Author Topic: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout  (Read 101030 times)

Offline George

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #120 on: July 20, 2014, 07:51:34 am »
Halo 3 sold 14.5 million units, but how much of that was spent on advertising the game? That's the great thing about PC, you can make a game and just release it and still have the ability to sell more than 14 million units (see Minecraft).

Gears of War only did 5 million and that was one of the biggest Xbox titles, almost being beat by Gary's mod an add-on on PC. Your argument is so flawed. The Last of Us, considering one of the greatest games last gen only did 6 million. Uncharted 3 did less than 4 million and was outsold by a modification add-on for Half-Life 2.

Console games are on a decline, believe it or not. When GTAV comes out on PS4/Xbox One and PC, where do you think it will sell more? Get over it. PC games outside of like 3-4 franchise all don't sell that much on console.


Sony Exclusives:
Gran Turismo 5: 10.66 million
The Last of Us: 6 million
MGS4: 6 million
Uncharted 3: 3.8 million (no increase...)
Uncharted 2: 3.8 million
Heavy Rain: 1.5 million

Microsoft Exclusives
Halo 3: 14.5 million
Gears of War: 5 million
Gears of War 2: 5 million
Halo 4: 4 million (massive drop) (not much is posted by MS, making me believe it didn't do better than 3)

Also the HALO brand at the time of Halo 4 only generated $.3.38 billion dollars since 2012. Dwarfed by the 10 billion dollars that World of Warcraft, a PC exclusive, has made. Halo has also had a massive ad campaign.


PC top sellers:
Minecraft: 16+ million
World of Warcraft: 14 million and 10 billion in revenue (unmatched)
Diablo III: 12 million
The Sims 3: 10 million
Guild Wars: 6.5 million
Gary's Mod (4.8 million)
Half Life 2: (6.5 million RETAIL, not counting steam sales)

https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo3 < halo 3 sales source.
http://www.videogamer.com/xbox360/halo_4/news/halo_4_sales_in_the_region_of_4_million_next_game_in_series_already_underway.html (Halo 4)


The issue with sales on PC is that Valve refuses to give out numbers on their end because they think sales numbers are meaningless.
http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/04/21/valve-digital-games-charts-are-a-step-backwards-for-the-industry/


Have fun thinking backwards TA. There is a reason why Sony is investing in indie devs that make PC games, because its where the creativity is. GTA, Call of Duty, Halo will sell... but none of them are doing Minecraft Numbers and without PC Minecraft wouldn't exist. (yes, Minecraft made a higher revenue that GTAV)

« Last Edit: July 20, 2014, 08:11:49 am by George »

Offline Team Andromeda

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #121 on: July 20, 2014, 09:14:34 am »
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Halo 3 sold 14.5 million units, but how much of that was spent on advertising the game? That's the great thing about PC, you can make a game and just release it and still have the ability to sell more than 14 million units (see Minecraft)


Minecraft sells 13 million plus on the XBox 360 and lets not even kid ourself's that the likes of Warcraft, Starcarft weren't pushed by big PR spends


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The Last of Us, considering one of the greatest games last gen only did 6 million.


Yes great sales for a brand new IP and one that sold at full retail price those sales are right up there with Sonic 2 on the Mega Drive (you know in the so called good old days)  . What was the best selling PC game of 2013 at full retail price ? I'll be amazed if the game ever came close to 5 million .


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When GTAV comes out on PS4/Xbox One and PC, where do you think it will sell more


Well I doubt it when they haven't even been out for a year and critical mass of a console doesn't come in until some 3 years down the line  . GTA 6 on the XBox 1 and PS4 I put to you, will sell more than any PC game you could care to mention . Do you want that bet now ?


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Console games are on a decline


Sales don't back that argument up and the current consoles and uptake for the XBox 1 and PS4 are better than those for the 360.PS3, PS, Mega Drive, Snes and even the PS2 . So to make out consoles sales are declined is laughable  Watchdogs has smashed most records and sold over 5 million in a matter of months .


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Halo 4: 4 million (massive drop) (not much is posted by MS, making me believe it didn't do better than 3)


Sigh ... Most franchises will see a decline when then ship at the tail end of the console life . Tell me this , did Sonic and Knuckles sell as well as Sonic 1 and II  on the Mega Drive? Did Yoshi Island sell as well as Mario IV  ?


There are very few exceptions to that rule .














