Sonic the Hedgehog 4: Episode 1

[crackdude]

I don't remember Sonic Heroes being bad AT ALL.

It just wasn't great.. But neither were the reviews. It got 7s. It was good. Hated the ending but it was fun.

[Aki-at]

I don't remember Sonic Heroes being bad AT ALL.

It just wasn't great.. But neither were the reviews. It got 7s. It was good. Hated the ending but it was fun.

Lightspeed dash didn't work, tonnes of bottomless pits, terrible bosses, lame gameplay, etc ask most people who are not hardcore Sonic fans and I'll think you'll see a lot of them do not like Sonic Heroes at all.

Especially the Chaotix's gameplay, such a horrible idea.

[MadeManG74]

I'm surprised people are jumping on reviews to prove their point, when in the past the same forum members have been attacking professional reviewers for being incompetent and bias.

Do we think that GTAIV is better than Shenmue now because the Reviews and Sales reflect this?

I don't mind people liking this game, but falling on reviews as an argument is really puzzling, and weakens your stance as a whole. Don't forget when people were arguing with me that Half-Life was a 'bog standard' shooter, I could have just said 'look at sales and reviews' and it would have shown it was insanely high rated and sold incredibly well too.

[Sharky]

Sharky, who decided he was going to love this game way before he played it, has spoken. Keep it up, bro. Sonic Team 4 life.  

No, I desided that half of the 'problems' with this game are either not completely fucking retarded, like character model, green eyes and such and that the homing attack is at worst not that big of a deal and at best a pretty damn good addition.

And that, worse... Half of the things that make this game 'shit' to people like you would simply be small problems in an otherwise great game had this not been called 'Sonic 4'.

Hell, I was raving about how Sonic Team are shit years before most of you. So please don't give me that 'sonic team fanboy' tripe. But I'll happily give Sonic Team credit where it is due... and in turn not shit on them when the game is developed by Dimps... =|

Not to mention I just made a bloody long list of things I don't like about Sonic 4. What more do you need?


Also I am more shocked that suddenly reviews are not even worth mentioning anymore... What is this shit now? Sure SOMETIME reviews can be off, sometimes games like GTA4 may score more then Shenmue...

But I seriously doubt anyone here hasn't mentioned review scores in regards to quality of games before, when a vast majority of reviewers give a game the same kind of score you can usually give them the benifit of the doubt.

Hell, we have a review score thread stickied on this very forum with plenty of people replying, using and adding to it all the time.

At the end of the day Sonic 4 got a lot of good reviews, some bad ones. Are we now going to discredit all of those good reviews because sometimes we don't agree with reviews?

I would have loved to see this game get tons of shitty reviews just for the same people saying they're pointless now jumping on them to prove their point.

[Orta]

No, I desided that half of the 'problems' with this game are either not completely fucking retarded, like character model, green eyes and such and that the homing attack is at worst not that big of a deal and at best a pretty damn good addition.

Not once I complained about things related to art. Even after playing the game, I still don't know what to think about the art. The single thing I TRULY HATE about Sonic 4 is the music. The homing attack would be a proper addition if it was a reward like some sort of elemental shield, or an unlockable, not a permanent move that was created to aid aiming in 3D games.

[youtube:2cnzjxt5]z9RaaQoHJu4[/youtube:2cnzjxt5]

When even Iizuka says players "can easily and comfortably bounce off the heads of the enemies" in 2D games and "that really is part of the fun", the inclusion of the homing attack becomes even more difficult to understand. At best it stupidifies the game or, as I like to say, appeals to Mario fans.  

And that, worse... Half of the things that make this game 'shit' to people like you would simply be small problems in an otherwise great game had this not been called 'Sonic 4'.

