most powerful hardware in the world .
No what you want is sega to stop being unique.You keep praising terible titles like RE5 and LP2 and want Sega to do that style. You keep comparing Heavy Rain as an example when all i see from that is a rip of Shenmue. Just like when GTA moved to 3D and did the same. I don't want sega reduced to that level. if anyone should be creating these type of games however it should be Sega west. Just like the old SOA use to do by creating some of the best western made video games on console, sega west should be trying to get the best ideas,the innovative programmers and game designs and so forth to at least get to that standing of what the old SOA and later SOE houses did. At the moment through unforseen circumstances like the cancellations of a few titles and just lack of ideas and real talent they have yet to do so.
???. What’s really new about Monkeyball Blitz, or Step and Roll, what really new about the new Yakuza games ?. Nothing much new there , and it’s not like in 1999, AM#2 didn’t make its own Yakuza game . You strip the game to its bare bones , and the gameplay is pretty much the same , even down to being able to play games in the Arcades .
What brand new IP have we got from the consumer Teams ?
You ‘ve no idea what games I’m looking forward, because you’ve mentioned hardly any of them .But if you ‘must’ know, I think Both Border Break , Lets Go Island look brilliant , VF 5 Final looks simply class, I’m loving the style and charm of both Shining Cross and Gunman Medal . On the Consumer side from R&D Japan , I'm looking forward to AfterBurner & Sonic on LIVE Arcade
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Yet you failed misarably to porvide any significant IP from the arcades as well. I've been saying that the consumer teams are coming out with better games and better engines and techniques than the arcade division at the moment. This is a fact. Your all fave Ueda or whatever his name is seems to be getting things done as well. Sega shouldn't sell out their principles just to satisfy a so called sega gamer who basically wants them to be a glorified PC developer making carp like HR. As for RGG, if SHENMUE had been more succesful we would have gotten the same treatment, the difference being RGG is more open ended and not a game with a definate end unless thy try to spin it off. so criticising the game on that front is rather silly.
Yawn on the point of the discussion we were talking about what was on show on AOU and i do know what titles you were looking forward to because you've mentioned it before. Borderbreak came out over a year ago this is a revision of the same game. It shows no difference graphically or GP wise to the first one and in my opinion is complete carp to the gundam game its ripping off. LGI i'll give you looks good, but most ride games are meant to look good. Lost world another ride game also looked impressive. Shining Cross and VF5 again are simple revisions. I actually want a new game of VF ,you know like they use to do and not simply releasing a new version of the same board month after month. This is not sega's best AOU not by a long shot. Anyone who regularly goes on the arcades can attest to that. Unlike you.
Oh and no I don't like Nagoshi-san , but that doesn't stop one from praising a person or company . I dislike NCL with a passion , not a fan of Shigeru Miyamoto at all. I've always praised the Mario games though , and hold Mario IV up as sheer gaming perfection, just like Galaxy .
I love Moneyball & SpikeOut too , in fact I was playing Spikeout just the other night on LIVE (both Nagoshi-san productions) . That's the difference , with me, I'll give credit where it's due , even if I don't like the company or Team
TA you were involved in a massive debate in the last forum when you blatantly slagged off Nagoshi and unfairly criticised his games. as far as i remember you consider this more Smilebit's game than anything else as well. And if that last remark is directed at me then you know that isn't true since i praised Naka's last title for the Wii. The difference with me is i don't try to make one certain programmer greater and more important than he really is.
Now unless you're willing to debates the points fairly ,I'll not bother to respond to your post & and bad twists
Repeat what i said and put it into your own words huh? :lol: How sad.
I'm not the one whose been twisting or bringing in things that isn't true and i dealt with you more than fairly. You're the one who replied to me, I didn't and wasn't originally talking to you in the first place as anyone can check.
Got it, get it, good.
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Sold the machines and what!? Nobody is giving a shit for SFC...
Again that is not the point I was making.
Jonboy said the game sold like shit, this statement is incorrect because the game did not actually sell like shit, because it sold at least over 2,000 units. If users are not coming back to try the game is a completely different statement to make (And one I did not point out) but SEGA feels happy enough to make an update for the game so there is some indication of them being happy with the title.
2 000 isn't great either and definatly not a big hit compared to other Sega arcade sales. Compare that number to the level of arcade centres in the cities alone and that's not even covering 10 percent.
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Why not just make a new series then? Seriously, it obviously looks nothing like the old Shining games, but it does not even look like the horrendous PlayStation 2 ones either. Where are the wolfmen, hawkmen, centaurs and men with big beards? Were there ever even any floating islands in a Shining game before?
I agree that the level art is great, fantastic even, but why must they change the franchise's style so much when they can just as easily call it a new franchise?!?
ARRRRGGGGGHHHH!!
At least you've got SFG to look forward to. :lol:
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Right for the last time , I'll try and address your points openly and Honestly . Please when or if you respond , do the same .