 
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Offline Aki-at

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #122 on: July 20, 2014, 11:00:04 am »
Its not happing to a greater extent .Just now now with internet and worldwide news its reported more its makes more news . There's most prob more people employed in the games industry than ever before . Look at the car industry there's been mass lay off's plenty of car corps gone bust and loads of them still in trouble. You going to tell me car sales still aren't massive ? 

And a large amount of the extra people coming into the game industry is not thanks to console gaming... ! The point isn't arguing about the size of video games, again another point you are trying to address yet no one was debating to this. Stick to point or don't bother arguing.

It is thanks to the success of PC and mobile gaming that has seen an increase in game developers, not because of consoles. You are burying your head in the sand if you think the console industry is helping to bring more jobs into the industry.

And don't come bringing in another industry, that's a false equivalence and a poor point to make.

And what Amazon don't sell million of games on-line are Walmart sales even counted these days in the NDP sales.

... Are you for real? Amazon's online sales are INCLUDED in retail sales. The point is PC games make most their money through digital sales, NOT RETAIL.

NPD has over 70% of the American market, they have more than enough data to come up with an accurate extrapolation.

Simple fact is when the likes of Ubisoft, EA and the like report their results they also  include digital and PC sales and even then the console versions sell more .

Okay, so? That means the PC industry is in a worse state when console specific publishers sell best on consoles? You overlook the fact the PC industry now has a sizable portion of those consoles sales and in time that will only grow.

Watchdogs a brand new IP has sold millions already and the Console versions sell the best and yet you make out the console industry is in trouble.

Are you using the whole "Exception that proves the role" methodology? Because one game does not show the market is doing better. Here are some facts for you to digest from the American market;

NPD 2014
June: Software sales down 3%
May: Software sales up 57%
April: Software sales up 17%
March: Software sales down 28%
February: Software sales down 11%
January: Software sales down 26%

NPD 2013 - Overall Software sales down 9% (Which includes a decline of 17% in December and 24% in November)
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2014-01-16-grand-theft-auto-v-best-selling-game-of-2013-npd

NPD 2012 -  (27% drop in December, overall industry decline of 22%)
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2013-01-10-call-of-duty-dominates-an-awful-2012-for-us-retail

NPD 2011 - Overall software sales down 8% (21% drop Y-O-Y in December)
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-01-13-us-sales-in-2011-fall-8-per-cent-after-weak-december

It shows a clear sign that the US console market is slowly declining, the elimination of B tier titles on console is evidence of that. Do you want me to drag in the Japanese market to further solidify my point about the decline of the console industry? Show me growth, not one title doing great. IF the revenue of the industry is generated by a select few games, that's not a healthy industry.

You say that like PSO was this amazing selling title before . Its never been an amazing selling title until SEGA brought it to the PSP and at last started to see some decent sales for the IP

Again you are missing the point. The fact is times change and consoles are not the be all end all for game series. Something you seem so strong to disagree with.

No try and I just said Dark Souls II sold better , that's all .

Dark Souls II sold more units but that doesn't mean it's sold better. What, Final Fantasy XIV has over 300,000 users and 2 million+ registered account? It's bound to have made more money and will make more money than the console versions of Dark Souls II, unless you want to weaken your point and include the PC version of Dark Souls II.

Never said it wasn't . The fact is console games sales are better .

You said this;

PC games sales are nothing to what they were in the 90's .

Which is a flat out lie and makes it out like there is no growth in the PC market.

And what fact? Give me proof or your sprouting the same nonsense you get picked out mouthing off. Show me your evidence or give up, because it's clear to see the console market has been in decline for a while now and you're consistently outdated knowledge of the industry has no place in this discussion.

Offline George

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #123 on: July 20, 2014, 11:01:35 am »
Minecraft sells 13 million plus on the XBox 360 and lets not even kid ourself's that the likes of Warcraft, Starcarft weren't pushed by big PR spends
First of all: Minecraft was created on PC and wouldn't be possible on consoles due to royalties charged by console manufactures. It has sold more on PC than 360. Also: Blizzard did have big commercials, so what? The game WoW made 10 billion dollars, of course its going into more marketing. What point are you trying to make lol.
Yes great sales for a brand new IP and one that sold at full retail price those sales are right up there with Sonic 2 on the Mega Drive (you know in the so called good old days)  . What was the best selling PC game of 2013 at full retail price ? I'll be amazed if the game ever came close to 5 million .


So now you are comparing a game from 1992, when gaming audience was smaller to a new game? Also 'full price' again, backwards thinking. Most Halo sales came with price drops, so its a mute point. This is when you know your argument falls apart.