Exactly. People feel the series (and by series I mean 1-3&K) is not being given the respect it deserves. What we got is what ultimately feels a bit of an half assed job trying too hard to be "classic". While it gets some things right, it fails at a number of basic things that made the original series some of the best platform games ever. It's fun? Fair enough, but calling it Sonic 4 does not feel right, because I enjoyed the hell out of Sonic Rush and I think that game is good for what it is. If it's called Sonic 4, then I have to judge it for being Sonic 4, and not Sonic Something. And remember, I never said the game is shit, I called it average. It's ironic that the "lesser game" (Colours) is shaping up to be much better in many ways, and that does not make sense in my head. Just because I'm vocal, it doesn't mean I'm the only one with that opinion. I once again point everyone to TSSZ's review.

Hell, I was raving about how Sonic Team are shit years before most of you. So please don't give me that 'sonic team fanboy' tripe.

:lol:

[CosmicCastaway]

Please don't fight. =(

[Aki-at]

Also I am more shocked that suddenly reviews are not even worth mentioning anymore... What is this shit now? Sure SOMETIME reviews can be off, sometimes games like GTA4 may score more then Shenmue...

But I seriously doubt anyone here hasn't mentioned review scores in regards to quality of games before, when a vast majority of reviewers give a game the same kind of score you can usually give them the benifit of the doubt.

That's never been the case here though, we've always talked about how gaming journalism is not good enough, I got into a fight from someone from IGN on the SEGAnerds forums about it for pete's sake. I'm sure the majority of the community has been against some reviewers, the very same guy who gave Sonic the Hedgehog 4 it's score on IGN is the same guy who trashed Unleashed without playing it full. The fact is though when you have places like GamesRadar that accepts bribes then it's very hard to take this industry seriously at all.

I mean if we want to go down that route, are you ready and willing to accept Nintendo is the far better developer and publisher than SEGA and have made many more games worthy of high apperciation than SEGA (Thereby justifying the amount of shit SEGA has gotten) and that games like Sonic and SEGA All-stars Racing, amongst others, deserve their low scores? Because I'm not. Super Mario Galaxy 2 is not going to end up being my GOTY.

I would have loved to see this game get tons of shitty reviews just for the same people saying they're pointless now jumping on them to prove their point.

I do not think people would have, they would have just played the game and come to their own conclusion. I did not (Nor Orta) get interested in Sonic Colours because a previewer said it looked good, we got interested in it because we thought it looked good.

[Sharky]

@Orta

Sonic has had the homing attack in all Sonic games since what Sonic Adventure? Why would they remove it now? When it actually makes the gameplay flow much better (imo)... There is no good reason why Homing Attack isn't a great addition. uncurling is a bad addition it actually breaks the flow of gameplay, can be a hinder and just looks pretty shit. There aren't real good reasons why homing attack is a bad addition, just like the Spin Dash. This is simply a matter of opinion. Is this what makes me a Sonic Team fanboy?

I find some of the music to be pretty crap, some are so-so and some of it to be just as good as the classics. Is this what makes me a Sonic Team fanboy?

Finally, had Sonic Chronicles been called Sonic 4 I would take issue... Had Sonic Riders been called Sonic 4 I would take issue. (And yes before anyone starts this shit, if Shenmue Online was called Shenmue 3 I would take issue.) But for every part of Sonic 4 that isnt as good as the classics theres another 3 that hit the nail on the head... Sonic 3 is, to me at least nowhere near as memorable or good as Sonic 2... Does that make it not good enough to be a 'classic'? Or is that only dictated by time between each installment?
Does this make me a Sonic Team fanboy?

I'm having trouble understanding what exactly made me this Sonic Team fanboy, Until Sonic 4 I haven't baught a single Sonic game since Sonic Adventure 2... Is that what makes me the fanboy?

[Sharky]

That's never been the case here though, we've always talked about how gaming journalism is not good enough, I got into a fight from someone from IGN on the SEGAnerds forums about it for pete's sake. I'm sure the majority of the community has been against some reviewers, the very same guy who gave Sonic the Hedgehog 4 it's score on IGN is the same guy who trashed Unleashed without playing it full. The fact is though when you have places like GamesRadar that accepts bribes then it's very hard to take this industry seriously at all.

