SEGAbits Forums
Gaming => General Gaming Discussion => Topic started by: Aki-at on May 22, 2013, 01:34:24 pm
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E3 is only three weeks away and SEGA finds itself with the second biggest booth for a Japanese third party and sixth overall. Full E3 floor plan is below;
(http://www.abload.de/img/southhalli2uqe.jpg)
(http://www.abload.de/img/westhalltsuzm.jpg)
We still have no confirmation of what games are going to be there but we should be looking at Sonic Lost World and possibly Creative Assembly's Alien title.
For reference, SEGA's E3 last year had this line up;
- Aliens: Colonial Marines
- The Cave
- Hell Yeah! Wrath of the Dead Rabbit
- Jet Set Radio
- Sonic & All-Stars Racing Transformed
- Super Monkey Ball: Banana Splitz
- Virtua Fighter 5: Final Showdown
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Thanks for the post. Wow, Sega's got a bigger booth than Capcom and Konami. SE's got the biggest one, which one might expect.
It's also funny how Nintendo and Sony's booths mirror each other.
Ugh, I would love to check out E3 some time. Atlus, Tecmo-Koei, XSEED, Capcom, and...this company called Sega, would be nice to see the booths, if only for one day. The problem is no one here has titles I'm super looking forward to and Namco's MIA, but I'm sure I could make a day of it. Assuming of course, that a mere civilian like me would be allowed in to E3.
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Really hoping for:
PSO2
Aliens game from CA
Sonic Lost World 3DS and Wii U
Mickey Castle of Illusion
Shenmue HD
Skies of Arcadia HD
Mystery console title
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Seeing how little games SEGA has announced right now, I guess they'll either focus a lot of Sonic Lost World or announce more big games at E3.
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I was just talking about this on the Retro chat. Why doesn't SEGA release a summer collection of Sonic titles on Wii U? Like Sony does HD Remasters for their games all the times and they sell well. Why not release a Sonic the Hedgehog HD Remaster collection on Wii U with Sonic Adventure DX, Sonic Adventure 2 Battle and Sonic Heroes?
I mean, they are already ported on PC/360/PS3 (Adventure games).
Outside of that I would like to see more Dreamcast classics and maybe some more Whitehead ports being announced (mainly Streets of Rage 2).
Def would love to see the Aliens game by Creative Assembly, but I rather see more of the Warhammer game. I love the Warhammer universe, so that would be awesome.
This might be weird but the developer 38 Studios is selling their franchise Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning assets to keep on functioning. I think SEGA should just buy the whole studio. The game was actually fun but repetitive. I think with more time, money, and focus the team could create a huge AAA game that could be a big hit that SEGA is looking for in the West.
I would love that if SEGA chances stances on what they release in the west and that they will be focused on releasing quality games by big names in Japan. 7th Dragon will never sell in the US, but it would be nice if the team got together with a bigger vision for 3DS games that appeal to everyone.
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I was just talking about this on the Retro chat. Why doesn't SEGA release a summer collection of Sonic titles on Wii U? Like Sony does HD Remasters for their games all the times and they sell well. Why not release a Sonic the Hedgehog HD Remaster collection on Wii U with Sonic Adventure DX, Sonic Adventure 2 Battle and Sonic Heroes?
I mean, they are already ported on PC/360/PS3 (Adventure games).
Because Sonic Adventure 1 and 2 are really the only games people want, and like you said they already have HD ports. (well, I suppose you can't really call the first Adventure port HD) People didn't really like Heroes and Shadow the Hedgehog, it's more likely that they'll do another Dreamcast Collection-type thing.
Outside of that I would like to see more Dreamcast classics and maybe some more Whitehead ports being announced (mainly Streets of Rage 2).
Agreed, the ports don't really seem that hard to do so they can do those to make a quick and easy buck.
Def would love to see the Aliens game by Creative Assembly, but I rather see more of the Warhammer game. I love the Warhammer universe, so that would be awesome.
It seems pretty likely that the Alien game will be revealed at E3, as it's apparently going to be for both curren-gen and next-gen consoles. (http://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming/creative-assemblys-alien-emerges-showing-that-sega-will-hold-onto-the-troubled-franchise/)
This might be weird but the developer 38 Studios is selling their franchise Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning assets to keep on functioning. I think SEGA should just buy the whole studio. The game was actually fun but repetitive. I think with more time, money, and focus the team could create a huge AAA game that could be a big hit that SEGA is looking for in the West.
I'm not sure if this would be financial suicide or not. :V
I would love that if SEGA chances stances on what they release in the west and that they will be focused on releasing quality games by big names in Japan. 7th Dragon will never sell in the US, but it would be nice if the team got together with a bigger vision for 3DS games that appeal to everyone.
I wouldn't mind it if they just released these games digitally with subtitles or something.
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I reckon they are saving up their announcements till the day before E3...
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@ TimmiT, Yeah I was talking about a disc based release with 3 games: Sonic Adventure 1/2 and Heroes. Skip Shadow the Hedgehog. Even though I didn't like heroes (and much of the 2nd Adventure game, especially the later part) I think there are enough fans that will buy it. I have seen a few people here like the Heroes titles. As long as there is people with money, I don't see the harm.
Especially if Adventure is a real 1080p/widescreen title.
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PSO2! PSO2! PSO2!
..
*cries*
it wont be there.. because.. because SEGA West.
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I would be totally cool with some more HD Dreamcast re-releases!
Although I'm predicting a large amount of that space will be for pushing Sonic Lost World
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PSO2! PSO2! PSO2!
..
*cries*
it wont be there.. because.. because SEGA West.
SEGA's PC games typically don't have much of a presence there outside of the occasional behind closed doors Total War presentation.
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PSO2! PSO2! PSO2!
..
*cries*
it wont be there.. because.. because SEGA West.
i thought i read somewhere that will be making on for the vita?
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i thought i read somewhere that will be making on for the vita?
PSO2 is out on the Vita in Japan. If you can understand Japanese, set yourself up with a Japanese PSN account, which will require a different memory card from the current one you use on your vita, unless you wanna wipe it. You can download it off Japanese PSN. I think they recommend at least a 16GB card.
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This gon be good. Finally some SEGA blowout. They've been awfully quiet lately.
Most of my excitement goes to Mickey mouse and sonic.
Shenmue HD
Skies of Arcadia HD
Why does reading those make me so happy. I doubt it, but it'd be great. I've been holding out to replay them because of the rumors.
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They will defiantly show COH 2 because its an high level acquired franchise, its main market is the United States and its going to be released during the summer anyway. CA's ALIEN game,i dunno if they want to take the risk showing an ALIENS game too soon after the fiasco of the last one.
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SEGA's PC games typically don't have much of a presence there outside of the occasional behind closed doors Total War presentation.
I doubt that they won't show off Company of Heroes 2.
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The make or break day for Yakuza fans...
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Yeah but how important has E3 been for sega announcements? Usually they announce all the stuff we care about outside/after E3 has finished and then we all the the games in some final form at the next E3. And that's after its been shown everywhere else.
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Yeah but how important has E3 been for sega announcements? Usually they announce all the stuff we care about outside/after E3 has finished and then we all the the games in some final form at the next E3. And that's after its been shown everywhere else.
Donno, but this E3 must be pretty important if they have one of the largest booths at the expo. They probably have some unannounced games to bring interest(mainstream press is there after all).
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Bit of cool news:
SEGAbits is attending E3!
Yup, we're important enough to register.
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And wild George will be there. Oh my, don't touch the suit.
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Bit of cool news:
SEGAbits is attending E3!
Yup, we're important enough to register.
Yeah! GO SEGAbits! ;-)
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Bit of cool news:
SEGAbits is attending E3!
Yup, we're important enough to register.
We're moving up in the world. =P
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Bit of cool news:
SEGAbits is attending E3!
Yup, we're important enough to register.
If only I saved a lot of money by switching to Geico and calling State Farm.
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SEGA made a blog post about their E3 showing:
http://blogs.sega.com/2013/06/07/sega-showcases-highly-anticipated-titles-at-e3-2013/
TL;DR
Games at E3:
Sonic Lost World
Castle of Illusion
Company of Heroes 2
Total War: Rome II
The Cave
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hmmm...bad
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Actually, I'm not negative on it, aside from The Cave. Decent game, but it has already released! I know it is hitting more platforms, but still.
Wish we had a few SEGA Heritage titles...
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Hopefully, they'll be announced at E3... The only red flag I have is the absence of PSO2.
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They seem to be in playable form.
Awaiting announcements myself, if they have any.
Valkyria Chronicles 3 in English on Vita or something. :X
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Next-gen games are not supposed to be announced right...
Alot of SKU's still open...tons of Japan focused games??
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Keep in mind that those lists from publishers of games that'll be at E3 never include unannounced games. Maybe that Aliens game from Creative Assembly will be announced?
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I'm guessing 90% stuff we already know about, 10% Jack Lumber.
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I'm guessing 90% stuff we already know about, 10% Jack Lumber.
I was just wondering where you were the other day.
Can't be a coincidence that you return the same day as Dr SEGA Monkey, can it? *shifty yes*
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Can anyone name "surprise" games from SEGA at E3 in the past couple years? Cause I doubt there was more than one, as I remember SEGA being very upfront about what was there and not having much else. The only wildcards would have to be next-gen titles, but I'd spit-take beer over my monitor if there was more than 3 of those... and I'm not counting Monkey Ball, cause that one is so played out for launch windows.
It's very odd that I'm actually excited about a Sonic game, but SEGA's not throwing any alternate bones this year. Want... Heritage... badly.
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Sonic Free Riders. I think that's pretty much it.
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Sonic Free Riders 2 on Xbox One!
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Sonic Rivals HD Collection on PS4!
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VC3 on Vita?
A man can dream, can't he? =(
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Is SEGA even at this E3 ? . I seen the likes of Capcom, Konami , Fromsoftware games being showcased by the likes of SONY and MS and bog all from SEGA Japan.
Nice one SEGA Japan you see to be way behind the times for the next gen of gaming yet again and yet again you've back the wrong console , more so after the simply laughable Wii U showing just now.
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Nice one SEGA Japan you see to be way behind the times for the next gen of gaming yet again and yet again you've back the wrong console , more so after the simply laughable Wii U showing just now.
I think you have just invented a situation in your head.
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SEGA isn't "backing" the wrong console. The only Wii U exclusives announced are Sonic games, one of which has Mario in it. Sonic games typically sell best on Nintendo consoles, so the partnership makes sense, ESPECIALLY if there is money involved for that exclusivity.
If anything, SEGA seems to be throwing most of it's support behind PC, PS3 and mobile, all of which are doing quite well right now. Hell, half of the line up this year is on PC.
I'll admit I'm disappointed, but I don't think you are giving them enough credit in how they are allocating their development resources from a business perspective.
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SCREENS!
Sonic stuff:
http://segabits.com/blog/2013/06/11/feast-your-eyes-on-these-mario-sonic-2014-and-sonic-lost-world-screens/
Bayonetta 2:
http://segabits.com/blog/2013/06/11/more-bayonetta-2-screens-arrive-are-u-ready-to-dance/
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Is SEGA even at this E3 ? . I seen the likes of Capcom, Konami , Fromsoftware games being showcased by the likes of SONY and MS and bog all from SEGA Japan.
Nice one SEGA Japan you see to be way behind the times for the next gen of gaming yet again and yet again you've back the wrong console , more so after the simply laughable Wii U showing just now.
Sega Japan wasn't all there in the beginning of the earlier gen either. 2008 was when Sega really rallied up their games besides the Arcade ports.
We might see a similar situation?
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Bayonetta 2:
http://segabits.com/blog/2013/06/11/more-bayonetta-2-screens-arrive-are-u-ready-to-dance/
Bayo 2 looks so good, and that new hairstyle HNGGGGGGG
At first I was upset I needed to buy a Wii U if i want to play this, but it's better than buying an Xbox One Nine Eight Four.
Unless they make a PC port.
Which they won't.
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That short hair looks friggin hot on her >:D
edit; SOME OF SCREEN GAMEPLAY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KCp6FHTQ4c)
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True, SEGA's been very quiet about the Xbox One and Playstation 4 titles, the only major next-gen title is Sonic Lost World on the Wii U.
Though, I am starting to notice SEGA slowly shift into a PC-focused market.
I wonder if the Aliens game from Creative Assembly will be announced for one of major new consoles.
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SEGA isn't "backing" the wrong console. The only Wii U exclusives announced are Sonic games, one of which has Mario in it. Sonic games typically sell best on Nintendo consoles, so the partnership makes sense, ESPECIALLY if there is money involved for that exclusivity.
I'm Sorry SEGA is again nowhere to be seen at yet another E3. No news on PSO II for the west or even the Next gen consoles :( SEGA Japan completely absent from SONY, MS big pushes while they show off the likes of Capcom and Konami games and their next gen engines and all we get is Sonic for what is a doomed console that will be lucky to see this year out (This Sonic should also be coming to the 360 and PS3 imo)
Way to go SEGA Japan you're way behind for yet another generation of consoles :(
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Would it even be wise to compete with all the next gen greatness on the other 2 platforms? I dunno but to me it's like ps4 and one are really aiming at the people that love blockbuster products on high tech hardware. I can see most of the consumers will exist of either people who like shooters, or western genres in general, at least at launch from what we've seen. Count in that things arent in the best state economically, and I think with that it's actually quite wise that they are putting their games on a that's likely gonna have more of the audience SEGA is looking for. Unless you want SEGA to change into something that isn't SEGA... it does seem quite risky to charge right now. SEGA was already struggling this gen. Let alone next gen.
Edit:Though Focussing on PC is good. I feel like there's a lot of people who are switching to PC and it keeps growing. I have a feeling sony and micrososft are underestimating that. And it could be one of the reasons that result in lackluster sales for ps4/one as well
Having said that, Wii U is struggling as well... so what they are doing now is still pretty risky. I do gotta say that the SEGA games really shine on the wii u. They really pop out as must haves and system sellers.
As for SEGA's presence at E3... other japanese publishers have been absent as well. Strange but it seems many japanese publishers have been either absent or have few games at e3 for some reason
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I agree 100% with TA on this. E3 is starting to feel like a non-event every year, SEGA has nothing to show off, other than games that are coming out this year. No annoucements, not a teaser. Two of the games have already been released and one of 'em in the week after E3.
To say that Castle of Illusion is the only game that I'm personally looking foward to, if only because of Disney is not a good sign.
And as for Sonic Lost World, don't be fooled by the excitement on Neogaf and Sonic-related websites, the gaming industry and gaming press at large does not give a flying hoot about this game nor the excitement over the prospect of exclusive Sonic deals on Nintendo's Wii U.
Nintendo didn't even bother to have a proper conference, so this "alliance" has already proven to be unhealthy out of the gate.
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The question is - can SEGA afford bigger games only for the domestic market?
Yoshida said TGS is gonna something to be excited for at least. Let's wait till then.
Sega just doesn't have something on the level of Metal Gear and Final Fantasy.
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All you guys are off on this. Sega has never shown anything to get excited about for E3. They usually show their best games outside of this event. I dont know why for the life of me that people act like something is going to happen and then it doesn't and start to bitch about it. Its always been like that with sega for the E3 post DC.
And just because sega hasn't shown any new titles yet, must automatically mean that they are behind and are going to fail. gimme a break. I dont think it matters what you have ready for the next gen from the beginning its how you end on it. And the last few years Sega has had a decent,diverse if brilliant collection of titles this gen. When you think how it opened with titles like CONDEMNED and FULL AUTO to the Wii games of HOTD:OKLL and the second party/platinum offerings of BAYONETTA, VANQUISH and MADWORLD to some solid Sega ports of HOTD4, VF5 SHOWDOWN and the suprises along the way with the HD remakes of SONIC or the satifiaction of playing new sega games that hark back to sega's old glory be it the nostalgic sega universe title like SASAS R:T or the sega crowd pleaser BINARY DOMAIN.
Apart from obvious crap that's happened and the debate whether how much success they have had, no one here can say they haven't had a good choice of selection to the games sega hsas offered and we still have yet to see how they will close out the current gen. Its too early to speculate on how their next gen journey will end up or even start yet. People are complaining now but when the games are out, people wil start cheering and hooping. So lets wait and see before jumping to conclusions, ok?
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The question is - can SEGA afford bigger games only for the domestic market
That's going to be such a flawed strategy for starters , even SONY is launching its console in the west 1st , The Japanese Market is now only really good for Handhelds .
When you think how it opened with titles like CONDEMNED and FULL AUTO to the Wii games of HOTD:OKLL and the second party/platinum offerings of BAYONETTA, VANQUISH and MADWORLD to some solid Sega ports of HOTD4, VF5 SHOWDOWN and the suprises along the way with the HD remakes of SONIC or the satifiaction of playing new sega games that hark back to sega's old glory be it the nostalgic sega universe title like SASAS R:T or the sega crowd pleaser BINARY DOMAIN.
C'Mon lets stop the SEGA defence force . For one think Con,Full Auto, Bay, Van, Mad world weren't even SEGA developed games and the days of Japan and the Toyko game show leading the way are long gone and over . E3 used to be where SEGA got people talking for all the right reasons the CES was the show where the world 1st seen Saturn unit and its games, E3 was where SEGA 1st showed off Daytona USA 2001, PSO II, JSRF, Panzer Dragoon Orta, hell while it might have just been Arcade footage... E3 even got to see the latest builds of VF5, AfterBurner Climax House of the Dead 4 with SEGA private showing at E3 2005 at least giving people a taste of what SEGA Japan was up too for next gen Hardware .
This year nothing only games that we've all seen before and support for a doomed console (where most mums and dads will be buying their kids a cheap 360 or PS3 this Christmas rather than a Wii U) . Nice one SEGA Japan you're way behind the rest before the systems even launch . No new games, no new Next gen engines, no excitement and not even talk of PSO 2 for the west or the consoles :(. A totally pathetic showing and one of SEGA worst of all time at E3 imo.
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That's going to be such a flawed strategy for starters , even SONY is launching its console in the west 1st , The Japanese Market is now only really good for Handhelds .
I woudn't it put it past them to have a questionable strategy!
It would be a logical and expected thing to do to show their next-gen stuff at a worldwide event like E3, but really too few companies are really about that anymore, being reasonable. Just look at Nintendo. Wierd startegies all around.