Well I doubt it when they haven't even been out for a year and critical mass of a console doesn't come in until some 3 years down the line  . GTA 6 on the XBox 1 and PS4 I put to you, will sell more than any PC game you could care to mention . Do you want that bet now ?
This is retarded: 'Hey this one game will sell better on consoles then PC, that means that PC sucks.' sadly your argument is beyond flawed.  Nice cherry picking.
Sales don't back that argument up and the current consoles and uptake for the XBox 1 and PS4 are better than those for the 360.PS3, PS, Mega Drive, Snes and even the PS2 . So to make out consoles sales are declined is laughable  Watchdogs has smashed most records and sold over 5 million in a matter of months .

Cool stroy bro.
Sigh ... Most franchises will see a decline when then ship at the tail end of the console life . Tell me this , did Sonic and Knuckles sell as well as Sonic 1 and II  on the Mega Drive? Did Yoshi Island sell as well as Mario IV  ?

First of all stop bringing up sales of old games. The audience base is way larger now. Its not really comparable. But its funny that you said The Last of Us had good sales for a new IP. That game came out in 2013, yet you defended the low sales of a established IP like Halo 4 cuz it was in the end of the consoles lifespan. Halo 4 came out in 2012... The Xbox One wasn't announced till 2013.

Just admit that the Halo brand is dying already lol.

OK, in your perspective, Monster Hunter franchise is huge and all that junk because it sold 4 million units. You know, that means shit, correct? It is about revenue in the end of the day.

In a year Capcom as a company made 940 million in revenue:
http://www.vg247.com/2013/09/10/capcom-2013-financials-see-940m-in-revenue-several-console-titles-fall-below-sales-target/

League of Legends, a FREE TO PLAY game made $624 million. One game and thats 2nd place:
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/league-of-legends-revenues-for-2013-total-624-million-update/1100-6417224/

According to you, PC games don't make as much as console games make for publishers and according to you Capcom is doing great. But why is one PC game almost making more revenue than them and that one game is just getting more popular as time goes by? Funny even that article I linked states that console games are falling below expectations.

Oh, that's right. You're wrong. PC is doing damn well and Capcom isn't doing so hot. Don't be shocked if more Capcom games start releasing on Steam.. cuz ya know, they have to make money.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2014, 11:09:51 am by George »

Offline Team Andromeda

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #124 on: July 20, 2014, 11:30:14 am »
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And a large amount of the extra people coming into the game industry is not thanks to console gaming..


Never said it was. Just that consoles sales of Hardware games are very healthy and in some cases better than ever .


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yet you defended the low sales of a established IP like Halo 4 cuz it was in the end of the consoles lifespan. Halo 4 came out in 2012... The Xbox One wasn't announced till 2013.


It still sold millions and its not like Sonic III or S&K sales matched that of Sonic or Sonic II .


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Just admit that the Halo brand is dying already lol.


I'll have a bet now that HALO V be one of the best selling games of 2015 .


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Monster Hunter franchise is huge and all that junk because it sold 4 million units. You know, that means shit, correct? It is about revenue in the end of the day.


It means a lot of money and I'm sure Capcom consumer teams make more money that SEGA Japan consumer division does


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According to you, PC games don't make as much as console games make for publishers and according to you Capcom is doing great.


Console games sell better than PC games (never said PC games don't make money)  and no Capcom isn't in any serious money troubles .


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First of all: Minecraft was created on PC and wouldn't be possible on consoles due to royalties charged by console manufactures.


Sigh... There's a big and growing Indie scene on the consoles. And well most consoles games are made on the PC too. 


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Also: Blizzard did have big commercials, so what?


So why moan about Halo having a big push .


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So now you are comparing a game from 1992


That's the heyday for many here isn't it: The Mega Drive and yet it games sales are way below that of most 360 games and the likes of you make out the console industry is in trouble .


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Also 'full price' again, backwards thinking. Most Halo sales came with price drops,


Well no and you going to make out that the Sims 3 didn't have price cuts down the line .


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This is retarded




How its called the truth . 2 to 3 years down the line is when consoles have enough price cuts that then they can be sold at truly mass market price and when you see the sales take off .


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The audience base is way larger now. Its not really comparable


Yes and that why games sales are better. But now there's far more competition from smart phones, tables and the like for games . 


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But its funny that you said The Last of Us had good sales for a new IP. That game came out in 2013,
Exceptional for a new IP


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yet you defended the low sales of a established IP like Halo 4 cuz it was in the end of the consoles lifespan. Halo 4 came out in 2012...