I was talking about a specific version. You're the one who had to try and spin it and make it look like you know what you were talking about when I
? I Admitted I didn’t know about the SEGA version - how one can square that , with trying to make out, one knows what he is talking about , I do not know .
I’ll ....say again , if SEGA Toys did make the game before NCL did in 2005, then Kudos to SEGA. Shame they didn’t take the Concept , to the Consumer R&D Labs like NCL and make a game out of it , because that couldn’t have been a Potful of money for SEGA instead of NCL.
SMB is more of a game anyone could play, a kid or adult could play it. Sonic is the same.
To make out this isn't
(http://http://wpcontent.answers.com/wikipedia/en/0/09/Monkey_Ball_Wii.JPG)
Isn't Aimed at kids , defies believe , and like Nagoshi-san said in his EDGE column , Monkey ball was ported to the Cube , due to the NCL userbase being more for children , fitting with the games “cute” image and that the game was “targeted to a younger audience”.
Now there's a lack of new IP coming from the Consumer labs , and you know it .
And I never supported Sammy either so grow up.
So you don't like Sammy ?, I take it Hajime Satomi isn't the man to sort SEGA out ? . Great if so , I agree with you .
The VF5 engine came out nearly four years ago now. VT3 the same and most of the titles you have named are the same too,the revisions are all based on an existing engine
So te Arcade teams don't share or use each other's engines then ?, and How old is the Kenzan engine now ?, Why is it ok for the Yakuza Team, to re-use their engine twice now , but not for the VF 5 team?No what you want is sega to stop being unique
They're doing a great job of that now , not much unique in both SEGA Consumer or Arcade line-up . I couldn't careless as long as it's good.
You keep praising terible titles like RE5 and LP2 and want Sega to do that style. You keep comparing Heavy Rain as an example when all i see from that is a rip of Shenmue. Just like when GTA moved to 3D and did the same. I don't want sega reduced to that level.
This is where you fall down . For starters Yakuza shares a lot on common with Shenmue , nothing much new there , I've not played LP II (the full game, for a good reason) I am though, deeply impressed with its engine , use of On-Line , and planned features
I've brought up Heavy Rain once , maybe twice (so hardly keeping on bringing the title Up) and if you think its a Shenmue rip-off, then you clearly haven't played the game .It plays nothing like Shenmue at all , the controls (bar the rip-off QTE's , also used in Yakuza) and gameplay is quite , quite different , more like Fahrenheit. Quantic Dream Omikron shipped before Shenmmue, and was one the 1st games to usher in worlds living worlds populated with NCP's .
Yet you failed misarably to porvide any significant IP from the arcades as well
That isn't my problem with the Consumer or Arcade teams , You're the one that keeps on saying nothing new from the Arcade Teams . I'm simply pointing out , there's nothing much new form the Consumer Teams either .
Your all fave Ueda or whatever his name is seems to be getting things done as well
So the man that likes no have a go at people for any lack of SEGA Knowledge , doesn't know Ueda-san 1st name . Tut ,tut .
Sega shouldn't sell out their principles just to satisfy a so called sega gamer who basically wants them to be a glorified PC developer
Then what SEGA are doing working onthe PC Tech based consoles that is the 360 and PS3 I do not know .
As for RGG, if SHENMUE had been more succesful we would have gotten the same treatment, the difference being RGG is more open ended
Yakuza isn't more opened ended at all , you can't go anywhere in game map , anytime you want to , just like Shenmue , and nothing compared to a vast open world like in Fallout III , and after Shenmue the Yakuza experience isn't that new at all. Like I say , AM#2 are class
Borderbreak came out over a year ago this is a revision of the same game. It shows no difference graphically or GP wise to the first one
Kind of like the deal with Yakuza games then ?.
blatantly slagged off Nagoshi and unfairly criticised his games
I don't like the man , I don't think he's fit to lead the Consumer Teams . I so wish it was Yu Suzuki or more so , Masayoshi Kikuchi. But that won't , or doesn't stop me praising games Nagoshi-san have worked on, and there's not many praising SpikeOut on the X-Box ,and no it wasn't a Smilebit game , it was in development long before Smilebit joined AV , and Monkeyball had nothing to do with any of the Smilebit team .
The difference with me is i don't try to make one certain programmer greater and more important than he really is.
Sigh.. I totally look up to and respect Naka for his programing Skills. For which, I think he was one of the best ever at SOJ. His PS engine onthe Master System and Sonic Mega Drive engine took the piss , and the NiGHTS engine was incredible .
No different from how I admire and respect the likes of Dave Perry for his Mega Drive game engines, John O'Brien for his Mega CD engines , or Geoff Crammond for his stunning engines on the Amiga and PC.
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You're all sounding like a bunch of Sega Nerds!!!
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I'm going to be away from my computer for about a week, but I'm going to jump back into this argument when I get the chance. I don't care how man pages back.