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As Joe said, Sega never does anything good at E3, but for some reason I keep wishing they would.
I fully expected them to go into this even with nothing but stuff we've seen yonks ago and iPhone trash, but a part of me wanted to see something new from them.
At least Nintendo showed off Bayonetta 2 which looks great. Sega can eat a dick for not publishing this themselves.
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Actually, are any iPhone games on display at the SEGA booth this year?
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The Cave?
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E3 used to be where SEGA got people talking for all the right reasons the CES was the show where the world 1st seen Saturn unit and its games, E3 was where SEGA 1st showed off Daytona USA 2001, PSO II, JSRF, Panzer Dragoon Orta, hell while it might have just been Arcade footage... E3 even got to see the latest builds of VF5, AfterBurner Climax House of the Dead 4 with SEGA private showing at E3 2005 at least giving people a taste of what SEGA Japan was up too for next gen Hardware .
That only happened once TA and that wasn't even worth it, usually Sega doesn't bother with E3 and haven't done since the DC died. Remember the last three years? All the games that people around here were excited about were shown at comic con, and other shows. None of them appeared at E3 at least as being first unveiled at E3. And ORTA JSRF weren't shown first sat E3 they were already seen before E3 came along.
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C'Mon lets stop the SEGA defence force . For one think Con,Full Auto, Bay, Van, Mad world weren't even SEGA developed games and the days of Japan and the Toyko game show leading the way are long gone and over .
So? does YAKUZA SONIC and VC count then? A sega game is a sega game because the game whatever its from was sanctioned by Sega. The point is Sega as a company whose supply games from whatever source has delivered some goods. Now if you are talking about development then say development. Dont generalise. And the games Sega show for TGS are games that dont come out over here in the west. Again you are behind in the times on how sega works, if you ever knew how they operate.
This year nothing only games that we've all seen before and support for a doomed console (where most mums and dads will be buying their kids a cheap 360 or PS3 this Christmas rather than a Wii U) .
Yes because you can look into the future... Now lets look at it. Sega is the first of the big guns to develop for a next gen system in the form of the NWiiU by promising that system a HD remake of a new but now classic franchise, some new Sonic titles and GG to 3DS support. How is that being behind? Just because its not on the system you want to see? here's a clue. None of Sega's games are on systems I want to see them on but i have to deal with it. As for the not showing games at the whatever system presentation launches...So F what. How did the XBO presentation benefit EA who showed Fifa? it didn't. How the hell does all these games shown now benefit Sony when we all be a year away. it doesn't. If Sega didn't have ANYTHING at launch then you have a frigging point but we both know that Sega is one of the first supporters to release a game on a new system.
Why did i mention the xbox360 sega games? Because at least sega bothered to release games for the 360 when it first came out when "almighty" capcom and Konami didn't. The PS3? That saw the Sega golf club and VF5 and a published supporting title at its launch. And two are sega developed games and were ports but of course it doesn't matter because they are ports even though you used that E3 presentation of arcade games as an exciting moment for E3...
Nice one SEGA Japan you're way behind the rest before the systems even launch . No new games, no new Next gen engines, no excitement and not even talk of PSO 2 for the west or the consoles :(. A totally pathetic showing and one of SEGA worst of all time at E3 imo.
Apart from the fact that Sega never had a good showing at E3.
Its too early to start moaning that sega hasn't got anything yet. hardly a defence just common sense.
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The Cave?
Shigs and Nux didn't see The Cave at SEGA's booth. So must have been iphone-free this year.
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ROJM's right though. There's nothing to worry about really.
I'd rather SEGA save the announcements for when they are ready than splash their games on E3 and they end up being buggy messes.
Nintendo was pretty wise to not show anything at E3 in my honest opinion. Their direct was disappointing other than Smash, and I can bet you that the game would be played much more than the other titles they announced.
The only disappointment for me is Bayonetta 2's release date.
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The only disappointment for me is Bayonetta 2's release date.
Which makes sense. Nintendo can't compete directly with the big two, they've known that for years now. so they have opted to create a system that delivers something unique. Nothing really that unique with the WiiU but by the time the big games including BAY2 is released next year the Wii U would be more cheaper to get than it is now. but the PSX4 and XBO wont be.
I'd rather SEGA save the announcements for when they are ready than splash their games on E3 and they end up being buggy messes.
Me too but i also like to see Sega try to challenge and compete with Konami and capcom by creating a title or titles that are on the same type of level. In that i do agree with TA. Since post xbox they have either concentrated on japan or pushed Sonic and left any other company to fill the gap. I'd like to see Sega's consumer divisions tackle it instead of management sidestepping the issue by making cheap games with massive returns in profits.
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Sega should concetrate on lots of smaller games on digital. More stuff like Castle of Illusion but with their own IP's.
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Sega should concentrate on lots of smaller games on digital. More stuff like Castle of Illusion but with their own IP's.
That's exactly what they have been doing but they're released mostly in japan.Stuff like KINGDOM CONQUEST and good knows what. Sega west is now really adopting that policy.
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That's exactly what they have been doing but they're released mostly in japan.Stuff like KINGDOM CONQUEST and good knows what. Sega west is now really adopting that policy.
That's social iOS stuff tough.
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Not all of them, a lot of them are games in their own right and SOJ were not only the first of the big games companies to start activity produce original digital games for mobile devices but have created notable franchises at least in japan that are over ten years old. The other stuff were titles that basically used/took over from the VMU data transfer of arcade titles you played but stored onto your phone, while the other half of titles released were ports of old Megadrive or Gamegear games.
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Which makes sense. Nintendo can't compete directly with the big two, they've known that for years now. so they have opted to create a system that delivers something unique. Nothing really that unique with the WiiU but by the time the big games including BAY2 is released next year the Wii U would be more cheaper to get than it is now. but the PSX4 and XBO wont be.
Me too but i also like to see Sega try to challenge and compete with Konami and capcom by creating a title or titles that are on the same type of level. In that i do agree with TA. Since post xbox they have either concentrated on japan or pushed Sonic and left any other company to fill the gap. I'd like to see Sega's consumer divisions tackle it instead of management sidestepping the issue by making cheap games with massive returns in profits.
Indeed, it's a good tactic to at least get some unique games for your system in addition to creating a genre that otherwise wouldn't even be considered on the Wii U.
Indeed, I do agree with that, but I am guessing they are doing baby steps as to not upset Sammy with the stock being steady for the last few years as they've been careful.
Perhaps too careful mind, but I expect them to step it up over the years again and try to catch up with what Capcom and Konami are doing, although to me...Capcom and Konami are in a worse position due to one's over-reliance on the Metal Gear/Castlevania franchises and Capcom's hit and miss policies with their DLC/DRM implementation in their games.
SEGA Japan certainly needs to step out on more bigger venues, but I am guessing that Yakuza/Sonic with a few games here and there will help their balance somewhat for the next few years before they take the riskier paths.
I certainly wish they didn't rely on their Western Studios either but if it works, it works.
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Indeed, it's a good tactic to at least get some unique games for your system in addition to creating a genre that otherwise wouldn't even be considered on the Wii U.
Indeed, I do agree with that, but I am guessing they are doing baby steps as to not upset Sammy with the stock being steady for the last few years as they've been careful.
Perhaps too careful mind, but I expect them to step it up over the years again and try to catch up with what Capcom and Konami are doing, although to me...Capcom and Konami are in a worse position due to one's over-reliance on the Metal Gear/Castlevania franchises and Capcom's hit and miss policies with their DLC/DRM implementation in their games.
SEGA Japan certainly needs to step out on more bigger venues, but I am guessing that Yakuza/Sonic with a few games here and there will help their balance somewhat for the next few years before they take the riskier paths.
I certainly wish they didn't rely on their Western Studios either but if it works, it works.
Dont worry that western focus,statedgy is all but dead now. It was only really successful with the acquisitions and that was a policy implemented by Sammy boss Satomie. Other than that with the majority of original IP and the Sega classic IP stuff not making the impact they wanted in the American market and the losses they made on the titles that didn't happen because of cancellation and closing down studios, Sega wont invest in that as much as they did anymore. Oddly enough it was only the Marvel stuff that actually did pay off for Sega because a few of the titles sold over a million units. But still heavy losses were incurred which messed up a lot of plans that they did have. Only the important games or cheapest games are now being done. Notice that Sega is letting Nintendo handle Sonic that they would do themselves? All Sega is doing is developing the title and letting Nintendo doing the rest of the work. With BAYONETTA 2 Sega is basically letting Nintendo handle the costs while they pick up a fat check and dividends from sales (when it happens) and if the game is really succesful, Sega will still have a more prominent IP that they can use in the long run. I'm just wondering that if this is what's in store for other Sega games on the way.
Also wondering what the final Sega games for Ps3 and 360 are going to be.
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we finally got some SEGA E3 news, but not be what you want to hear though
Nagoshi supports blocking used games
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=588001
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EXCELLENT! HAHAHAHA!
(http://segabits.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Yakuza4NagoshiThrone.jpg)
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Since Nagoshi is CCO and General Manager of the Consumer Division, I do wonder what his observations reflect on at in-house development at Sega.
It's one thing people forget. He's not really the "Yakuza guy" :P
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I don't know what the context is behind his statement. Whether he really means it or is showing voicing his support because of some kind of partnership going on, it pains me to say that i'll lose my respect for him.
I am very principled on this DRM matter. If I buy a game, it is my game and it should be mine forever. Even after 50 years and I decide to get my console out of the basement, and feel like playing it again without some dumb non existing server at that time to hold me back, it should work. I don't wanna have anything to do with this bullshit. Screw loyalty
If it's too expensive to develop big games, stop developing expensive games! instead of playing with our rights.
All this news is making me question of next gen is even gonna work if they need these kinds of systems in order to maintain the existence of AAA. Frankly I don't care how big and huge a game's production value is. As long as its a good game. And indies are proving that it's possible to make special experiences without all the bells and whistles
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That only happened once TA and that wasn't even worth it, usually Sega doesn't bother with E3 and haven't done since the DC died. Remember the last three years?
Stop it with the endless defending of SEGA. I remember E3 when SEGA pleased it's own fans where the likes of a 10% compete JSRF blew most SEGA fans away at E3 2001, in 2002 Orta made SEGA fans weep with tears of joy at the visuals on offer then SEGA also had the likes of Shinobi, HOTD III, SEGA GT, TJ&Earl III to show off , E3 2004 wasn't the best but at least SEGA did have the likes of OutRun , ESPN NFL 2005 (one of the best sports games ever made) E3 2006 we had the likes of Revo, VF 5 Virtual Tennis 3, Yakuza and even a trailer of PSO II .
So stop the endless defending of SEGA . SEGA Japan had a piss poor show at this years E3 and are nowhere for next gen engines or IP and the one big IP SEGA has on the consoles that sells well WW . SEGA in their wisdom has locked to a console that is selling like shit and looks for all the world a doomed console .
So? does YAKUZA SONIC and VC count then?
SEGA didn't even show off Yakuza at this years E3, SEGA is not making a new VC much less show it off at this years E3 . All we got is Sonic , that's the issue .
Yes because you can look into the future
No need retail shows that the Wii U is selling like crap and 3rd parties aren't doing well at all on the system and where its been vastly outperformed by the 360 and PS3 for Hardware sales month to month .
Because at least sega bothered to release games for the 360 when it first came out when "almighty" capcom and Konami didn't
Get your facts right mate . Capcom were on the 360 right at the start with Dead Rising and Lost Planet and even before the PS3 made it out it was confirmed that DMC IV would be out on the 360. Konami had Pro Evo on the 360 early in . Not that's issue , Konami and the likes of Capcom have had their games and next gen engines being promoted by SONY and MS on their new consoles , SEGA Japan haven't .
Apart from the fact that Sega never had a good showing at E3
Utter Tosh . SEGA had a great showing at E3 2001 and E3 2002 . But keep on defending SEGA and it's piss poor games development plans (or lack of )
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Dammit Nagoshi...
I can understand why people like this idea in theory, but the reality is that DRM hurts paying customers while the Pirates just avoid all this shit with their chipped consoles and hacked games.
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So I guess the SEGA Spectrum turned out to be fake? I wasn't expecting a new console of course, but I assumed it was an arcade board or an online service or something.
Ah well.
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Stop it with the endless defending of SEGA. I remember E3 when SEGA pleased it's own fans where the likes of a 10% compete JSRF blew most SEGA fans away at E3 2001, in 2002 Orta made SEGA fans weep with tears of joy at the visuals on offer then SEGA also had the likes of Shinobi, HOTD III, SEGA GT, TJ&Earl III to show off , E3 2004 wasn't the best but at least SEGA did have the likes of OutRun , ESPN NFL 2005 (one of the best sports games ever made) E3 2006 we had the likes of Revo, VF 5 Virtual Tennis 3, Yakuza and even a trailer of PSO II .
Yawn most of those games mentioned wasn't unveiled at E3. The only time Sega japan unveiled something at E3 was that video of games that turned out to be arcade titles san one. Again get your info correct.needless to say more people agree with me than you on this.
So stop the endless defending of SEGA . SEGA Japan had a piss poor show at this years E3 and are nowhere for next gen engines or IP and the one big IP SEGA has on the consoles that sells well WW . SEGA in their wisdom has locked to a console that is selling like shit and looks for all the world a doomed console .
WiiU is a next gen system. Again please stop your ranting and raving and look at things objectively.
SEGA didn't even show off Yakuza at this years E3, SEGA is not making a new VC much less show it off at this years E3 . All we got is Sonic , that's the issue .
Sega NEVER unveiled YAKUZA and VC at E3.They usually showed it off somewhere else. They haven't showed off any big games for years now at E3, that's the point. You are acting like this is an common occurance but it isn't.I suggest stop trying to make yourself cool with the uneducated because you are talking complete carp.
No need retail shows that the Wii U is selling like crap and 3rd parties aren't doing well at all on the system and where its been vastly outperformed by the 360 and PS3 for Hardware sales month to month
And that's going to last right? Really for someone who is meant to be experienced in gaming you are using sales figures at the first cycle to prove a point it wont sell. The SNES outsold the PSX before it finally was wound down. And we all know what happened at the long run.
Get your facts right mate . Capcom were on the 360 right at the start with Dead Rising and Lost Planet and even before the PS3 made it out it was confirmed that DMC IV would be out on the 360. Konami had Pro Evo on the 360 early in . Not that's issue , Konami and the likes of Capcom have had their games and next gen engines being promoted by SONY and MS on their new consoles , SEGA Japan haven't .
Those games weren't there at day one, Sega was that's the point. And Sega did keep supporting the 360 compared to your obvious favourites so you get your facts right.
Utter Tosh . SEGA had a great showing at E3 2001 and E3 2002 . But keep on defending SEGA and it's piss poor games development plans (or lack of )
I defend sega when capcom/konami fans come here bashing them on something which is untrue. which is probably why you perfer the saturn over actual Sega systems full of sega made games compared to the one system that didn't. Oh well. As for your rantings...
Two years and after that? Please provide how many great revelations and great E3 sega had since then.You are acting that sega has always had a great showing, they haven't not compared to when the DC was around. That sadly is the truth of the matter deal with it.
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Yawn most of those games mentioned wasn't unveiled at E3
Wrong at E3 2001 Gunvalkyrie was playable for the very 1st time It was also the 1st time it was seen running on the X-Box . At same the E3 show SEGA showed off a then 10% complete Jet Set Radio Future demo -complete with 'understand the concept of love' track (I should know because I still have that very E3 video ) The next E3 HOTD III (with the drop of the cel shading graphics) and Orta showen off for the 1st time running on Hardware at E3 2002 and PSO II was revealed for the very 1st time at E3 a few years latter.
For someone who claims to be bastion of all things SEGA I would have liked to have expected better
WiiU is a next gen system
laughable . Its a current gen system and one that is selling like utter tripe, even in Japan .
Those games weren't there at day one
Very few games are there at day one. Its the commitment the developer makes that's the key, efore the 360 made it out Capcom Japan were committed to the XBox 360 with In-House development (not just 1st/2nd party software but In-House) and showing off its Framework next gen engine and was one of the 1st corps to launch a demo that showed what the 360 could do with its early Dead Rising demo and if you want to be clever Full Auto wasn't a launch title either.
Your laughable defence that SEGA has been rubbish at E3 for years means/makes it ok it just totally pathetic for the every E3 there after, that's like saying we made shit games for years while bother making anything good . If anything that should make you up your game and portfolio but no SEGA had it's worst E3 in years and when the eye's of the world gaming press , is awash with talk of the next gen and the new systems . SEGA japan is totally absent from it - It's weak, its pathetic and its worrying to see what SEGA Japan become what it is today...
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Wrong at E3 2001 Gunvalkyrie was playable for the very 1st time It was also the 1st time it was seen running on the X-Box . At same the E3 show SEGA showed off a then 10% complete Jet Set Radio Future demo -complete with 'understand the concept of love' track (I should know because I still have that very E3 video ) The next E3 HOTD III (with the drop of the cel shading graphics) and Orta showen off for the 1st time running on Hardware at E3 2002 and PSO II was revealed for the very 1st time at E3 a few years latter.
No,GV and JSRF was unveiled before E3. The same goes for ORTA. They were playable or previewed again at E3. So let's not make things up here. There were several preview trailers way before E3 came about concerning those games. You of all people should have known that. PSO 2 we all knew that was coming way before E3 as well. This myth that sega has used E3 to unveil their games is just that a myth. They never have.
For someone who claims to be bastion of all things SEGA I would have liked to have expected better
For someone who suppose to be a know it all, i'd expect better too.
laughable . Its a current gen system and one that is selling like utter tripe, even in Japan .
What's laughable is that you believe that the system will continue to sell tripe. Any ten year old kid can tell you that how a system starts out doesn't necesarly mean it will end up like that. Again the SNES outsold the PSX when that system was brand new. that system ended up outselling its actual peers by the end of its run. The NES outsold the megadrive when that was newly released. it ended up being the dominat system in the 16 bit generation. So using the sales data of how the Wii U is selling now compared to more established brands when its actual rivals haven't appeared on the market yet is just silly.