I hardly call Halo 4 sales low and a simple counter to that is GTA IV, COD, AC IV, Fifa all sold millions in 2014 on the consoles did they not ?












 
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Offline George

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #125 on: July 20, 2014, 11:38:34 am »
Ultimate fail: My point being is that units sold is retarded. Its about revenue. When your company, that publishes a ton of titles and its revenue is almost matched by a free-to-play PC game, you need to worry. Yes. I did notice that you overlooked that fact. Shocking.

Meaning I'm not against marketing, but Blizzard games hardly have marketing outside of WOW, which only started years after it came out and gathered funding. The game has been out 10 years and last year brought in 1 billion dollars. That is more than Capcom did as a whole.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2014/07/19/world-of-warcraft-still-a-1b-powerhouse-even-as-subscription-mmos-decline/

If you want to make money, come to PC.

Do you think GTAV online will bring in 1 billion dollars in 10 years time? Do you think its online sales would bring 600 million in 4 years time (That is how old League of Legends is) on just digital sales? Nope. The future is digital and consoles can't keep up.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2014, 11:41:29 am by George »

Offline Team Andromeda

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #126 on: July 20, 2014, 04:57:50 pm »
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When your company, that publishes a ton of titles and its revenue is almost matched by a free-to-play PC game, you need to worry.


Free to Play is a fad (not that Capcom is making it's own) and there's a big difference to smart phone games to the bread and butter games . Sure you might talk up sales of the smart phone games and the like - the trouble is they never last and the corps that are making them are 1 game away from disaster. I doubt the makers of Candy Crush or Angry bird will ever match those games sales , ever 


Quote
http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2014/07/19/world-of-warcraft-still-a-1b-powerhouse-even-as-subscription-mmos-decline/



 The likes of Modern Warfair on the consoles make Activision over $500 dollars in less than a week , GTA Auto makes nearly a billion dollars in 24 hrs . You want money and big sales don't forget the consoles


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Do you think GTAV online will bring in 1 billion dollars in 10 years time


Its not meant to , and we'll have at least another 2 GTA games in 10 years time to bring in the cash too .


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The future is digital and consoles can't keep up


? Looking over all the consoles are now digital and well how the XBox One was going to be digital only . The simple fact of the matter is the UK and most of Europe broadband speeds are up to the task of going digital . Disc will be around for another 10 years or so   
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Offline George

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #127 on: July 20, 2014, 06:23:23 pm »
Fact: free to play is not a fad. Money is money. DOTA 2 and League of Legends are making more money every year, while consoles decline. You are wrong so you continue to say its a fad... Haha Moba games have been around since Warcraft III days.

Offline Nirmugen

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #128 on: July 20, 2014, 07:05:19 pm »
Time for a change of pace!  ::) 
No....really, TA , you need to stop, the situation is already clear right now. PC sales are strong and that's it. Current-Gen consoles are based on PC's anyway.


Minecraft sells in consoles because is Minecraft. LoL makes more revenue and profits in least years than the whole COD franchise from MW and that's a lot of money.


Remember: Sales doesn't tell profits. Also a big budget game needs to sells massively, of course with a bigger audience will be more sales but that's because there is more people playing and being introducing in video games than the 90's/00's . If anything the internet can tell us now: "Global trends sell" and in the videogames works well for the most prominent companies in the industry that they can market with all the mediums. That's all.


Ok, my original post:


MH 4 G/Ultimate has preordered  like a beast in Japan. I think this the Capcom Ultimatum: All the profits from that game need to be invested well. No ridiculous and expensive projects for fans only(3 extra-versions of SFIV, MVC3/UMVC3 with all the cost of the Marvel License, remaking games with much investments like Strider with especific demographic and expecting strong sales from that ). That was their mistake in the recent years.


If they fail again like investing all the profits from MH 4 in making a mobile gaming development studio without a research, Capcom will be beyond the red numbers. Really, they will be "Deep Down" if that happens  ::) .




Offline Mariano

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #129 on: July 20, 2014, 08:04:29 pm »
hello guys, i just found some interesting information, here is the link:


http://www.capcom.co.jp/ir/english/news/html/e140704.html


As you can see it seems that the new mayor shareholder of Capcom is this company call "Harris Associates", here is the link of the company if you are interesting:


https://www.harrisassoc.com/Harris/web/me.get?WEB.websections.show&HARRIS_019


So this are the news, if i am wrong about this please let me know, the document said that this will not change the business performance of Capcom but i guees we will have to wait and see. Have a nice day.