Very few games are there at day one. Its the commitment the developer makes that's the key, efore the 360 made it out Capcom Japan were committed to the XBox 360 with In-House development (not just 1st/2nd party software but In-House) and showing off its Framework next gen engine and was one of the 1st corps to launch a demo that showed what the 360 could do with its early Dead Rising demo and if you want to be clever Full Auto wasn't a launch title either.
It was actually. And that and CONDEMNED was one of the earliest games from a third party to be revealed outside of E3 to be coming for what was then the xbox next and Ps3. You keep bringing up DR and DMC and all that but what about after that? I didn't see many games coming from either of your all fave companies you like to use to bash sega over the head with.
Your laughable defence that SEGA has been rubbish at E3 for years means/makes it ok it just totally pathetic for the every E3 there after, that's like saying we made shit games for years while bother making anything good . If anything that should make you up your game and portfolio but no SEGA had it's worst E3 in years and when the eye's of the world gaming press , is awash with talk of the next gen and the new systems . SEGA japan is totally absent from it - It's weak, its pathetic and its worrying to see what SEGA Japan become what it is today...
Its not an excuse. Its a fact that sega doesn't bother with E3. Everyone here apart from you seems to know that. Most of the games sega has made a big deal about in the last 8 years was shown at other events like the GDC, The german gamecon or even the NY comic con. That whole Sega/Platinum event was shown unveiled in london for gods sake. Again i dont really understand why you are bitchin and moaning about Sega having a piss poor E3 event when its been like that for years now. Its hardly a defence of sega, i'm just not going to moan about something that i have no power in changing. And if you think i'm a staunch defender of sega i wouldn't have bother to get rid of most of my stock after seeing which direction they were going towards ie digital focus. Which you keep claiming at the time they weren't. now you come back here complaining they have nothing for E3 and nothing for PS4 and XBO. Silly really when we all know that Nagoshi is developing a game for PS4 as well.
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Dammit Nagoshi...
I can understand why people like this idea in theory, but the reality is that DRM hurts paying customers while the Pirates just avoid all this shit with their chipped consoles and hacked games.
Yes its a long way from some of his views in Edge. But i guess you need to tow the company line since Sega was always against the sale of used games. It depends how successful the XBO is at market for them to fully exploit that and stop that market. Good luck to them because so far its always failed.
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No,GV and JSRF was unveiled before E3
Announced - But it was MS system and they kept a tight lid on could or not be shown off. It was at E3 2001 that the 'world' saw JSRF running for the 1st time .
The same goes for ORTA
Nope all we got was 6 screen shots before hand at a 'faked' real time demo . It was at E2002 that MS showed off the game running on actual Hardware and it fully playable for the 1st time .
PSO 2 we all knew that was coming way before E3 as well.
Nobody really knew but the trailer all but saved what was an average E3 show for SEGA. In the end it gave SEGA fans something to look forward too, this year we didn't even get that
What's laughable is that you believe that the system will continue to sell tripe
It can't sell now , its getting creamed by the 360 and PS3 its getting dropped by the likes of EA God help it when the PS4 and XBox One come on line too . SEGA would have been better off making sure the game was also out on the PS3 and 360 - more so has those consoles will see discounts this Christmas and the consoles of choice for mum and dads for their small kids. Everyone knows the Wii U had a piss poor start and that its showing at this year E3 was a huge let down with lost of games not ready till next year and Nintendo with the desprate need remake the likes of Zelda and Mario 3D for the system to try and help with the numbers
And that and CONDEMNED was one of the earliest games from a third party to be revealed outside of E3
Revealed , but Full Auto wasn't a launch title
. Its a fact that sega doesn't bother with E3
SEGA used to bother with E3 it used to have games to show off and used to have the Studio heads out there giving interviews and showing off their games . Those days are long gone. SEGA Japan is yet again no-where for next gen systems and got nothing to show off . Keep on dreaming that will change at this years Toyko Game Show
Nice one SEGA Japan
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Announced - But it was MS system and they kept a tight lid on could or not be shown off. It was at E3 2001 that the 'world' saw JSRF running for the 1st time .
Actually there was a trailer for JSRF way before E3 appeared.
Nope all we got was 6 screen shots before hand at a 'faked' real time demo . It was at E2002 that MS showed off the game running on actual Hardware and it fully playable for the 1st time .
Nobody really knew but the trailer all but saved what was an average E3 show for SEGA. In the end it gave SEGA fans something to look forward too, this year we didn't even get that
Sega showed a couple of actual trailers before then. I shall add again since DC, Sega hasn't had a decent E3.
It can't sell now , its getting creamed by the 360 and PS3 its getting dropped by the likes of EA God help it when the PS4 and XBox One come on line too . SEGA would have been better off making sure the game was also out on the PS3 and 360 - more so has those consoles will see discounts this Christmas and the consoles of choice for mum and dads for their small kids. Everyone knows the Wii U had a piss poor start and that its showing at this year E3 was a huge let down with lost of games not ready till next year and Nintendo with the desprate need remake the likes of Zelda and Mario 3D for the system to try and help with the numbers
Yawn,older systems are going to sell better than a new one the price alone as well as more games available is a factor on that. That isn't rocket science either. Until we actually see when the newer systems appear and the older ones discontinued, then we can see how it bears up. Until then i wont judge on what is happening now when the next console war has barely started.
Revealed , but Full Auto wasn't a launch title
It appeared in its launch year.
SEGA used to bother with E3 it used to have games to show off and used to have the Studio heads out there giving interviews and showing off their games . Those days are long gone. SEGA Japan is yet again no-where for next gen systems and got nothing to show off . Keep on dreaming that will change at this years Toyko Game Show
Nice one SEGA Japan
Used to then the DC flopped and they haven't bother since. You can bring up ORTA and the like all you want but since the last official Sega title was released in 2002/(2004 if i was going to strech it). for DC, They haven't really bothered since. I dont understand why there is a hissy fit about this, you lot are acting like this is some strange recent behavior from Sega when its been going on for over ten years now. Just because they haven't shown ANY new games for the PS4 and xbo as well as the new games that is scheduled to appear for 360 and Ps3, you are acting thatt hey are behind the times.
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Actually there was a trailer for JSRF way before E3 appeared.
No has confirmed with an interview of the Team in EDGE Aug 2001 . It was the 1st time the game was shown off and they were pleased with the reaction, more so as the E3 2001 demo and the games was the result of just 4 weeks of work on the XBox.
Sega showed a couple of actual trailers before then
We got just 6 screen shots and before that all we had was what turned out to a faked demo - made to look like the game in real time
I shall add again since DC, Sega hasn't had a decent E3.
2001 and 2002 where great SEGA E3 for starters .
older systems are going to sell better than a new one the price alone as well as more games
The Wii U isn't sell - that's why its being dropped by 3rd parties and the bad part for Nintendo is the fact that's its not being out sold by the Wii, but by the 360 and PS3 .
You can bring up ORTA and the like all you want but since the last official Sega title was released in 2002
That year was a great show for SEGA with the likes of MonkeyBall 2, Orta, , SEGA GT , ToeJame and Earl ,Shinobi ,Beach Spikers and GunGrave all shown off
2003 wasn't too bad with the likes of O.TO.GI, Billy H, VF 4 Evo, Dororo, SEGA GT Online , PS Online III
and at least in 2005 you had the SEGA cinema showing off VF 5 , AB Climax, Chromhounds, HOTD IV, Sonic 06 . This year other than Sonic on a dead system it was a complete non event and this is year that marks the start of the new generation too :(.
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Thread's dead baby, thread's dead...
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No has confirmed with an interview of the Team in EDGE Aug 2001 . It was the 1st time the game was shown off and they were pleased with the reaction, more so as the E3 2001 demo and the games was the result of just 4 weeks of work on the XBox.
Yet is sold like shit. There was a demo doing the rounds before E3 took place in japan. you obviously missed it.
We got just 6 screen shots and before that all we had was what turned out to a faked demo - made to look like the game in real time
ORTA was shown off way before E3 in fact a couple of games were that ended up being previewed at E3. I'm not speaking of any fake demos either. But again you obviously missed it which is strange considering its usually a pattern of behavior of sega to show some footage of games before an actual event takes place. The only time that they don't do that is when they are about to hold a press conference to unveil a top secret game.....
2001 and 2002 where great SEGA E3 for starters .
Not compared to CES and past E3 events before then.
The Wii U isn't sell - that's why its being dropped by 3rd parties and the bad part for Nintendo is the fact that's its not being out sold by the Wii, but by the 360 and PS3 .
So was the MD when it was released in its first year. So was the PSX when it was in its first year. You can't predict how well a system is going to do in its first couple of months let alone its first year when comparing it to older systems that are cheaper and more importantly have more games for it. The DC had a great sales launch when it was first released in america, but we all know what happened with that in the long run. So to say that this is the way its going to be for the WiiU for the next few years is really a lack of intelligence and ignorance of learning from previous generations. lets wait till the other two systems come out and see their sales performance and the WiiU performance against them before we jump on the WiiU's doom.
That year was a great show for SEGA with the likes of MonkeyBall 2, Orta, , SEGA GT , ToeJame and Earl ,Shinobi ,Beach Spikers and GunGrave all shown off
Two good E3's(in your opinion) compared to eleven years of Sega E3s where nothing happened. That's why i find you and a few others rant on Sega's showing or lack of showing at E3 ridiculous. History shows that Sega hasn't put much of an event at E3, yet you lot are acting that they've always had. Especially on your part as its really an unveiled attempt to attack me. Did i want to see something new from sega. yes. Disappointed? Yep. But was I surprised they didn't? No because of what they've done in previous E3s. I'm not going to get into a tizzyfit because sega chose not to show anything at E3 when its pointless to do so.
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I know I'm late to this discussion but... Why are people still discussing SEGA's strategy? I thought they made it clear several times over and you can put me in the disappointed camp but for other reasons.
I am fine with SEGA only releasing a select few franchises, even if this means Yakuza 5 should be sacrificed (Yakuza 5 will not get translated, the sheer size means it will have to do very well to be profitable, took me over 30 hours to complete the story alone) but my issue is that titles like Miku and PSO2 should have been at E3. Not having a title releasing in August nor having a title they have said they will bring over yet hold back showcasing is bad decision and shows the problem at SEGA American plain and simple. I am also concerned what is happening to CA's Alien game...
But the fact is now with Company of Heroes, SEGA has more than enough big titles for the West to not bother with their Japanese titles. Rome II will do a million plus, Company of Heroes 2 will do over 2 million easily (Original did over 4 million) and Sonic will do a good amount, probably in the 2 million region too. And that is going to be their main focus; Sonic, Company of Heroes, Total War, Warhammer, Aliens and Football Manager.
We might not like it but it will be the most successful SEGA has been here in the West for a long time and it's financial suicide for them to continue down the path they were going in.
As for SEGA's presence at E3... other japanese publishers have been absent as well. Strange but it seems many japanese publishers have been either absent or have few games at e3 for some reason
With the exception of Namco, what other major third party is absent?
Konami made a big splash with Metal Gear Solid V and the new Pro Evo is probably going to slowly start to challenge FIFA again, Capcom had Dead Rising 3 whilst Square showed off two big games (even if they have bad J-pop band members as the main characters)
And in general Japanese games were the strongest they have been in a long time, Killer Within, Gran Turismo 6, Sonic: Lost World, Bayonetta 2, Mario Kart 8, Dead Souls 2. If anything, this was the E3 that Japan returned in style.
And as for Sonic Lost World, don't be fooled by the excitement on Neogaf and Sonic-related websites, the gaming industry and gaming press at large does not give a flying hoot about this game nor the excitement over the prospect of exclusive Sonic deals on Nintendo's Wii U.
Nintendo didn't even bother to have a proper conference, so this "alliance" has already proven to be unhealthy out of the gate.
The game industry in general do not give a hoot about Sonic, if they did then I certainly did not see it in the excitement for Sonic & Allstars Racing Transformed nor Sonic Generations. People have to understand Sonic Team's continued incompetence has damaged the brand to the point its a b-tier series. And if Nintendo is paying for exclusivity then what difference does it make to SEGA?
People should also remember even the disaster know as the Gamecube, which the Wii U is currently tracking as, still managed to sell 2 Sonic titles that both did over a million. Besides the fact its on the 3DS also helps it substantially.
At least Nintendo showed off Bayonetta 2 which looks great. Sega can eat a dick for not publishing this themselves.
That was not SEGA's decision to make.
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That was not SEGA's decision to make.
Wasn't it though? Weren't they the ones who pointed PG towards Nintendo? I remember reading as such in an interview about the subject.
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Wasn't it though? Weren't they the ones who pointed PG towards Nintendo? I remember reading as such in an interview about the subject.
Moreover, they own the IP. It was their decision to even let Platinum make it, as far as I can tell.
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Wasn't it though? Weren't they the ones who pointed PG towards Nintendo? I remember reading as such in an interview about the subject.
Moreover, they own the IP. It was their decision to even let Platinum make it, as far as I can tell.
SEGA pointed Platinum towards Nintendo but not because they didn't want Bayonetta 2 or cancelled it because they could not afford the development.
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Which is why I think the best way we'd see a Shenmue 3 is if one of the console makers funded it.
I thought that's how it would go with the Xbox... then with the 360. :P
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I think Sega's on the right track of having other studios develop their games. Dimp's has done alot of the past Sonic games for Nintendo's systems.. Sega's name is still attached to Bayonetta, even if they didn't publish it. Just like how Sega's name is attached still to the Sakura Wars that was released on the PS2, but published by NIS. No different than with Bayonetta. In the long run, it makes sense. Sega can't afford to make/publish the games. So why not have another studio buy the rights to make a game using their IP and sell it? Sega still gets a cut of the profits. Who's not to say...and I try really hard to stay out of this Shenmue III stuff...but maybe they've tried to get a studio interested in taking on the Shenmue IP to make Shenmue III, or don't feel they've found a studio yet that will do it justice the way fans are expecting?
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SEGA pointed Platinum towards Nintendo but not because they didn't want Bayonetta 2 or cancelled it because they could not afford the development.
Exactly, they had first option to publish it, but didn't. I'll still buy a Wii U to play it, and hopefully at least a few other good games are on the console by the time it releases.
But anyway, as you said they'll likely never translate Yakuza 5, how was it playing through in Japanese? I think I might just import it.
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I think Sega's on the right track of having other studios develop their games. Dimp's has done alot of the past Sonic games for Nintendo's systems.. Sega's name is still attached to Bayonetta, even if they didn't publish it. Just like how Sega's name is attached still to the Sakura Wars that was released on the PS2, but published by NIS. No different than with Bayonetta. In the long run, it makes sense. Sega can't afford to make/publish the games. So why not have another studio buy the rights to make a game using their IP and sell it? Sega still gets a cut of the profits. Who's not to say...and I try really hard to stay out of this Shenmue III stuff...but maybe they've tried to get a studio interested in taking on the Shenmue IP to make Shenmue III, or don't feel they've found a studio yet that will do it justice the way fans are expecting?
I'm not sure I like where they're going, personally. Sega can afford to publish games; they're making more profit now than they have since 1995. Time to loosen the belt, I say. Dimps and Sumo might be solid, but there have been plenty of third parties (like Gearbox) that have done piss poor jobs and are killing Segas credibility. Aliens is probably the worst fiasco since Sonic 06, and it was an external studio. And it isn't as though this was Gearbox's first time at bat either; reviews for Samba de Amigo's port were pretty mediocre. I don't remember thunderous applause for other projects either. Alpha Protocol, End of Eternity, etc. etc. didn't exactly put Sega back on the map.
Instead of giving money to other studios, Sega should be pumping money into their own development houses. Sonic Team aside, most of the other studios have been doing fine, and, if anything, could stand to be more ambitious. Now, even Sonic Team seems to be getting better. Stop financing Alpha Protocol or Alien Syndrome and having your homegrown talent waste away making Brain Training games or Sega Race TV. It's no wonder all Sega's talent is leaving or long gone; Sega's too busy giving money to GearBox to finance another console version of Valkyrie of the Battlefield.
I don't understand why Sega can't spend more on advertising and publishing things like Bayonetta. God knows it will make the money back, and the free press it will be getting as a killer ap for the Wii U will be phenomenal. Nintendo would probably pay some of the advertising out of sheer desperation. Why let them publish it? I know Sega has money; they're just being stingy at this point. They still think its 1998 or something.
It is Sega's IP; their development studios could do it if Platinum refused to let Sega publish or something. It isn't as if AM-2 has had its hands full lately. What have they been doing, besides updating Borderbreak and Virtua Fighter these days? Getting rid of pop-up in Daytona?
Shenmue will not sell, much less push hardware. It didnt push the Dreamcast; why in God's name would you think it'd sell PS4's?
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Yet is sold like shit. There was a demo doing the rounds before E3 took place in japan.
Game selling poor is a different matter altogether and no there wasn't a demo of JSRF before E3 . E3 was the 1st time people saw the 10% complete version of the game -confirmed by the Team and where it was just the result of 4 weeks of solid coding .
ORTA was shown off way before E3 in fact a couple of games were that ended up being previewed at E3
All you got was 4 to 6 screen shots of the game (all taken for the 1st level of the game ) E3 2001 was where the world saw the game moving for the 1st time and some of the other levels for the 1st time .
The E3 2001 trailer was utterly mindblowing too .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfVwn1-R0E0
Now that was SEGA Japan at their best and how you own E3 with a game
So was the MD when it was released in its first year. So was the PSX when it was in its first year
The Mega Drive sold very well in its 1st year so did the PS and unlike the Wii U 3rd parties were jumping over themself's to support the format in its 1st year - that is the key difference .
Two good E3's(in your opinion) compared to eleven years of Sega E3s where nothing happened
11 ? Lol what are you on about . SEGA had a quite a few decent E3 but this one has been utter shit and deep down any SEGA fan will know it .
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Exactly, they had first option to publish it, but didn't. I'll still buy a Wii U to play it, and hopefully at least a few other good games are on the console by the time it releases.
Check your PM.
But anyway, as you said they'll likely never translate Yakuza 5, how was it playing through in Japanese? I think I might just import it.
There were four bits where you would need to know Japanese, thankfully the guide that I used was pretty straight forward, however you might need to match sentences/roads up in the guide with what is being said in the game.
Otherwise just watch the first 15 seconds of this video to know why you NEED Yakuza 5, nothing spoilerish but one of the ingame fight cutscenes with Kiryu being Kiryu.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2TuS9AAQoI
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Game selling poor is a different matter altogether and no there wasn't a demo of JSRF before E3 . E3 was the 1st time people saw the 10% complete version of the game -confirmed by the Team and where it was just the result of 4 weeks of solid coding .
Not really, because if the game wowed people at E3 then it should have also wowed the public. Also i will add the xbox trailer, demo whatever you want to call it was shown in japan way before E3 happened. it was never showcased in E3.
All you got was 4 to 6 screen shots of the game (all taken for the 1st level of the game ) E3 2001 was where the world saw the game moving for the 1st time and some of the other levels for the 1st time .
The E3 2001 trailer was utterly mindblowing too .
2001? Before you were saying it was 2002. make your mind up.
Now that was SEGA Japan at their best and how you own E3 with a game
Apart from the fact that they didn't own E3 in 2002. Everyone else was more excited about some other games on another system.
The Mega Drive sold very well in its 1st year so did the PS and unlike the Wii U 3rd parties were jumping over themself's to support the format in its 1st year - that is the key difference .
Not compared to the older systems that was around they didn't. That's the point. And since its the first of the next gen of systems to come out its doing well since its rivals haven't come out yet. Once they do then we can compare sales data.Your assement of the future of the WiiU is downright stupid and speaks of console zealously when we dont know what will happen with any of the next gen systems a year from now.
11 ? Lol what are you on about . SEGA had a quite a few decent E3 but this one has been utter shit and deep down any SEGA fan will know it .
No one said this E3 was good, the point is most E3 from Sega hasn't been anything to get excited about in terms of new games, over a decade now. They had plenty of good E3's? LOL. Yet so far you have named and continue to repeat two. Posty DC? Nothing much. One game like PS02 doesn't make a decent E3 overall or should i say a memorable one. but you see you like to label people without giving any real evidence and hope that everyone else falls in line. I defend sega? Was I defending Sega about their new digital focus? Do i defend SOJ screw ups? No but what is a little lie from you get in the way of the truth.
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I'm not sure I like where they're going, personally. Sega can afford to publish games; they're making more profit now than they have since 1995. Time to loosen the belt, I say. Dimps and Sumo might be solid, but there have been plenty of third parties (like Gearbox) that have done piss poor jobs and are killing Segas credibility. Aliens is probably the worst fiasco since Sonic 06, and it was an external studio. And it isn't as though this was Gearbox's first time at bat either; reviews for Samba de Amigo's port were pretty mediocre. I don't remember thunderous applause for other projects either. Alpha Protocol, End of Eternity, etc. etc. didn't exactly put Sega back on the map.
Instead of giving money to other studios, Sega should be pumping money into their own development houses. Sonic Team aside, most of the other studios have been doing fine, and, if anything, could stand to be more ambitious. Now, even Sonic Team seems to be getting better. Stop financing Alpha Protocol or Alien Syndrome and having your homegrown talent waste away making Brain Training games or Sega Race TV. It's no wonder all Sega's talent is leaving or long gone; Sega's too busy giving money to GearBox to finance another console version of Valkyrie of the Battlefield.
I don't understand why Sega can't spend more on advertising and publishing things like Bayonetta. God knows it will make the money back, and the free press it will be getting as a killer ap for the Wii U will be phenomenal. Nintendo would probably pay some of the advertising out of sheer desperation. Why let them publish it? I know Sega has money; they're just being stingy at this point. They still think its 1998 or something.
It is Sega's IP; their development studios could do it if Platinum refused to let Sega publish or something. It isn't as if AM-2 has had its hands full lately. What have they been doing, besides updating Borderbreak and Virtua Fighter these days? Getting rid of pop-up in Daytona?
Shenmue will not sell, much less push hardware. It didnt push the Dreamcast; why in God's name would you think it'd sell PS4's?
BAYONETTA was one of the lucky ones. There was a slew of sega games internally and externally developed that were cancelled. Part of the reason why Sega canned PG was to do with contract negotiations because they were trying to come to terms of extending another multigame deal. Didn't happen so nintendo stepped in. If Sega had the money then some of the games or ideas used in other games were seeing now may have been published by sega. Me personally i was looking forward to a sega UK title that was going to happen for Kinect. Too bad that was canned as well.
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I think Sega's on the right track of having other studios develop their games. Dimp's has done alot of the past Sonic games for Nintendo's systems.. Sega's name is still attached to Bayonetta, even if they didn't publish it. Just like how Sega's name is attached still to the Sakura Wars that was released on the PS2, but published by NIS. No different than with Bayonetta. In the long run, it makes sense. Sega can't afford to make/publish the games. So why not have another studio buy the rights to make a game using their IP and sell it? Sega still gets a cut of the profits. Who's not to say...and I try really hard to stay out of this Shenmue III stuff...but maybe they've tried to get a studio interested in taking on the Shenmue IP to make Shenmue III, or don't feel they've found a studio yet that will do it justice the way fans are expecting?
That is different because NIS just localised the game, The game was still developed by Sega and RED in Japan. But licensing IP has been done before, Remember REZ HD that was published by Q Entertainment? And SHENMUE CITY by Sunsoft? Even a VIRTUA FIGHTER mobile game was licensed to Yu Suzuki and a mobile game firm. Now its BAYONETTA 2. So they can do it with SHENMUE as well. Problem is its the codes of the game.
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BAYONETTA was one of the lucky ones. There was a slew of sega games internally and externally developed that were cancelled. Part of the reason why Sega canned PG was to do with contract negotiations because they were trying to come to terms of extending another multigame deal. Didn't happen so nintendo stepped in. If Sega had the money then some of the games or ideas used in other games were seeing now may have been published by sega. Me personally i was looking forward to a sega UK title that was going to happen for Kinect. Too bad that was canned as well.
I don't understand why they keep canceling games, either.
Hopefully, the constant stream of revenue from the west will make them more risk prone. They're damn cowardly at this point.
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Stop financing Alpha Protocol or Alien Syndrome and having your homegrown talent waste away making Brain Training games or Sega Race TV. It's no wonder all Sega's talent is leaving or long gone; Sega's too busy giving money to GearBox to finance another console version of Valkyrie of the Battlefield.
Hey, nothing wrong with Suzuki making a spiritual successor to Power Drift :P
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Not really, because if the game wowed people at E3 then it should have also wowed the public
There's been quite a few games that have wowed the press and gamers at various trade shows only to sell rather poor at retail games like System Shock 2 , Okami, Viewtiful Joe , Oddworld Stranger, Beyond Good and Evil and so on .
Before you were saying it was 2002
Typo it was 2002.
Apart from the fact that they didn't own E3 in 2002
If you we a SEGA fan SEGA pretty much owned that E3 with some stunning games on 3 different systems and Panzer Dragoon was hands down the best looking game for the show . Good times .
Not compared to the older systems that was around they didn't
Nothing going to change for the Wii U . Its selling like crap now, it won't be able to handle the next gen graphics (so it loses out even more when all the major development moves to the next gen) and worst of all is people aren't buying the Wii , they're buying 360's or PS3's /.So on all fronts Nintendo is losing out big time .
the point is most E3 from Sega hasn't been anything to get excited about in terms of new games, over a decade now
SEGA fans not getting worked up about a new OutRun, New PSO, New HOTD, New VF , New Shinobi, New Panzer , New JSR games . Pull the other one at least there was always some game to look forward too , we didn't even have that this year and this is the year of the new consoles and SEGA is no-where yet again Its so depressing
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Hey, nothing wrong with Suzuki making a spiritual successor to Power Drift :P
Sort of an ignominious way for Sega's greatest game maker - and one of the most noted ever - to end his career at Sega, though.
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There's been quite a few games that have wowed the press and gamers at various trade shows only to sell rather poor at retail games like System Shock 2 , Okami, Viewtiful Joe , Oddworld Stranger, Beyond Good and Evil and so on .
So?
Typo it was 2002.
Yes it was.keep up.
If you we a SEGA fan SEGA pretty much owned that E3 with some stunning games on 3 different systems and Panzer Dragoon was hands down the best looking game for the show . Good times .
One of them but the press was more intrusted in Kingdom hearts than anything else.
Nothing going to change for the Wii U . Its selling like crap now, it won't be able to handle the next gen graphics (so it loses out even more when all the major development moves to the next gen) and worst of all is people aren't buying the Wii , they're buying 360's or PS3's /.So on all fronts Nintendo is losing out big time .
That's your opinion, its not a fact yet until the other players in the next console war appears.
SEGA fans not getting worked up about a new OutRun, New PSO, New HOTD, New VF , New Shinobi, New Panzer , New JSR games . Pull the other one at least there was always some game to look forward too , we didn't even have that this year and this is the year of the new consoles and SEGA is no-where yet again Its so depressing
You can mention all the emotive titles you want it doesn't change the fact that Sega hasn't bothered with E3 for neary a decade now.You keep giving us two examples but that's it. Why? because there isn't much to shout about where E3 and sega is concerned. you should be use to it now instead of bellyaching about something that sega has only been good in for two E3s.
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I don't understand why they keep canceling games, either.
Hopefully, the constant stream of revenue from the west will make them more risk prone. They're damn cowardly at this point.
Because they didn't have enough money to continue with half of them. We also saw this when they released BINARY DOMAIN among others but didn't give it a proper marketing campaign. Also they don't have the safety net like they did when CSK was around. Oddly enough they then received a good finacial report since then indicating they could afford to do some of those games. But it depends if the report was strong because they stopped financing those games(which was a lot) as well as other cutbacks in comparison to the profits that they got.
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Sort of an ignominious way for Sega's greatest game maker - and one of the most noted ever - to end his career at Sega, though.
Eh, I doubt he intented it to be his last game.
I find it far more offensive when Sega put their highest caliber developers like Kodama, or that one director of Panzer Dragoon Orta, on producer roles of externally developed handheld only to be released in Japan. Or having Ohba to do Medal/Card Arcade games...it's rather disgusting imo.
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Eh, I doubt he intented it to be his last game.
I find it far more offensive when Sega put their highest caliber developers like Kodama, or that one director of Panzer Dragoon Orta, on producer roles of externally developed handheld only to be released in Japan. Or having Ohba to do Medal/Card Arcade games...it's rather disgusting imo.
Same happened with Naka, but then...look at his record on Non-SEGA games....it's pretty poor despite making the Sonic franchise what it is today (well...he takes a third of the credit).
Was NiGHTS his or Ilzuka's idea? Perhaps Billy Hatcher is Naka's?
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Same happened with Naka, but then...look at his record on Non-SEGA games....it's pretty poor despite making the Sonic franchise what it is today (well...he takes a third of the credit).
Was NiGHTS his or Ilzuka's idea? Perhaps Billy Hatcher is Naka's?
Naka's Prope games aren't so bad. Like Ivy the Kiwi, Let's Tap, that Fishing game, (potentially Rodea) they are a little unique and seem to have the Sega flavour.
It's far more offputting if people like Ryuta Ueda, Kikuchi, Kodama, that Typing of the Dead director produce products like Kingdom Quest, Brain training, generic RPG's, iOS games etc. seemingly products to benefit from current domestic trends to boost the companies revenue....
Nights like Sonic was a 3 man Idea...Oshima did the Art, Iizuka the concept and Naka the gameplay. Billy Hatcher was a 2 man Idea between Naka and Shun Nakamura.
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So?
Other games sell like crap even after wowing the press and public and various shows ....
One of them but the press was more intrusted in Kingdom hearts than anything else
The likes of IGN, GameStop all had the SEGA heads giving interviews and were giving great write up on SEGA games with many of them saying Orta looked wonderful and pushed the X-Box like no other game . They we good times when SEGA all on 3 next gen systems had great games to look forward too and the SEGA teams pushing each of those system with great gfx.
That's your opinion, its not a fact yet until the other players in the next console war appears.
The likes Epic have come out and said the Wii U can't handle their next gen engines - so on that front there's going to be a huge gulf for Wii U games;more so when the teams shut down their 360 and PS3 piple lines to focus on next gen development and unlike MS and SONY who's console are still selling well and their games make up the charts , The Wii is nowhere . On all fronts (other than the Handheld) Nintendo is in trouble and is losing marketshare and 3rd party and retail support .
You can mention all the emotive titles you want it doesn't change the fact that Sega hasn't bothered with E3 for neary a decade now.
SEGA has bothered with E3 people like you used to post about how much floor space SEGA used to request for E3 . My beef isn't with you, it's with SEGA and SEGA poor showing; the lack of any talk of next gen engines and games for the next gen. If SEGA wants to be a serious player it needs to up its game or it will only ever be a bit part player and a company remembered and talked about more for its past times , rather than current or future titles .
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Was NiGHTS his or Ilzuka's idea? Perhaps Billy Hatcher is Naka's
Naka-san came up with the flight idea and to break away from SONIC but it was Iizuka-san that came up with the dream concept and the score attack system - Nights is his baby. Billy H I'm sure is Nakamura-san baby like Samba De Amigo is also his.
It's far more offputting if people like Ryuta Ueda, Kikuchi, Kodama, that Typing of the Dead director produce products like Kingdom Quest, Brain training, generic RPG's, iOS games etc. seemingly products to benefit from current domestic trends to boost the companies revenue....
Its an utter waste of talent and for SEGA there is no excuse with its massive Teams and far bigger budgets than the likes of small start up's like Prope.
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Eh, I doubt he intented it to be his last game.
I find it far more offensive when Sega put their highest caliber developers like Kodama, or that one director of Panzer Dragoon Orta, on producer roles of externally developed handheld only to be released in Japan. Or having Ohba to do Medal/Card Arcade games...it's rather disgusting imo.
The majority of the Japanese industry now makes their bread and butter on handhelds so what is exactly insulting about it? Though with the medal/card games its hard to tell, but the Sengoku series are major arcade titles so I honestly think it depends on a game by game basis.
Though I agree certain people's talents are being wasted on SEGA Networks, but since it's feeding the company's bottom line not much will change. It is worrying overall as I believe the mobile market is too volatile to try and build a consistent business on.
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But there should be a balance between the bottom line and art. What they've done is the equivalent of putting Van Gogh out on some filthy little beach to draw caricatures for tourists.
As I understand it, Sega has several games they release annually that will sale at least one or two million, and a few that are at least bankable. Sega therefore has room to start taking some risks and advertising their games so that they might have even more profitable games. Perhaps good games.
I find it so insulting that Crimson Dragon has to be made. That has so many implications to me. So what if Panzer Dragoon wouldn't make all its money? That's not what it's for, at a point. It is art, and should be continued, and the team should continue to make products, for art's sake. Games like Warhammer can make up the difference. No one will remember Brain Trainer or even something like 7th Dragon in a decade. Things like Valkyrie will be.
In the long run, it will hurt the company, as well. Those quick dollars on Marvel, and Aliens, and Golden Axe have done unbelievable harm to this company. It will kill the company's reputation, and dissuade people from buying from them. And I wouldn't blame the consumer. I personally trust a lot of companies more than Sega at the moment. I have a good idea that a game by Capcomor Nintendo will be good, because they have a reputation for excellence. Sega once did, too. I bought from them unquestioningly. For a while, though, it was like fifty dollar Russian Roulette, with five chambers loaded. I just don't trust them anymore. That's the price they decided to pay for solvency.
Art games can do well. Just ask Team Ico. Sega just needs to risk some advertising dollars. Not all of them do; but that's why Sega has all these goddamn RTS games: to provide a net.
Ancient American proverb: "You gotta spend money to make some money."
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The majority of the Japanese industry now makes their bread and butter on handhelds so what is exactly insulting about it? Though with the medal/card games its hard to tell, but the Sengoku series are major arcade titles so I honestly think it depends on a game by game basis.
Though I agree certain people's talents are being wasted on SEGA Networks, but since it's feeding the company's bottom line not much will change. It is worrying overall as I believe the mobile market is too volatile to try and build a consistent business on.
It depends on the handheld game, I think most RPG's published on the DS we aren't too interrested in...like those Mystery Dungeon games, Chunsoft games etc. Stuff like Rhythm Thief is totally fine.
Even if certain gambling/card/medal games are big in Japan it's still a waste...it's not what we want to see them working on, at least with traditional Arcade games you know that they continue their work like they did before. Did you know that music legend Mitsuyoshi did only Music for stuff like gambling-sims after Shenmue?
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Other games sell like crap even after wowing the press and public and various shows ....
The likes of IGN, GameStop all had the SEGA heads giving interviews and were giving great write up on SEGA games with many of them saying Orta looked wonderful and pushed the X-Box like no other game . They we good times when SEGA all on 3 next gen systems had great games to look forward too and the SEGA teams pushing each of those system with great gfx.
And yet they best game to Kingdom hearts IGN included. Not hardly what i call stealing the show. Now I see you keep going on about two E3's yet failed to name ones after that. This generation they really haven't done anything special at E3. Were also now seeing games being revealed outside of the event by Sega. Now get use to it. Obviously Sega hasn't seen E3 as an important event to sell their games in the long run. And it isn't. As you yourself keep mentioning about games wowing the event and not selling. Of course as usual it doesn't show anything of sega wowing and stealing the show. Which is the point.
The likes Epic have come out and said the Wii U can't handle their next gen engines - so on that front there's going to be a huge gulf for Wii U games;more so when the teams shut down their 360 and PS3 piple lines to focus on next gen development and unlike MS and SONY who's console are still selling well and their games make up the charts , The Wii is nowhere . On all fronts (other than the Handheld) Nintendo is in trouble and is losing marketshare and 3rd party and retail support .
And? There was a huge gulf of third party support when the Wii first appeared until the system started to become the market leader and most of them jumped on board. You keep bringing up older cheaper systems as an indication of the WiiU's failure when older systems have always sold better compared to a new system on the market. That's no indication that the WiiU is going to fail in the future.
SEGA has bothered with E3 people like you used to post about how much floor space SEGA used to request for E3 . My beef isn't with you, it's with SEGA and SEGA poor showing; the lack of any talk of next gen engines and games for the next gen. If SEGA wants to be a serious player it needs to up its game or it will only ever be a bit part player and a company remembered and talked about more for its past times , rather than current or future titles .