Offline George

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #130 on: July 20, 2014, 10:07:24 pm »
Time for a change of pace!  ::) 
No....really, TA , you need to stop, the situation is already clear right now. PC sales are strong and that's it. Current-Gen consoles are based on PC's anyway.


Minecraft sells in consoles because is Minecraft. LoL makes more revenue and profits in least years than the whole COD franchise from MW and that's a lot of money.


Remember: Sales doesn't tell profits. Also a big budget game needs to sells massively, of course with a bigger audience will be more sales but that's because there is more people playing and being introducing in video games than the 90's/00's . If anything the internet can tell us now: "Global trends sell" and in the videogames works well for the most prominent companies in the industry that they can market with all the mediums. That's all.


Ok, my original post:


MH 4 G/Ultimate has preordered  like a beast in Japan. I think this the Capcom Ultimatum: All the profits from that game need to be invested well. No ridiculous and expensive projects for fans only(3 extra-versions of SFIV, MVC3/UMVC3 with all the cost of the Marvel License, remaking games with much investments like Strider with especific demographic and expecting strong sales from that ). That was their mistake in the recent years.


If they fail again like investing all the profits from MH 4 in making a mobile gaming development studio without a research, Capcom will be beyond the red numbers. Really, they will be "Deep Down" if that happens  ::) .





You think releasing a bunch of versions of the same fighter is for fans? As a guy that bought SFIV and Marvel Vs Capcom 3 day one, let me say I will never purchase a Capcom fighting game the day it comes out. I'll wait for the re-release with new features in 8 months for 30 bucks.

Strider was never a big selling brand name. Honestly shocked they made a XBLA/PSN Strider game with bigger franchises sitting there.

Offline Team Andromeda

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #131 on: July 21, 2014, 04:33:43 am »
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Fact: free to play is not a fad


Its a fad that is simply not sustainable for big AAA games . Sure for games that are only meant to be played on the move or the kill off the odd boring 10 mins - your typical smart phone game . But games that people like to play for hours on end , I can't see it at all .


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Current-Gen consoles are based on PC's anyway.


? So that means nothing . The DC and XBox started that ball rolling where it used PC tech to power the consoles and Arcade's have been using PC tech for decades to power them. Next you'll be making out the Acorn Archimedes was an amazing sales monster due the the fact that everyone then used the RISC and that ARM powers tons of tech these days   


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LoL makes more revenue and profits in least years than the whole COD franchise from MW


Simply not true .  Minecraft made it's makers some $130 million dollars last year  - Ghost sales and profits dwarf that , that alone .


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Capcom will be beyond the red numbers. Really, they will be "Deep Down" if that happens


I like the pun . But with Dread Rising 3 already selling a million and with work going RE 7 and no doubt another Monster Hunter and a new IP and  a brand new gen gen engine already done . Capcom are in better shape that SEGA Japan consumer division at the mo .


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You think releasing a bunch of versions of the same fighter is for fans


Must be as they sell and people play them .


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Strider was never a big selling brand name.


Its a cult game and nothing more . Still doesn't stop people wanting sequels . SEGA fans love to see a sequel to JSR or JSRF for example - games which bombed at retail but will always remain a cult fav for fans .












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Offline ROJM

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #132 on: July 21, 2014, 05:37:00 am »
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No....really, TA , you need to stop, the situation is already clear right now.
;)
 
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The issue here is how you think a company measures success, you think of it as
units sold, but that is a very old way of thinking TA and that sort of thinking
is why Capcom is in deep shit.
;D
Quote
Oh, that's right. You're wrong.
:)

Says it all really...
« Last Edit: July 21, 2014, 05:40:31 am by ROJM »

Offline Team Andromeda

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #133 on: July 21, 2014, 05:55:45 am »
This this coming from the guy that gets Ubisoft, SEGA, Capcom profits totally wrong and even tries and puts down Gamestop has a games publisher ?


I just deal with the facts mum  and the fact are consoles games sell better, like it or lump it - Those are the facts .




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Offline MadeManG74

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Re: Capcom is allowing "Hostile Takeover" Buyout
« Reply #134 on: July 21, 2014, 08:06:28 am »
27 million people play League of Legends daily. 67 million a month.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2014/01/27/riots-league-of-legends-reveals-astonishing-27-million-daily-players-67-million-monthly/

DOTA 2 is picking up steam even quicker.

So if nothing else, we can probably agree that whether it be on PC or console, there's no accounting for taste.

Apologies to DOTA/LOL players.