No its with me or you wouldn't have slandered me like you did in your initial post about E3. And you know full way i don't defend Sega blindly if i did then the whole saturn SOJ/SOA argument would never have happened or my criticism of their marketing tactics.
As for the rest? Sega needs to up its game? You won't find me disagreeing with you on that front. Across all the board. But i'm not going to worry or get angry about their lack of faith in a show which they haven't bothered to do properly for over a decade. I dont understand why anyone even expected something from them this year when you compare and look at their recent track record at the event. And were all starting to see some announcements of new titles(whether they will be big games or japan only games) already. And the live event Q/A session with Nagoshi talking about recently announced games may also have a hidden suprise. Dont fret about it it isn't worth getting worried about it anymore.
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But there should be a balance between the bottom line and art. What they've done is the equivalent of putting Van Gogh out on some filthy little beach to draw caricatures for tourists.
As I understand it, Sega has several games they release annually that will sale at least one or two million, and a few that are at least bankable. Sega therefore has room to start taking some risks and advertising their games so that they might have even more profitable games. Perhaps good games.
I find it so insulting that Crimson Dragon has to be made. That has so many implications to me. So what if Panzer Dragoon wouldn't make all its money? That's not what it's for, at a point. It is art, and should be continued, and the team should continue to make products, for art's sake. Games like Warhammer can make up the difference. No one will remember Brain Trainer or even something like 7th Dragon in a decade. Things like Valkyrie will be.
In the long run, it will hurt the company, as well. Those quick dollars on Marvel, and Aliens, and Golden Axe have done unbelievable harm to this company. It will kill the company's reputation, and dissuade people from buying from them. And I wouldn't blame the consumer. I personally trust a lot of companies more than Sega at the moment. I have a good idea that a game by Capcomor Nintendo will be good, because they have a reputation for excellence. Sega once did, too. I bought from them unquestioningly. For a while, though, it was like fifty dollar Russian Roulette, with five chambers loaded. I just don't trust them anymore. That's the price they decided to pay for solvency.
Art games can do well. Just ask Team Ico. Sega just needs to risk some advertising dollars. Not all of them do; but that's why Sega has all these goddamn RTS games: to provide a net.
Ancient American proverb: "You gotta spend money to make some money."
The bottom line is really this. The Japanese management have no clue how to run Sega. That has and always been the case so far. I thought with a few stock holders i use to know thought it might change but it hasn't but as long as they're making their money they don't care. Sega has really been a dominant and progressive company when Rosen was in charge of the company and then when SOJ took on Kalinske the company grew again under his direction allowing for Sega japan to make all sort of investments which they ended up screwing up. Recently with Hayes being in charge of Sega europe and then the entire sega west operation, he made good investments which are still paying off for Sega and helped the company surly start to climb back up the scale, but unfortunately for him he was still cleaning up Jeffery's messes(although he did help the company gain a good market share in the states) and he ended up getting fired/resigned due to a game we now realized should have been cancelled with the rest of Jeffrey's failed sega projects. Its probably about time that they hired a westerner to become COO of Sega overall. At least someone who knows what they're doing and not a glorified yes man. Let the SOJ developers do what they do best make great games and let someone else outside of japan run the business end. Its no coincidence that all of Sega's successes when it came down to business was when they had an westerner in charge.
As for the games. The games you mentioned do well in japan. That's the point and the problem that most people here are n't realizing and aren't addressing. When SOJ first stormed into the third party scene in the west, most of the titles that they released failed. The other half got canned. The games that they released in Japan however didn't. And because they were strapped for cash the management obviously wanted more focus on a market they they were being more successful in. But that has now lead to what we have here with sega failing to compete in creating a western style title or a game that has international appeal. The reason Sega themselves haven't addressed it is because in ther current gen certain key titles didn't perform the way they should have done this generation, they went into a market that they were doing well in but was growing at the time they entered it. The mobile/digital market. and now were seeing way too much focus on these type of games, the majority of them never being released in the west. it seems instead of fighting to get market share by creating a strong game like they use to they semi abandon the market and focus on what is doing well for them. That's what happened when they focused on using too many western studios to recreate their old Ip as well as new Ip for them. That's what semi happened when they hired Platinum. And that's what were seeing now with the PC market focus in the west. It may be good in the short term but without any actual Sega games to compliment these acquisitions, Sega as i said before has become a company of different game franchises and not a company that has a unified fanbase who are into Sega the company.
And unfortunately with the amount of money they do get, its wasted. Half the games they were making before they all got canned during 2012 weren't that expensive for AA to B level games. The problem was the sheer amount of games that they were financing to make, add the whole Platinum deal and a shaky bad report later and it went belly up. The problem with this is the fact that sega isn't a first party anymore they are a third party now. And they should act accordingly. Part of the reason why Konami and Capcom are successful is because they only concentrate on a small number of games and spend their resources on titles that are designed to hit big. They don't have to supply on a huge number for console, a huge number for digital and have subsidiaries making or buying other iPs which they have to pay for to continue development. Sega's corporate mentality is of what they were and not what they are. BINARY DOMAIN was an excellent game, but thinking about it, it was a game that came out at the wrong time. Considering that half the other companies have something lined up and ready to show, BD should have really been released and made for one of the next gen systems and not for the current systems. When you think that Nagoshi has something in the works for the PS4, it all seems like it was a waste of time. BD probably would have had a better chance if it was released as a launch title rather then coming out now. Also the fact that when it was originally scheduled to release it was originally going to be released in the same period of ALIENS COLONIAL MARINES another FPS style game which ended up being pushed back and of course was horrible but the point is Sega shouldn't have had two big games rivaling each other coming out at the same time in the first place. While i liked the SegaXPlatinum deal to be honest that was redundant in the situation sega was in. A deal like that would have worked if Sega was still making their own systems and wanted to attract new users to a game similar but not made by their competitors. Something they did in the past with the Contra like ALIEN SOLDIER. But the fact that sega was a third party it was a move that wasn't needed especially when the sega fans that would slavishly buy this type of game in the past was few and far between and would have perferred that Sega themselves tried to make a game of that caliber. In the long run that dal had mixed results anyway. If they just cut the number of game sthey actually produce and concentrate on a few titles outside of their franchises they do make they may see different results.
It also doesn't help when the management continues to invest in turkeys like that movie studio that are making movies that no one gives a shin about and still failing to ultilise their assets that they do have like TMS and Mazda. Why can't Sega make a game of a TMS property that TMS actually owns? How come Mazda can't make a movie based on a sega IP or create a ip movie that sega can exploit? Any other company would have done this years ago and they have, look at what Sony has done and they didn't even own Final Fantasy. And knowing Sega by the time they do want to make a PANZER DRAGOON game it wont be unique because there will be other similar games that will have been made and better exploited by then. Until the management changes in japan were all going to suffer with this incompetence for a long time yet.
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Jon, I am not sure what the cause of the outburst was, but I never said I was keen with the direction SEGA was taking, I was just resigned to the fact it is what it is and until they hit a major block then they will continue working on iOS titles. When SEGA improves again or make a worthwhile game, I will be there to support it.
However I would disagree on lambasting a title like 7th Dragon (After all, what makes Skies of Arcadia less insulting to Kodama's career than that title?) or how they should focus on art games. I would rather have a continuation of the Shinobi formula than a sequel to Rez or any artsy games SEGA has made. You talk about Valkyria being remembered a decade later thanks to its artistic nature, but a decade later both Shogun and Rome are remembered for their excellence in their genre and that is what SEGA should do above all else, be excellent in the genres they produce a game in.
It depends on the handheld game, I think most RPG's published on the DS we aren't too interrested in...like those Mystery Dungeon games, Chunsoft games etc. Stuff like Rhythm Thief is totally fine.
Even if certain gambling/card/medal games are big in Japan it's still a waste...it's not what we want to see them working on, at least with traditional Arcade games you know that they continue their work like they did before. Did you know that music legend Mitsuyoshi did only Music for stuff like gambling-sims after Shenmue?
Like I said it depends on a game to game basis. From what I have seen of 7th Dragon, I see nothing that should deem it an insult on anyone's career. Outside of perhaps pandering too much to one particular crowd, Kodama and imageepoch have crafted a game that would be liked by jRPG fans.
Likewise with the card games, it depends on a game to game basis. Code of Joker looks great for what it is whilst Love and Berry is terrible, it just comes down to the games and should not be judge solely on genre or type of game.
Also I believe Mitsuyoshi did music for SEGA Rally 2006, Feel the Magic, Maimai and Operation G.H.O.S.T amongst many other things, infact this is probably his career highlight...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ge5cIusac0g
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Oh, I didn't mean that as an attack or an outburst. It's more exasperation with the company. I hope you didn't take offense! I'm sorry if I came off that way.
I think something like 7th Dragon, while I'm sure it's a solid game, doesn't exactly stand up well to her past. The woman behind treasures like Phantasy Star and Skies of Arcadia being relegated to brain trainers and portable gaming is a bit insulting, at least to me. She's one of their top talents; she should be getting a big budget to make RPGs. It isn't that I have a problem with 7th Dragon, per se. I have a problem with the First Lady of RPGs making dungeon crawlers while Sega gives wads of money to Tri Ace or to buy some half assed studio in California for its half assed tech. 7th Dragon is fine if she's working on other games, too. I'm annoyed that isn't the case.
I think Shogun and Rome are great games. I think that they're also beneficial to the company in that they provide good press and a solid reputation. I think they have artistic merit, and I'm glad Sega produces them. I would go so far as to say that Creative Assembly, Sports Interactive and Relic outshine the Japanese teams at the moment.
I think 7th Dragon is fine for what it is. But it would be, to me, comparable to Nagoshi working on that bank game and doing little else for five years. I wish she could make a solid, big budget game. I wish Sega would let their remaining talent actually do something instead of playing it safe. If the Sega if today had existed in the early 90s, things like Virtua Fighter and Sonic and Virtua Racing would never have happened. Too expensive and too risky.
Incidentally, I'm actually rather happy that the bank game is Nagoshi's. It's two new franchises in as many years.
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You talk about Valkyria being remembered a decade later thanks to its artistic nature, but a decade later both Shogun and Rome are remembered for their excellence in their genre and that is what SEGA should do above all else, be excellent in the genres they produce a game in.
Yes but its not really a game Sega produces. Its from a studio that Sega brought. Its a sad state of affairs if Sega themselves won't be remembered for actually creating a solid game in 20 years time and all they're remebered for is churning out TOTAL WAR and FOOTBALL MANAGER.
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I never thought it was accurate or fair to lessen the greatness of the Total War and Football Manager (and now Company of Heroes) titles because they weren't born inside SEGA. It's like we're going back to that "SEGA DNA" nonsense, where a game needs to have certain "SEGA-ish" elements in order to be a proper SEGA title. It's like some sort of game racism... "gameism?"
Not published in Japan? Strike one. Not originally conceived in-house? Strike two.
Honestly, I think anything The Creative Assembly and Sports Interactive created under SEGA's ownership are games SEGA have produced. A SEGA employee is a SEGA employee. Just because a studio and IP are bought by SEGA doesn't mean that the employees and the titles created under SEGA's ownership are somehow lesser than those at Sonic Team or Ryū ga Gotoku Studio. I'm proud to list off a name of studios and say "The Creative Assembly" and "Sonic Team" in the same sentence.
Probably one of my favorite moves by SEGA recently was the inclusion of Shogun and Football Manager in All-Stars Transformed for PC (wish they were on consoles too...). Really made them all feel like they were of the same family (which they are).
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I never thought it was accurate or fair to lessen the greatness of the Total War and Football Manager (and now Company of Heroes) titles because they weren't born inside SEGA. It's like we're going back to that "SEGA DNA" nonsense, where a game needs to have certain "SEGA-ish" elements in order to be a proper SEGA title. It's like some sort of game racism... "gameism?"
Not published in Japan? Strike one. Not originally conceived in-house? Strike two.
Honestly, I think anything The Creative Assembly and Sports Interactive created under SEGA's ownership are games SEGA have produced. A SEGA employee is a SEGA employee. Just because a studio and IP are bought by SEGA doesn't mean that the employees and the titles created under SEGA's ownership are somehow lesser than those at Sonic Team or Ryū ga Gotoku Studio. I'm proud to list off a name of studios and say "The Creative Assembly" and "Sonic Team" in the same sentence.
Probably one of my favorite moves by SEGA recently was the inclusion of Shogun and Football Manager in All-Stars Transformed for PC (wish they were on consoles too...). Really made them all feel like they were of the same family (which they are).
I would have thought you know where i stand in that debate. That's not what i'm saying. The point is Sega should be remembered for the type of games that they are famous for. If were all going to say TW is all they can do then it is a sad state of affairs because Sega was built by the type of games like Sonic OUTRUN and so many "Sega DNA" titles. As part of the Sega family that TW has now become its not what Sega was built on. If SOJ continues to take a back seat and not even remotely create the type of games that they are envied for like PANZER DRAGOON, SHENMUE and BINARY DOMAIN, then what is the point? I dont want Sega to be just remebered for making and continuing to produce great TW games. I'd like them to be remembered for making and continuing to create great innovative titles from their main studios as well.
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To me the RTS games are the equavilent to the 2K sports series.
Like when Sega West lost the sports licence in 04' they looked elsewhere and they chose the PC RTS market.
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I never thought it was accurate or fair to lessen the greatness of the Total War and Football Manager (and now Company of Heroes) titles because they weren't born inside SEGA. It's like we're going back to that "SEGA DNA" nonsense, where a game needs to have certain "SEGA-ish" elements in order to be a proper SEGA title. It's like some sort of game racism... "gameism?"
Not published in Japan? Strike one. Not originally conceived in-house? Strike two.
Honestly, I think anything The Creative Assembly and Sports Interactive created under SEGA's ownership are games SEGA have produced. A SEGA employee is a SEGA employee. Just because a studio and IP are bought by SEGA doesn't mean that the employees and the titles created under SEGA's ownership are somehow lesser than those at Sonic Team or Ryū ga Gotoku Studio. I'm proud to list off a name of studios and say "The Creative Assembly" and "Sonic Team" in the same sentence.
Probably one of my favorite moves by SEGA recently was the inclusion of Shogun and Football Manager in All-Stars Transformed for PC (wish they were on consoles too...). Really made them all feel like they were of the same family (which they are).
It's not as though I feel like they're not great games. I just find it frustrating that Sega has to buy great studios because the ones they have in Japan are rubbish. And I know that's not why they were bought (good studios, expand Sega's profile and so on), but it seems sort of implicit to me.
I feel like they're part of the family, but in the States it feels like they're the only part of the family worth seeing at times. And it's not as though Sega really did anything. They bought a studio and let it keep doing what it had been doing. No ingenuity. They're Sega employees, but they'd have likely done the same things had they stayed with Activision (save, of course, their upcoming Aliens and Warhammer games, which I'm pleased to see).
When a bunch of Namco guys joined Sega back in the early 90s, fresh off of Ridge Racer, they got to work on Sega Rally, Sega Touring Championship, and by the end of the decade they were making Star Wars and Cosmic Smash. They were, for lack of a better term, assimilated into Sega's culture. I've always had the vibe that Creative Assembly and Sports Interactive were just sort of...there. A part of Sega, but not. I am glad that they're working on that Aliens and Warhammer game, that they're represented in All Stars, and that they helped port some Sonic games. I would like them to keep it up. I wouldn't mind if they took a stab at some classic Sega properties, as well. Maybe they could work on an SRPG. I wish Sports Interactive would do something like that as well.
It's like if Sega still had 2K (and I really, really, really wish they did). It would be upsetting if all Sega was churning out worth consistently buying were sports games. Right now it feels like the only good games Sega has been churning out consistently are good RTS games, with the periodic update/tweak to a now seven (!) year old fighting game and something Sonic.
On the topic of Virtua Fighter, have they forgotten that its now twenty years old? Where the hell is the anniversary blowout? I was really ready for VF 6 after all the teasing we got last year, between X Zone, Dead or Alive, Final Showdown and so on.
Maybe I'm just in a bitchy mood.
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Now I see you keep going on about two E3's yet failed to name ones after that.
Do you take the time to read what people post in their entirety ?
That year was a great show for SEGA with the likes of MonkeyBall 2, Orta, , SEGA GT , ToeJame and Earl ,Shinobi ,Beach Spikers and GunGrave all shown off
2003 wasn't too bad with the likes of O.TO.GI, Billy H, VF 4 Evo, Dororo, SEGA GT Online , PS Online III
and at least in 2005 you had the SEGA cinema showing off VF 5 , AB Climax, Chromhounds, HOTD IV, Sonic 06 . This year other than Sonic on a dead system it was a complete non event and this is year that marks the start of the new generation too
That is not just 2 E3's .
There was a huge gulf of third party support when the Wii first appeared until the system started to become the market leader and most of them jumped on board
No most were on board on day one I'll think you'll find and unlike the Wii - Mum grand and granddad aren't buying the Wii U; Its uttrely laughable to see Nintendo go from making a control so simple even non gamers could understand and use it, to making a controler that is huge and has more buttons that a PS3 pad .
You keep bringing up older cheaper systems as an indication of the WiiU's failure
You do - I don't . I'm just saying that even if the consumer doesn't buy the XBox 1 or PS4 in massive numbers they'll be buying a 360 or PS3 instead (read not the Wii) so MS and SONY will still do well still enjoy massive 3rd party support and their consoles will be the number one tickets for parents this Christmas (other than the 3DS) and yet SEGA is a non event on the 360, PS3 or PS4 or XBox 1 this year .
Nice one SEGA Japan .
I think something like 7th Dragon, while I'm sure it's a solid game, doesn't exactly stand up well to her past. The woman behind treasures like Phantasy Star and Skies of Arcadia being relegated to brain trainers and portable gaming is a bit insulting, at least to me. She's one of their top talents; she should be getting a big budget to make RPGs. It isn't that I have a problem with 7th Dragon, per se. I have a problem with the First Lady of RPGs making dungeon crawlers while Sega gives wads of money to Tri Ace or to buy some half assed studio in California for its half assed tech. 7th Dragon is fine if she's working on other games, too. I'm annoyed that isn't the case.
I think Shogun and Rome are great games. I think that they're also beneficial to the company in that they provide good press and a solid reputation. I think they have artistic merit, and I'm glad Sega produces them. I would go so far as to say that Creative Assembly, Sports Interactive and Relic outshine the Japanese teams at the moment.
I think 7th Dragon is fine for what it is. But it would be, to me, comparable to Nagoshi working on that bank game and doing little else for five years. I wish she could make a solid, big budget game. I wish Sega would let their remaining talent actually do something instead of playing it safe. If the Sega if today had existed in the early 90s, things like Virtua Fighter and Sonic and Virtua Racing would never have happened. Too expensive and too risky.
Spot on . I think we just have to accept that SEGA Japan that we did love is all but dead under Sammy . Its quite sad really to see what SEGA Japan has become even though there's still plenty of talent in the studio
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That is not just 2 E3's .
no you've brought up mostly two E3s. E3 2003 was crap and a lot of shite games appeared. it still doesn't lay any weight to why you are running around like a madman screaming about Sega's performance in E3 when they haven't performed or bothered with it for nearly a decade. It just smells of you trying to be seen as being the guy who says the tright things but ignoring all the facts.
No most were on board on day one I'll think you'll find and unlike the Wii - Mum grand and granddad aren't buying the Wii U; Its uttrely laughable to see Nintendo go from making a control so simple even non gamers could understand and use it, to making a controler that is huge and has more buttons that a PS3 pad .
No they weren't, the Wii didn't take off properly until several months after the initial launch. Up to then most gamers and some third parties were laughing and criticising nintendo over its backward graphics and the such.
You do - I don't .
Why don't you read your own posts properly? You've brought up the argument of the older systems outselling the WiiU numourous times.
Exampe 1: you said..
It can't sell now , its getting creamed by the 360 and PS3
Example 2 you continued to say..
The Wii U isn't sell - that's why its being dropped by 3rd parties and the bad part for Nintendo is the fact that's its not being out sold by the Wii, but by the 360 and PS3 .
Example 3Nothing going to change for the Wii U . Its selling like crap now, it won't be able to handle the next gen graphics (so it loses out even more when all the major development moves to the next gen) and worst of all is people aren't buying the Wii , they're buying 360's or PS3's /.So on all fronts Nintendo is losing out big time .
4 unlike MS and SONY who's console are still selling well and their games make up the charts , The Wii is nowhere . On all fronts (other than the Handheld) Nintendo is in trouble and is losing marketshare and 3rd party and retail support .
5
they'll be buying a 360 or PS3 instead (read not the Wii) so MS and SONY will still do well
All i did is respond to that stupid mentality. You brought it up, i didn't.
Spot on . I think we just have to accept that SEGA Japan that we did love is all but dead under Sammy . Its quite sad really to see what SEGA Japan has become even though there's still plenty of talent in the studio
Yet under them we had YAKUZA VALYRIA CHRONICLES and even BINARY DOMAIN as well as BORDERBREAK. Yes sega is really dead under sammy. ::) Mismanaged but not dead. but then so was Sega under CSK...
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no you've brought up mostly two E3s
No I've brought up quite a few and sorry even E3 2004 with games like SpikeOut, Sonic Heroes , Outrun 2 , OTOGI 2 , ESPN 2005 , Blood Will Tell, Astro Boy , Altered Beast is far better than what SEGA showed off this year - at least in that line up there was a couple of games to look forward and SEGA Japan were working on games . This year other than Sonic it's been a complete non event for SEGA.
No they weren't,
I think you find they were .
You've brought up the argument of the older systems outselling the WiiU
NTSG . You brought up older systems . I simply pointed out that both the Wii and the Wii U are selling like crap and have all but been drooped by the major parties (bar Ubi) How it will be the 360 and PS3 (at their super low price point) that mums and dads will be buying their kids for this Christmas, while the real gamers heads go for the PS4 and XBox 1. SEGA is nowhere on any of those systems or their follow ups this year . Sonic should be on the 360 and PS3 as well .
There's a reason why Nintendo made massive losses you know, there a reason why 3rd parties aren't backing the Wii U - Go and figure .
Yet under them we had YAKUZA VALYRIA CHRONICLES and even BINARY DOMAIN as well as BORDERBREAK
Says it all . Yakuza is that a series that's all but dead in the West ? Valyria a series that now reduced to a pissing web game ? Binary Domain an IP that is all but dead and you're getting really desperate to bring up a Arcade game;more so one that never been officially released in the Western Arcade never mind ported to the home .
If SEGA had balls and was the old SEGA then SEGA would have given the BD team another crack at the IP and this time brought it out early into the PS4/XBOX 1 cycle . It would have given the Val team a change to build on that amazing engine they produced, rather than reduce it to a handheld game and now a web game - It also would have had the team to make a sequel to SOA using the Canvas engine long ago .
Nope all we get now from SEGA is a bunch of cheap games, easy safe options and the odd Mega hit here and there . SEGA Japan is so far behind the likes of Capcom its not even funny any more. And the fact that all you can do is talk about past titles all but proves my point ...
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In fairness, Binary Domain has only been out a year, so that might still take a shot at it. Wishful thinking though. I know it won't be, which is a pity.
Was Sonic Heroes at E3 04?
You left out turds like Amazing Island, the Astro Boy I'm sure you weren't referencing and Virtua Quest. Blood Will Tell and Altered Beast were mediocre at best. Neither Otagi nor the good Astro Boy were in house. That leaves you with SpikeOut, OutRun and the soon to be sold 2k lineup. I suppose at least Sega Japan was trying, which is more than I saw this year.
Edit: I don't remember SpikeOut on the XBox being particularly good, either.
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No I've brought up quite a few and sorry even E3 2004 with games like SpikeOut, Sonic Heroes , Outrun 2 , OTOGI 2 , ESPN 2005 , Blood Will Tell, Astro Boy , Altered Beast is far better than what SEGA showed off this year - at least in that line up there was a couple of games to look forward and SEGA Japan were working on games . This year other than Sonic it's been a complete non event for SEGA.
Stop talking rubbish. You only brought up two. 2003-2005 most of those games were not revealed exclusivity to E3.And those e3s were crap and hardly memorable.
I think you find they were .
No they weren't.
NTSG . You brought up older systems . I simply pointed out that both the Wii and the Wii U are selling like crap and have all but been drooped by the major parties (bar Ubi) How it will be the 360 and PS3 (at their super low price point) that mums and dads will be buying their kids for this Christmas, while the real gamers heads go for the PS4 and XBox 1. SEGA is nowhere on any of those systems or their follow ups this year . Sonic should be on the 360 and PS3 as well .
Actually you brought it up, not once but nearly six times. and your still bringing up again. Obviously you can't read your own posts.
There's a reason why Nintendo made massive losses you know, there a reason why 3rd parties aren't backing the Wii U - Go and figure .
Just like they did with the Wii. ::)
Says it all . Yakuza is that a series that's all but dead in the West ? Valyria a series that now reduced to a pissing web game ? Binary Domain an IP that is all but dead and you're getting really desperate to bring up a Arcade game;more so one that never been officially released in the Western Arcade never mind ported to the home .
Your getting desperate. You just said Sega isn't sega anymore because they dont make great games. I've given you examples of the good sega games that was released under the sammy regime, i'll even bring you more. Whether or not they were successful or not doesn't mean they weren't good games. As you have stated numourous times.
If SEGA had balls and was the old SEGA then SEGA would have given the BD team another crack at the IP and this time brought it out early into the PS4/XBOX 1 cycle . It would have given the Val team a change to build on that amazing engine they produced, rather than reduce it to a handheld game and now a web game - It also would have had the team to make a sequel to SOA using the Canvas engine long ago .
Sega had CSK to back them at the time so of course they could go all crazy. But now they don't have that type of backing anymore so they can't go all out crazy. Its easy to say sammy sux because of this and that but that's the reality they dont have the resources to do that anymore.
Nope all we get now from SEGA is a bunch of cheap games, easy safe options and the odd Mega hit here and there . SEGA Japan is so far behind the likes of Capcom its not even funny any more. And the fact that all you can do is talk about past titles all but proves my point
BORDERBREAK is a current title with its updates so is BINARY DOMAIN. None of the 8th gen titles have come out yet. So no it doesn't prove your point at all but reveals that you are too infatuated by Capcom and the like that you want Sega to imitate them. Well just because sega didn't show their new games at E3 doesn't mean they dont have any new games to show. So grow up for gods sake. You are such a generalist. "Oh the wii u is going to fail in the next seven years," or " Sega is behind because they are not copying capcom", "Sega is behind because they have nothing to show for next gen or current gen". When sega themselves have revealed they got a couple a titles lined up for PS3 and 360 and Nagoshi confirming months ago that he is working on the PS4. Just because they didn't show anything at an event they haven't bothered with for 11 years now means all of a sudden in your topsy turvey mind that they are behind. This is why i dont take you seriously that much anymore because you've become too over reactionary over the tiniest thing.
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In fairness, Binary Domain has only been out a year, so that might still take a shot at it. Wishful thinking though. I know it won't be, which is a pity.
Was Sonic Heroes at E3 04?
You left out turds like Amazing Island, the Astro Boy I'm sure you weren't referencing and Virtua Quest. Blood Will Tell and Altered Beast were mediocre at best. Neither Otagi nor the good Astro Boy were in house. That leaves you with SpikeOut, OutRun and the soon to be sold 2k lineup. I suppose at least Sega Japan was trying, which is more than I saw this year.
And then they stopped trying and soon after they left it to sega west to show their games and then that failed they didnt bother. 2003 onwards has been lackluster E3s even 2005. And that was the show 2005 where Nagoshi was meant to reveal YAKUZA but didn't because he had an argument over the marketing. If sega showing shite games, or the following year where a stupid promo videos of games released for the arcades and a sonic game that turned into a turd is meant to be a great E3 for sega then be my guest. To me i expect better examples. and there have been but not at E3 for sega for a very long time. So TA acting like this when all the examples he's given of great E3 was over a decade ago proves my point that its just a personal vendetta rather than a genuine concern because of the fact Sega hasn't done anything good at E3 for years. So the reaction is ridiculous. He's acting that sega has had a great track record at E3 for years and they've just turned crap this year. Gimme a break.
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Tend to agree with you on that, Joe. E3 hasn't been a solid for Sega since 03. On the flip side, it doesn't mean that things should stay as they are.
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I'm not saying that either but i dunno why some people are acting disgusted and surprised over this either. I'd like Sega to storm an E3 or two but i'm not going to hold my breath over it. We all know by now that Sega beats to whatever drum it hears and it usually leaves us disappointed and sometimes excited and a few rare cases satisfied. But disappointment is usually what they seem to do to their fans the best. One of those things we have to get use to whatever form it may show up in.
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You left out turds like Amazing Island, the Astro Boy I'm sure you weren't referencing and Virtua Quest. Blood Will Tell and Altered Beast were mediocre at best. Neither Otagi nor the good Astro Boy were in house. That leaves you with SpikeOut, OutRun and the soon to be sold 2k lineup. I suppose at least Sega Japan was trying, which is more than I saw this year.
Well there's always going to be crap at untill you get to play the game you don't really know . The point was there was at least some games to look forward too and the AstroBoy (PS2) was In-House at the last project to be done by the UGA team before the merger with Sonic Team.
I don't remember SpikeOut on the XBox being particularly good
It was a bloody great laugh on LIVE in 4 player and a near spot on conversion of the game. The biggest let down was the adverage graphics and all the planned DLC and on-line extra's cut before the game made it out .
2003-2005 most of those games were not revealed exclusivity to E3.
Since when are we talking exclisve to E3 ?. I'm just saying SEGA E3 this was rubbish.
And those e3s were crap and hardly memorable.
There was good stuff to look forward too and far better than the shit SEGA offered this year .
Just like they did with the Wii
Nintendo made 1st lose ever last year and it was massive , it also all but made a lost this year . You see no-one is buying enough games on its Home consoles.
I've given you examples of the good sega games that was released under the sammy regime
Again you don't take the time to read what people say at all. I never said SEGA don't make great games, I said they don't take the risks they once used to bar the odd amazing titles here and there , there's too much boring and safe bets .
BORDERBREAK is a current title with its updates so is BINARY DOMAIN
BB is a Arcade game that is yet to come to Western Arcades , never mind get a Home port to consoles - To list that game is the height of desperation . BD a great game, but It's a IP that doomed never to see a sequel really .
Its easy to say sammy sux because of this and that but that's the reality they dont have the resources to do that anymore
Is this from the one that keeps on saying SEGA is bigger than Capcom or Konami ?. If Capcom can make next gen games and engines so should SEGA. Capcom already have new IP and a brand new Enegine read to go on the next gen platforms while SEGA doesn't .
Nagoshi confirming months ago that he is working on the PS4.
And he keeps saying SEGA is still SEGA and still takes risks - Yeah utter bullshit with SEGA's current line up and wow SEGA is making a New Yakuza game .
Your defense of SEGA and its showing is piss poor and its like saying because one's never worked - one shouldn't try and get a job, because one comes from a deprived background -one shouldn't try and better oneself . Sorry SEGA really needs to do better and stop letting down its fans and its once a great rep with-in the Industry.
I'm sick of the new game teases leading to utter disappointment , This site having cover stories of Yu Suzuzki , Crismon Dragon , Bayonetta II and the likes . Stuff that got nothing really do with SEGA anymore , but us SEGA fans are so desperate we're link them anyway. Just look at this forum hardly any talk of new SEGA games to look forward too and instead all talking about the past . Its poor really
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I acknowledged one Astro Boy was in house, but it was complete rubbish, and an embarrassment to UGA/Sonic Team. I frankly assumed you were talking about the Treasure Game, because the other one was best left forgotten.
SpikeOut was a fun laugh, but in the same vein as Zombie Revenge. It was hardly Streets of Rage or even Die Hard Arcade. It could have stood a bit more polish, to be sure. As for being a spot on conversion; are you referencing the arcade game?! That came out in 97 or 98, didnt it? If that is what you mean, the game should have been an early Dreamcast game, not one to come out at the end of the XBOX's life. It certainly looked like an early DC effort.
Yes, there will always be crap. My point was that out of your whole list, all the games were either shit or mediocre (Blood Will Tell) or not developed in house. The only exception is OutRun and the 2k games. And 2k wasn't exactly Japanese.
So really, you have one solid Japanese game and a bunch of western sports games by a western studio Sega bought. Sounds about the same as this year, except they didnt bother bringing the shit over here (which I prefer)and the sports games have been substituted by RTS games. Also, just like today, they kept the good looking Japanese games in Japan. You could swap VC for the Sakura World games (or at least those they got out the door).
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Well there's always going to be crap at untill you get to play the game you don't really know . The point was there was at least some games to look forward too and the AstroBoy (PS2) was In-House at the last project to be done by the UGA team before the merger with Sonic Team.
Are you serious? No one was looking forward to playing ASTRO BOY PS2 and that e3 was crap Not just a few but crap where sega was concerned. Of course this still doesn't even explain that using two E3's over a decade ago suddenly means Sega lost its way for this year's E3 when for a whole decade they haven't bothered. Do you think ALTERED BEAST PS2 and NIGHTSHADE was the best that they could do? And SPIKEOUT was a game no one noticed on the floor let alone buying the game which they ended up doing it as a gamestop exclusive. Next thing you'll be telling us that everyone was looking forward with delerious glee to the release of GOLDEN COMPASS. ::)
It was a bloody great laugh on LIVE in 4 player and a near spot on conversion of the game. The biggest let down was the adverage graphics and all the planned DLC and on-line extra's cut before the game made it out .
IRON PHOENIX was also quite a laugh....for different reasons.
Since when are we talking exclisve to E3 ?. I'm just saying SEGA E3 this was rubbish.
Weve been talking about sega hasn't bothered with E3, you gave examples of games being supposedly unveiled exclusivly to E3 first. Keep up.
There was good stuff to look forward too and far better than the shit SEGA offered this year .
No there weren't.
Nintendo made 1st lose ever last year and it was massive , it also all but made a lost this year . You see no-one is buying enough games on its Home consoles.
By the time the next systems will be out i will comment how WiiU is going to fail. Until then its too soon to say.
Again you don't take the time to read what people say at all. I never said SEGA don't make great games, I said they don't take the risks they once used to bar the odd amazing titles here and there , there's too much boring and safe bets .
Neither do you. Sega could afford to take those risks because they had CSK backing them. Now they dont. They have a backer which was created from their own assets. Of course they aren't going to go wild with making certain type of games. But the maangement i agree are a bit stuffy and stiff. They need a maverick like Kalinske or someone with sense like Hayes to run the Sega japan corp.
BB is a Arcade game that is yet to come to Western Arcades , never mind get a Home port to consoles - To list that game is the height of desperation . BD a great game, but It's a IP that doomed never to see a sequel really .
So because of that it doesn't count? BB has been Sega's successful arcade IP in recent years, enough for it to see spin offs in the digital dept. And BD yes may never get a sequel.
Is this from the one that keeps on saying SEGA is bigger than Capcom or Konami ?
They are. Because if you bothered to read my posts, Sega makes more games than both Konami and capcom combined and their assets are bigger. Whether they are more succesful is a different story.butt hat's due to sega having more fingers in the pie.
. If Capcom can make next gen games and engines so should SEGA. Capcom already have new IP and a brand new Enegine read to go on the next gen platforms while SEGA doesn't .
Because as i said before Capcom and Konami only focus on a select few titles. Sega for whatever reason focuses on a huge number of titles from their digital dept to console to arcade.
And he keeps saying SEGA is still SEGA and still takes risks - Yeah utter bullshit with SEGA's current line up and wow SEGA is making a New Yakuza game .
You just said they're not making anything for the PS4 now you acknoledge they making a YAKUZA game for PS4? Why the contempt for another YAKUZA. Well mr who thinks Konami and capcom shit gold, wow guess what? Another MGS. Wow another Dead Rising. Another bloody street fighter and other games done to death. Yet you seem more excited about those titles than that. Call yourself a sega fan good god...
Your defense of SEGA and its showing is piss poor and its like saying because one's never worked - one shouldn't try and get a job, because one comes from a deprived background -one shouldn't try and better oneself . Sorry SEGA really needs to do better and stop letting down its fans and its once a great rep with-in the Industry.
Dont be bloody stupid. Sega has already done that. What happened? Oh yes VALKYRIA didn't do as well...
So dont start knocking them because they dont seem to be copying everyone else..
I'm sick of the new game teases leading to utter disappointment , This site having cover stories of Yu Suzuzki , Crismon Dragon , Bayonetta II and the likes . Stuff that got nothing really do with SEGA anymore , but us SEGA fans are so desperate we're link them anyway. Just look at this forum hardly any talk of new SEGA games to look forward too and instead all talking about the past . Its poor really
BAYONETTA is owned by Sega for gods sake, sega is still involved with the sequel whether you like it or not. The crimson thing i agre with which is why i suggested they should call it After Sega rather than just report it as main sega news.
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I acknowledged one Astro Boy was in house, but it was complete rubbish, and an embarrassment to UGA/Sonic Team. I frankly assumed you were talking about the Treasure Game, because the other one was best left forgotten.
I don't , it wasn't rubbish at all - it was fun and true to the comic book . It was just too short and unfinished at shows all the signs of a mixed development - very much like Sonic 06 (which also have 2 teams working on it at different stages)
As for being a spot on conversion; are you referencing the arcade game?! That came out in 97 or 98, didnt it? If that is what you mean, the game should have been an early Dreamcast game, not one to come out at the end of the XBOX's life. It certainly looked like an early DC effort.
DC simple didn't have enough Ram to hold the games vast stages in memory all in one go- I think it was also confirmed by AV team for the lack of a port . X-Box version was near spot on port with some of the best 5.1 and Widescreen support seen in a XBox game with an fantasic and fun 4 player LIVE mode; I played with some of the Japanese Spikeout dieheards one LIVE and the way they played the game was a master class and a real eye opener in how to play the game . Brilliant times and where the game was only really let down with weak textures and some iffy simple models now and again .
all the games were either shit or mediocre (Blood Will Tell) or not developed in house. The only exception is OutRun and the 2k games. And 2k wasn't exactly Japanese
You're missing the point . When Team show off games untill we get to play them- no-one knows if they play like crap or not. The point was SEGA was showing off stuff and working on games and we had some stuff to look forward too , we're not even getting that now ....
So really, you have one solid Japanese game and a bunch of western sports games by a western studio Sega bought. Sounds about the same as this year, except they didnt bother bringing the shit over here (which I prefer)and the sports games have been substituted by RTS games.
No SEGA Sports games came out on consoles that's a big difference and unless you've got a super rig PC there the new CA games won't be much good to you. I never was a SEGA fan for PC games but their console and Arcade games and well any Arcade fan or console in the west in getting piss poor support from SEGA at the with next to nothing to look forward too.
No one was looking forward to playing ASTRO BOY PS2
I was given it was Tetsuya Mizuguchi and a UGA game (before the split)
Do you think ALTERED BEAST PS2 and NIGHTSHADE was the best that they could do
Totally different at the end of the day . Those games were being made when SEGA was going through a drastic merging of its teams in order to survive for starters . But at least it was 2 games from 2 seprate In-House Teams.
you gave examples of games being supposedly unveiled exclusivly to E3 first
No I'm giving examples of games SEGA showed off at E3 and the simple fact of the matter that E3 was the 1st time people saw JSRF, ORTA and GV in motion on the X-Box; which given it was on the X-Box platform was also going to happen with MS calling the shots.
By the time the next systems will be out i will comment how WiiU is going to fai
The Wii U is another GameCube . It will be vastly outsold by the XBox One and PS4 and this year I'll have a bet that the 360 and PS3 will sell better at Christmas - Sonic really should have been on those systems too.
Sega could afford to take those risks because they had CSK backing them. Now they dont
This from the one that makes out Sammy is massive , SEGA is bigger than Capcom or Konami ? . If Capcom can fund and make their own In-House Multi platform engine, if Capcom can fund massive AAA games on the consoles and also risk new IP then SEGA Japan really should too.
BB has been Sega's successful arcade IP in recent years
That goes without saying . Since the mid 80's SEGA have been a force in the Arcades even in the poor times of 2004 and so on (when the console team were average ) SEGA Arcade teams were still at the top of their game ; Very much like NCL Hand held teams are always brilliant no matter what.
Sega makes more games than both Konami and capcom combined and their assets are bigger
And yet SEGA can't fund new IP or take risks . Just one multi platform game from Capcom selling better than any SEGA IP you can to mention other than Sonic and Mario . Capcom have more multi million selling IP, Already have a new IP and a new next Gen and SEGA Japan ..... That's right they're nowhere to be seen yet again.
Because as i said before Capcom and Konami only focus on a select few titles
And other than SONIC and Yakuza what do the In-House Teams focus on consoles ?:That's SEGA trouble and why most people don't care about SEGA anymore . SEGA Japan needs to up its game and become relevant to console gamers once again - That means Multi platform support and making some big AAA games with an eye to the west and On-line gaming .
You just said they're not making anything for the PS4 now you acknoledge they making a YAKUZA game for PS4
Not its a given and like saying Capcom is making RE6 or EA making a new FIFA. We all know its going to happen
Another MGS. Wow another Dead Rising. Another bloody street fighter and other games done to death.
And guess what all those tiles sold better than any SEGA IP (other than Mario & Sonic ) this generation and its ok for SEGA to milk Yakuza , but not Capcom and Dead Rising ? (which at least was a new IP for this generation too)
Oh yes VALKYRIA didn't do as well
One game ? and a game that was reduced to Handhelds for its sequels ? and worst still the amazing Canvas engine only ever used in 1 home console game .
BAYONETTA is owned by Sega for gods sake
Get a grip its nothing to do with SEGA at all and its pathetic that SEGA fans still bring this title up again and again. Its a Platiumin game and their baby at the end of the day and you watch the title fall flat on its ass on the Wii U too
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I don't , it wasn't rubbish at all - it was fun and true to the comic book . It was just too short and unfinished at shows all the signs of a mixed development - very much like Sonic 06 (which also have 2 teams working on it at different stages)
The game was shit, TA. Treasure's version was vastly superior. But no one was crying out for either game.
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You're missing the point . When Team show off games until we get to play them- no-one knows if they play like crap or not. The point was SEGA was showing off stuff and working on games and we had some stuff to look forward too , we're not even getting that now ....
Your missing the point, anticipation is not what makes an E3, its whether the games were any good makes the event a success. None of those games were any good making it another wasted E3 event for Sega.
I was given it was Tetsuya Mizuguchi and a UGA game (before the split)
Strange considering he left way before then.
Totally different at the end of the day . Those games were being made when SEGA was going through a drastic merging of its teams in order to survive for starters . But at least it was 2 games from 2 seprate In-House Teams.
Which both subcontracted to other studios like RED who then subcontracted to china which was also what happened with ALTERED BEAST but that had development teams from the United states as well.
No I'm giving examples of games SEGA showed off at E3 and the simple fact of the matter that E3 was the 1st time people saw JSRF, ORTA and GV in motion on the X-Box; which given it was on the X-Box platform was also going to happen with MS calling the shots.
They weren't first revealed at E3. The point is that you keep coming up with the same two E3s and then trying to pass the crap E3s as an attempt that Sega has bothered with the event.
The Wii U is another GameCube . It will be vastly outsold by the XBox One and PS4 and this year I'll have a bet that the 360 and PS3 will sell better at Christmas - Sonic really should have been on those systems too.
Yawn, i never said it wouldn't sell. Strange your bet hasn't included the PS4 and XBO which is what i was saying all along. let's see how it performs against its actual peers rather than older systems that has a larger fanbase, a larger variety of games and are cheaper to buy.
This from the one that makes out Sammy is massive , SEGA is bigger than Capcom or Konami ? . If Capcom can fund and make their own In-House Multi platform engine, if Capcom can fund massive AAA games on the consoles and also risk new IP then SEGA Japan really should too.
1 i never said Sammy is massive. I said Sammy was successful. That's a difference. Two Sega is a bigger company than both Konami and Capcom because of the sheer size of the operation. The operation costs to run Sega is much higher than it is with the other two. I should know. I use to be a stockholder for the last 20 plus years.
That goes without saying . Since the mid 80's SEGA have been a force in the Arcades even in the poor times of 2004 and so on (when the console team were average ) SEGA Arcade teams were still at the top of their game ; Very much like NCL Hand held teams are always brilliant no matter what.
You said sega isn't doing it anymore and i showed you examples that they are and now you are agreeing with me that they are doing something right, when before you said they weren't. Go figure.
And yet SEGA can't fund new IP or take risks . Just one multi platform game from Capcom selling better than any SEGA IP you can to mention other than Sonic and Mario . Capcom have more multi million selling IP, Already have a new IP and a new next Gen and SEGA Japan ..... That's right they're nowhere to be seen yet again.
Because Capcom focuses on a small number of games while Sega doesn't. Have you actually seen the amount of games Sega releases on digital mobile alone? You add to what they were planning to release for consoles as well as the digital scape, just for japan you will start to get the picture.
And other than SONIC and Yakuza what do the In-House Teams focus on consoles ?:That's SEGA trouble and why most people don't care about SEGA anymore . SEGA Japan needs to up its game and become relevant to console gamers once again - That means Multi platform support and making some big AAA games with an eye to the west and On-line gaming .
No Sega should make games that have an international appeal and not just cater to the west. They tried that and it failed. You of all people should want EVERYONE to play a Sega game not just westerners. Everyone. Or is gaming just an exclusive for us white people to enjoy all of a sudden?
Not its a given and like saying Capcom is making RE6 or EA making a new FIFA. We all know its going to happen
So what are you bitching about?
And guess what all those tiles sold better than any SEGA IP (other than Mario & Sonic ) this generation and its ok for SEGA to milk Yakuza , but not Capcom and Dead Rising ? (which at least was a new IP for this generation too)
What are you talking about? You complain about sega releasing the same games yet start complaining when its pointed out that Capcom and Konami does exactly the same thing with those games mentioned. Is it all right for Konami and Capcom and not all right for Sega?
One game ? and a game that was reduced to Handhelds for its sequels ? and worst still the amazing Canvas engine only ever used in 1 home console game .
A game that showed the world sega still has it. Or have you forgotten?
Get a grip its nothing to do with SEGA at all and its pathetic that SEGA fans still bring this title up again and again. Its a Platiumin game and their baby at the end of the day and you watch the title fall flat on its ass on the Wii U too
No its a Sega game. Its owned by Sega and Nintendo wouldn't have picked it up without Sega's involvement so stop complaining and bitchin' and get with the times. Just because it doesn't fit with your mindset doesn't mean its not the way things are.
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The game was shit, TA
I thought it was quite nice just really unfinished .
Strange considering he left way before then
Yes it was an UGA game ....
GMR: Astro Boy began life as a United Game Artists (Space Channel 5, Rez) title. How much has the original game design changed since UGA was absorbed into Sonic Team?
MO: Nothing much has changed since the studios have merged. However, you could say that we are concentrating more on game development. UGA was located in Shibuya, where there are lots of fun things to do, whereas Sonic Team is located at Otorii, near Haneda Airport, where there is only a McDonald's—you know what I mean? [Smiles] Sonic Team's new environment was good for us.
Your missing the point, anticipation is not what makes an E3
It is to fans of corps . When SEGA shows off good stuff at game shows then all us SEGA fans are happy and got stuff to look forward too .
Which both subcontracted to other studios like RED who then subcontracted to china which was also what happened with ALTERED BEAST but that had development teams from the United states as well.
The huge difference was SEGA was tying to stay independent and avoid any takeovers and was strapped for cash (with CSK desperate to sell) That is not a easy time to make games or take risks .
They weren't first revealed at E3.
For the last time . The 1st time there were seen 'in motion' running on actual XBox Hardware .
Have you actually seen the amount of games Sega releases on digital mobile alone
Have you seen what Capcom and the likes of Namco do ? even the likes of Cave are a big deal on the mobile platform and when it comes to mobile Capcom is again way ahead of SEGA thanks to Monster Hunter.
. I should know. I use to be a stockholder for the last 20 plus years.
Really ? That's why you refused for years to believe that SEGA posted a loss ?. Don't come it , If Capcom can do it , there's no excuse why SEGA can't too .
Because Capcom focuses on a small number of games while Sega doesn't.
Really so Dead Rising, , DMC IV , Lost Planet 1,2 , Dragons Dogma , RE 5, 6 , M VsC 3,
Zack & Wiki, Sengoku Basara, SF IV (that's with out their HH and Mobile games) are a small number of In-House games ? Given Capcom have just some 800 staff its a very impressive figure .
You said sega isn't doing it anymore
Another than the odd magic title here and there -they're not sadly .
You complain about sega releasing the same games yet start complaining when its pointed out that Capcom
Bceausw while Capcom will mile RE to their credit they will also come up with new big budget IP each generation like with Dead Rising , LP, Dragon Dogma this gen . What did we get from SEGA Japan this gen other than Val and Binary Domain ?
A game that showed the world sega still has it.
2007 (when it was 1st shown) . Sorry mate we're in 2013 now and about to go into the next generation and SEGA is no-where
and not just cater to the west.
Then SEGA Japan is doomed , The west is where the sales and money is to be made on the consoles .
No its a Sega game.
They just hold some of the IP rights . Next you'll be saying Goldeneye 64 is Activsion game .
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I thought it was quite nice just really unfinished .
Everyone else thought it was shit. And it was.
Yes it was an UGA game ....
No it was a Sonic team game with UGA members involved.
It is to fans of corps . When SEGA shows off good stuff at game shows then all us SEGA fans are happy and got stuff to look forward too .
What, anticipating for a good E3 and then not delivering on it? That's what satisfy fans? Sega hasn't bothered or delivered on E3 for a very long time. Anticipation is different from having a good show that delivers and the actual satisfaction from it.
The huge difference was SEGA was tying to stay independent and avoid any takeovers and was strapped for cash (with CSK desperate to sell) That is not a easy time to make games or take risks .
There isn't a difference
For the last time . The 1st time there were seen 'in motion' running on actual XBox Hardware .
Nope, sorry wrong.
Have you seen what Capcom and the likes of Namco do ? even the likes of Cave are a big deal on the mobile platform and when it comes to mobile Capcom is again way ahead of SEGA thanks to Monster Hunter.
Not ahead of PSO2 or KINGDOM CONQUEST. So try again and keep up although i know you dont keep up to date on what SOJ actually does.
Really ? That's why you refused for years to believe that SEGA posted a loss ?. Don't come it , If Capcom can do it , there's no excuse why SEGA can't too .
Yes i was thanks to my late father,got anymore insults for that too? Which is why i would be in the best position to know if and when they posted a loss but not saying they haven't. Apart from being some reactionary who acts like the company lost everything because one department lost money compared to the other one which is what they have had . But that's got nothing to do with your initial question.
Really so Dead Rising, , DMC IV , Lost Planet 1,2 , Dragons Dogma , RE 5, 6 , M VsC 3,
Zack & Wiki, Sengoku Basara, SF IV (that's with out their HH and Mobile games) are a small number of In-House games ? Given Capcom have just some 800 staff its a very impressive figure
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Compared to sega it definitely is.
Another than the odd magic title here and there -they're not sadly .
Make up your mind will you, first you say Sega management is keeping talent down, now you are saying they are not capable of making good games anymore. Gimme a break
Bceausw while Capcom will mile RE to their credit they will also come up with new big budget IP each generation like with Dead Rising , LP, Dragon Dogma this gen . What did we get from SEGA Japan this gen other than Val and Binary Domain ?
SENGOKU TAISEN
BORDER BREAK
KINGDOM CONQUEST
Three new ip that was successful and released this gen.
2007 (when it was 1st shown) . Sorry mate we're in 2013 now and about to go into the next generation and SEGA is no-where
Stop twisting the question. You said Sega has released nothing this gen.And nothing good. Someone comes up with an example and all of a sudden it doesn't count. Deluded you truly are.
They just hold some of the IP rights . Next you'll be saying Goldeneye 64 is Activsion game .
Not some ALL of the IP rights which is why nintendo licensed the game from sega in the first place. dont bother bringing in stupid examples of a game that the company never owned. We had that argument and you lost it when everyone else said the same thing. Sega has always owned BAYONETTA, like they own GUNSTAR HEROES,like they own RESONACE OF FATE and countless other IP made by contract studios.
Then SEGA Japan is doomed , The west is where the sales and money is to be made on the consoles .
Like capcom? The games you keep banging on about are titles that both markets can play and not too western or too eastern. they have international appeal. You of all people should want that.
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No it was a Sonic team game with UGA members involved.
It started life out has a UGA game - Sonic Team then took over development with the merger of UGA and ST.
anticipating for a good E3 and then not delivering on it
I would expect every SEGA fan would have expected a far better showing from SEGA this year and even it was just news of PSO II on Vita and PC for the West, a possible Yakuza 5 translation - something for the faithful to look forward too .
There isn't a difference
There's a difference when you're in massive debit and trying to fight hostel takeovers which the board don't want . Not asking for Shenmue III here , just some more output from SEGA on the current and next gen consoles.
Nope, sorry wrong
Not its correct . The E3 demo of JSRF done just for the show and confirmed by the team the 1st time the game was shown off to the public and done in 4 weeks. Panzer Dragon Orta I remember it very well : we got 6 odd screen shots before the game was shown off at E3 . E3 was also the 1st time people saw the new look HOTD III running (after the outcry from the cel-shading look)
Not ahead of PSO2 or KINGDOM CONQUEST
Monster Hunter on the PSP is one of the best selling hand held games around in Japan way above that of PSO 2 on Vita
Which is why i would be in the best position to know if and when they posted a loss but not saying they haven't.
One read of Sammy website shows the losses SEGA consumer Teams have made over the years. That's why was it was baffling to see you deny those facts or the fact that the whole of the SEGA group posted an overall loss now and again.
SENGOKU TAISEN
BORDER BREAK
KINGDOM CONQUEST
C'Mon we now listing Arcade/Mobile games and trying to count them as new IP ? Please lets keep it to console games and btw Sengoku Taisen isn't really a new IP but one that goes back years and running on XBox Arcade hardware .
Someone comes up with an example and all of a sudden it doesn't count.
Of a made that came out in 2008 and where the sequels were reduced to a HH and the brilliant game engine never used again . SEGA should have given the sequel one more chance on the PS3 or at least made a new PS3 game with that brilliant engine . I'm on about the SEGA now in 2013 and they're really not good enough at the more bar a couple of teams .
Sega has always owned BAYONETTA, like they own GUNSTAR HEROES,like they own RESONACE OF FATE and countless other IP made by contract studios.
Owning IP is one think making and developing the games is quite another . No one really gave SEGA any credit for making Gunstar Heroes -everyone knows it's a Treasure game , just like Gradius V is a treasure game even if Konami hold the IP rights or F335 is a SEGA game even if they didn't hold the IP rights for the west .
Like capcom? The games you keep banging on about are titles that both markets can play and not too western or too eastern
Capcom RE 6 and Dragon Dogma,Monster Hunter 3 have all been multi million sellers this year . Games that people both in the West and Japan can enjoy. The Japanse market is not where you're going to make the big money on the consoles and the fact that SONY is brining out the PS4 in USA 1st all but tells you that .
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That goes without saying . Since the mid 80's SEGA have been a force in the Arcades even in the poor times of 2004 and so on (when the console team were average ) SEGA Arcade teams were still at the top of their game ; Very much like NCL Hand held teams are always brilliant no matter what.
I dunno they have been kinda slipping. Still no sight of VF6. And ever since 2010 they have only made a couple of rail-shooters, and revisions of Initial D, Border Break and Shining Cross
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I dunno they have been kinda slipping. Still no sight of VF6. And ever since 2010 they have only made a couple of rail-shooters, and revisions of Initial D, Border Break and Shining Cross
SEGA AM Teams have still done well with some great games and great looking games ; impressive given the games are running on tech that was behind the 360 and PS3. Also I'm sure VF6 is coming soon and no doubt will mark SEGA new Arcade board .
Btw I don't want it to look like I'm having a go at ROJM all the time. My disappointment and beef really is with SEGA Japan . I just wish,want them to do so much more and for people to be talking good of SEGA again
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I just wish,want them to do so much more and for people to be talking good of SEGA again
Perfect, TA, well said, this is a resume of much of what I think, too.
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It started life out has a UGA game - Sonic Team then took over development with the merger of UGA and ST.
No it was they who joined Sonic Team to finish ASTRO BOY.
I would expect every SEGA fan would have expected a far better showing from SEGA this year and even it was just news of PSO II on Vita and PC for the West, a possible Yakuza 5 translation - something for the faithful to look forward too .
Not really,and if you'd thought that then you haven't been paying attention. When has sega in the last five years made any announcements at E3? They usually do it outside the event.
There's a difference when you're in massive debit and trying to fight hostel takeovers which the board don't want . Not asking for Shenmue III here , just some more output from SEGA on the current and next gen consoles.
Funny because when i mentioned that you said it doesn't make a difference now all of a sudden it does? Keep on twisting.
Not its correct . The E3 demo of JSRF done just for the show and confirmed by the team the 1st time the game was shown off to the public and done in 4 weeks. Panzer Dragon Orta I remember it very well : we got 6 odd screen shots before the game was shown off at E3 . E3 was also the 1st time people saw the new look HOTD III running (after the outcry from the cel-shading look)
Sorry they didn't debut at E3.
Monster Hunter on the PSP is one of the best selling hand held games around in Japan way above that of PSO 2 on Vita
So was the two PSPortable games. Doesn't mean Sega has lost its way.
One read of Sammy website shows the losses SEGA consumer Teams have made over the years. That's why was it was baffling to see you deny those facts or the fact that the whole of the SEGA group posted an overall loss now and again.
Consumer not the company entire. And if you actually read any of the full reports they still made a profit anyway.
C'Mon we now listing Arcade/Mobile games and trying to count them as new IP ? Please lets keep it to console games and btw Sengoku Taisen isn't really a new IP but one that goes back years and running on XBox Arcade hardware .
Still sega isn't it? SENGOKU TAISEN is new this gen actually and had two updates since its release.It only came out around four years ago. And regardless on what platform its released on its still new IP.
Of a made that came out in 2008 and where the sequels were reduced to a HH and the brilliant game engine never used again . SEGA should have given the sequel one more chance on the PS3 or at least made a new PS3 game with that brilliant engine . I'm on about the SEGA now in 2013 and they're really not good enough at the more bar a couple of teams .
No you said they haven't released anything decent and then changed it to new for this current gen. The current gen started in 2006 and hasn't ended yet. So it still counts.
Owning IP is one think making and developing the games is quite another . No one really gave SEGA any credit for making Gunstar Heroes -everyone knows it's a Treasure game , just like Gradius V is a treasure game even if Konami hold the IP rights or F335 is a SEGA game even if they didn't hold the IP rights for the west .
Yawn the point is sega holds the rights and its the only place where you can have sequels using the name. So don't get clever with me about the IP rights especially when Sega paid them to make the game. BAYONETTA 2 is owned by Sega, licensed to Nintendo. deal with it.
Capcom RE 6 and Dragon Dogma,Monster Hunter 3 have all been multi million sellers this year . Games that people both in the West and Japan can enjoy. The Japanse market is not where you're going to make the big money on the consoles and the fact that SONY is brining out the PS4 in USA 1st all but tells you that .
Didn't you just say Sega should make western games? Here's a reminder...
You said...
And other than SONIC and Yakuza what do the In-House Teams focus on consoles ?:That's SEGA trouble and why most people don't care about SEGA anymore . SEGA Japan needs to up its game and become relevant to console gamers once again - That means Multi platform support and making some big AAA games with an eye to the west and On-line gaming .
My initial reply to your comment...
No Sega should make games that have an international appeal and not just cater to the west.
As you can see TA and everyone else reading this post, first TA says the west and now he's talking about international appeal. Repeating the exact thing i said to him before. You keep saying its not personal TA but it obviously is as you keep accusing me of things i never said so you can be popular with a bunch of uneducated sonic fans who don't know nothing. Well carry on,
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ROJM, your constantly insulting tone towards TA has been wearing thin for a while. You guys want to debate about obscure details, that's fine, but generally TA is able to do so without resorting to the kinds of personal insults you revel in. And now you're basically insulting everyone, saying that everyone else here is an uneducated Sonic fan? What is your freaking problem, man?
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Sonic Team to finish ASTRO BOY
ST took over UGA and with that a few of the UGA staff left .
When has sega in the last five years made any announcements at E3?
PSO II - How about that for a game 1st announced at E3 and yet no sign of the project for western PC or Vista's
Funny because when i mentioned that you said it doesn't make a difference now all of a sudden it does
I never said that at all , so don't come it .
So was the two PSPortable games
Sorry while they sold good numbers , its nothing to what Moster Hunter have sold on the Handhelds
they didn't debut at E3
Sorry they did - Not 1st announced , or the 1st time screen shots were shown to the press. But the 1st time for those games to be shown off running on XBox hardware.
Consumer not the company entire
There's also been at least 2 times when the whole of the SEGA group have posted a loss . 2008 I think was bad year for SEGA
Still sega isn't it? SENGOKU TAISEN is new this gen
Yes a SEGA game that 1st came out in 2005 and where I guess if you lived in Japan and we fluent in Japanese it might mean something to people otherwise I doubt it means anything to people here given the lack of Arcades or a home translation for the west .
No you said they haven't released anything decent
PSO 2 and Binary Domain, Sonic Gen/Colours say otherwise . I'll say again SEGA make the odd magic title here , The Sonic Team have some good plans but SEGA need to do far better and up its game .
Yawn the point is sega holds the rights
And yet everyone credits Treasure for making Gunstar Heroes or Guardian Heroes. In just the same way SEGA fans will always give credit to Lobotomy for Duke and Quake on the Saturn, SEGA for final Fight on the Mega CD even if they were the IP holders and they just handed developed/ported the games.
Didn't you just say Sega should make western games
Games with an eye to the West, Multi platform and with On-line - That's how you're make money this gen and by all account next gen too.
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ROJM, your constantly insulting tone towards TA has been wearing thin for a while. You guys want to debate about obscure details, that's fine, but generally TA is able to do so without resorting to the kinds of personal insults you revel in. And now you're basically insulting everyone, saying that everyone else here is an uneducated Sonic fan? What is your freaking problem, man?
Your banal posts has been wearing thin for a while too. Here's a tip. Why don't you read the beginning of when this "debate" started before you start jumping to your hero's defense. I didn't start any insults. As for the sonic comment i didn't say everyone either. So don't make out otherwise. But then again the uneducated comment was correct in your case.
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ST took over UGA and with that a few of the UGA staff left .
When exactly? That title was always Yuji Naka's project to deal with.
PSO II - How about that for a game 1st announced at E3 and yet no sign of the project for western PC or Vista's
One game doesn't make E3, try again.
I never said that at all , so don't come it .
You did actually.
Sorry while they sold good numbers , its nothing to what Moster Hunter have sold on the Handhelds
Oh now it doesn't count. PSO portable sold STRONG numbers not good numbers.
Sorry they did - Not 1st announced , or the 1st time screen shots were shown to the press. But the 1st time for those games to be shown off running on XBox hardware.
Wrong, E3 was when the game was playable not first shown.
There's also been at least 2 times when the whole of the SEGA group have posted a loss . 2008 I think was bad year for SEGA
Only 2? You just made out that they have been suffering for the last five years.
Yes a SEGA game that 1st came out in 2005 and where I guess if you lived in Japan and we fluent in Japanese it might mean something to people otherwise I doubt it means anything to people here given the lack of Arcades or a home translation for the west .
SENGOKU TAISEN came out in 2011 not 2005. What a joke, LOL.
PSO 2 and Binary Domain, Sonic Gen/Colours say otherwise . I'll say again SEGA make the odd magic title here , The Sonic Team have some good plans but SEGA need to do far better and up its game .
Better yes, but they have come up with the goods which you keep insisting they haven't.
And yet everyone credits Treasure for making Gunstar Heroes or Guardian Heroes. In just the same way SEGA fans will always give credit to Lobotomy for Duke and Quake on the Saturn, SEGA for final Fight on the Mega CD even if they were the IP holders and they just handed developed/ported the games.
No one saying they shouldn't give credit. The point is those games are owned by Sega. because the comments you will get is "Oh remember that sega game called GUNSTAR HEROES by Treasure?" And so on. So better luck next time. Keep throwing in Final Fight and other stupid examples. Like i said your fans will believe you but that isn't even a comparison. It doesn't change the reality of Sega owning the game and the characters of BAYONETTA.
Games with an eye to the West, Multi platform and with On-line - That's how you're make money this gen and by all account next gen too.
Back to the west again now is it. I thought you wanted them to have international appeal. Make your mind up.
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When exactly
I think it was in EDGE mag that they confirmed UGA secret game was to be Astro Boy.
One game doesn't make E3
I answered you question and in the last 5 years PSO II was 1st announced and revealed at E3 , that's all.
You did actually
Nope, sorry.
Oh now it doesn't count. PSO portable sold STRONG numbers not good numbers
Never said they didn't count . Just saying since you want o bring up mobile platform ; That Capcom Monster Hunter is bigger than anything SEGA put on mobile.
Only 2? You just made out that they have been suffering for the last five years
2 times more than you ever accepted and sorry its not just for the past 5 years . I've been saying since for longer that SEGA consuer Teams need to do better - since they've made little profit since Sammy took them over in 2004 .
SENGOKU TAISEN came out in 2011 not 2005.
Go here... http://www.system16.com/hardware.php?id=730
And so on. So better luck next time. Keep throwing in Final Fight and other stupid examples
? SEGA made Final Fight for the Mega CD and every though they aren't the IP holders every SEGA fans give SOJ credit for brilliant work; just like they do for MD ports of Strider, Ghost N Ghouls and every MD fan knows and gives credit to treasure for Gunstar Heroes.
but they have come up with the goods which you keep insisting they haven
Well other than Sonic this year SEGA haven't SEGA had weak showing and seems to have nothing ready for the next gen - that's the issue what SEGA been up to for the last few years on the consoles .
Back to the west again now is it.
The fact of the matter is the USA is where you make the money on the consoles these days . So like it or not you have to cater for the West and SOJ needs to do far better on that score.
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Wait I though PSO2 was announced at Pax East, not E3.
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I was actually under the impression that Astro Boy was a UGA game prior to the merger, and that part of the games failure had to do with most of the team leaving after UGA was gobbled up. Regardless, the game was abysmal. GameInformer compared it (negatively) to Gex for Christ sake. It was unfinished, rushed, whatever you want. It should never have been released, and was probably the worst game Sonic Team or UGA had made up to that point. Regardless of the rationale, that game was unforgivably bad.
Monster Hunter is certainly successful on mobile, but Phantasy Star Portable has also been phenonemally successful for that series. PSP outsold PSO by what, three to one, in Japan? It's also, I imagine, a big reason why Sega has really started churning out Phantasy Star games on a regular basis. Some have actually looked good.
On the topic of Sega and Capcom on mobile, Sega also releases a lot more on mobile than Capcom does, unless I'm mistaken (and very well could be). They aren't as desperate for big hits; lots of small ones. It's a less risky strategy.
Sega's consumer division hasn't made much profit since 2004, but they weren't making any prior, since what, 1996? They do need to do better, though.
As for not making new franchises, you're sort of right. Generally, it seems, the new franchises are gobbled up to ensure success. Fifth Phantom Saga being absorbed into Sonic 06 is a prime example. I wouldnt be surprised if Yakuza Kenzan started as a new IP that became a Yakuza game; same with Of the End. Psi Phi fizzled out, Sega Race TV was released. Feel the Magic was fun, and new. BorderBreak, as has been mentioned, is a great and successful game. Rhythm Thief was solid. Project Diva has obviously been a success.
We don't know they have nothing ready for next gen. That's a bit presumptuous. I tend to suspect they'll be showing more stuff off later in the year, like Germany and Tokyo. Virtua Fighter 6 and Yakuza are both fairly likely, I would say.
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I wouldnt be surprised if Yakuza Kenzan started as a new IP that became a Yakuza game; same with Of the End.
That's an interesting theory, but based on what Nagoshi has said, he always intended for there to be alternate-universe Yakuza side stories. But I think Yakuza Team did use Of the End as an opportunity to prepare and test out certain ideas that were later implemented into Binary Domain.
As for upcoming shows, hasn't it been the case in recent years that Sega makes most of their announcements outside of trade shows?
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Your banal posts has been wearing thin for a while too. Here's a tip. Why don't you read the beginning of when this "debate" started before you start jumping to your hero's defense. I didn't start any insults. As for the sonic comment i didn't say everyone either. So don't make out otherwise. But then again the uneducated comment was correct in your case.
Your entire perception of this situation is inaccurate, ROJM. No one here is a "fan" of either you or TA, nor of any other forum regulars. In fact, if you'd take time to notice, the lengthy debates between you and TA are generally ignored until they completely clog up threads that had previously been healthy, interesting and mature discussions. You seem to feel justified that "he started it" but it reflects poorly on your maturity nevertheless to continue to resort to personal insults. I'm not going to continue to respond to your jibes, so just let your opinions stand on their own without the schoolyard antics.
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That's an interesting theory, but based on what Nagoshi has said, he always intended for there to be alternate-universe Yakuza side stories. But I think Yakuza Team did use Of the End as an opportunity to prepare and test out certain ideas that were later implemented into Binary Domain.
As for upcoming shows, hasn't it been the case in recent years that Sega makes most of their announcements outside of trade shows?
It's certainly possible. I'm just skeptical. It seems much more plausible to me that they made a game demoing PS3 tech that became mature enough to show off. Yakuza had relatively recently become Sega's most successful IP in Japan since Sakura Taisen, and Virtua Fighter 5 was just a giant flop in the Japanese console market. Makes since to drop the new IP and convert to a more established brand to prevent another embarrassment.
This may sound a bit contradictory to what I just said, but I think Yakuza and Virtua Fighter would be the sort still announced at a show. MS has been pushing exclusives hard. Wouldn't be surprised if Sony pushed VF and Yakuza at TGS as a sort of counterblow. Virtua Fighter can still draw a crowd and Yakuza is one of the most consistent sellers in Japan. Sega also probably has a next gen cabinet on its way out the door and VF would be the most obvious (to me) show horse. It's also VF's 20th birthday, and Sega loves birthdays.
At least, that's how I'm looking at it.
As for the Yakuza side games, I thought he was referencing games like Black Panther or whatever it's called. There certainly hasn't been much follow up to Kenzan.
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Wait I though PSO2 was announced at Pax East, not E3.
E3 1st though it wasn't much of a trailer - no game footage and I don't think any system mentioned just short trailer saying it was coming soon.
I wouldnt be surprised if Yakuza Kenzan started as a new IP that became a Yakuza game
That does happen with many games , but with Kenzan that game actually started life out as a PS2 but it was always meant to be Yakuza game I think .
I was actually under the impression that Astro Boy was a UGA game prior to the merger, and that part of the games failure had to do with most of the team leaving after UGA was gobbled up
Yes that was my impression too
Monster Hunter is certainly successful on mobile, but Phantasy Star Portable has also been phenonemally successful for that series
Yes PSO sold well but Monster Hunter has sold better on the PSP and sold great on the DS too. I'll expect MH 4 to be another smash .
Sega's consumer division hasn't made much profit since 2004, but they weren't making any prior, since what, 1996? They do need to do better, though
They did break even in 2002 I think . But its madness that the consumer Teams have been doing so poor for so many years . They really need to sort it out and that to me is only done by making Muti platform games and more with an eye to the West ;SEGA needs more IP that can sell millions of copies
Virtua Fighter can still draw a crowd and Yakuza is one of the most consistent sellers in Japan. Sega also probably has a next gen cabinet on its way out the door and VF would be the most obvious (to me) show horse. It's also VF's 20th birthday, and Sega loves birthdays.
VF can still make money in the Arcades in the home its sadly a different story where the series is outsold by Tekken and even DOA 5 (I think) and even VF 5 failed to make the sort of money for SEGA than VF 4 did ; I'm sure VF will be great though . Yakuza is a decent seller but that's all it is the series has sold around the same number of copies for years now and a single game on the PS3 has never broke the million sold barrier and where as other corps will make up sales in the West , Yakuza just doesn't sell well overhere. SEGA Japan needs a few more major IP that can sell well in Japan and the west and ones that can break the million sold barrier if their Teams are to make profits on any sort of consistence level