I mean if we want to go down that route, are you ready and willing to accept Nintendo is the far better developer and publisher than SEGA and have made many more games worthy of high apperciation than SEGA (Thereby justifying the amount of shit SEGA has gotten) and that games like Sonic and SEGA All-stars Racing, amongst others, deserve their low scores? Because I'm not. Super Mario Galaxy 2 is not going to end up being my GOTY.

I'm not saying that I'm now a big fan of the critics and trust the reviews I read on a regular basis...

But you did touch on something that I see in a very different light. You are right there is a level of bias towards some companies in the industry. There will be critics that give Nintendogs a 10/10 becuase its Nintendogs for example.

There are also some that would give Sega games lower scores then I feel they deserve. No big conspiracy, just critics that have favourites... Not that hard to believe?

Which is why I take every good Sega review as a small victory... When I see good Sonic reviews. Well blow me the fuck down! So in an industry where everyone and their mother wants to shit on Sonic... Sonic 4 getting mostly 8's and some 9's I take as a great sucsess.

You know why this is happening? Because critics are judging the game on its own merits... Which is what critics are supposed to do. And no matter which way you swing it most people find it to be a very fun, good game that brings back the memories of their youth. Somthing I couldnt say for most Sonic games recently. Dispite the problems it might have.

[MadeManG74]

You know why this is happening? Because critics are judging the game on its own merits...

Just playing Devil's Advocate, but couldn't it also be because they are just getting caught up in the hype of the name and the fact that it's 2D?

For the record, I do think that Sonic 4 is probably a fine game, and I've always said that I think reviewers are generally in the right ball-park at least.

Having said that, I still don't think i'll buy it.

[Barry the Nomad]

I agree that going by one or two reviews is never a good way to form a general consensus on whether a game is good or bad, and that hype can skew some reviewers to give a game a positive rating (see Sonic Unleashed). However I just want to point out that when I posted all those positive reviews, it wasn't as if I was skimming the net for them, picking and choosing what would best support my argument. Those are pretty much the reviews as they poured in. For every negative to mixed Sonic 4 review that I came across, there were about three to four positive ones. Even when looking at the mixed reviews, they were generally positive about the game, but brought the score down due to length, price or physics that admittedly were said to not be game breaking at all. Just different. So that's why I put Sonic 4 in the "good" category. That and because my own review fell right in line with the general reviewer consensus for the game, and remember that I wrote one of the first Sonic 4 reviews so it wasn't as if I was basing my rating on what was generally being said. That was all legit Barry scoring.  8-)

I remember not to long ago on these very same forums, a certain Platinum Games release was being called "shit" by two certain forum members and review scores were used by proponents to back up the goodness of the game. I didn't see anybody being called out for citing reviews back then. Just saying.

[MadeManG74]

I remember not to long ago on these very same forums, a certain Platinum Games release was being called "shit" by two certain forum members and review scores were used by proponents to back up the goodness of the game. I didn't see anybody being called out for citing reviews back then. Just saying.

I can't remember if this is concerning me or not, but like I said, I always thought that reviewers were generally (generally being the operative word) correct. So if it was me, then I wasn't really being out of character.

I just find it strange when Sharky and Crackdude (Can't remember if you have done it much though Barry) used to bash reviewers at every opportunity, but changed their tune when Sonic 4 was doing well with them.

As I said though, the game is probably good, but I'd rather play Comic Jumper.

[Barry the Nomad]

I tend not to discuss reviews much outside of this topic. The only time I really get into reviewer bashing is when it concerns the few who are notorious for "hate rating" a game simply because they don't like SEGA or have a vendetta against a certain series. Considering I was out of the current gen video game world from 2003-2009, buying bargain bin games a few years after they hit shelves, reviews really didn't mean too much to me until just recently. Even then, I just read reviewers who I trust, and IGNore the rest.  

[Autosaver]

Yeah, I really don't get why people bash reviewers
LOLZHAVEZFUNZ

That isn't really the case when you have to shell out 60 big bucks on a product.

[crackdude]

Yeah, I really don't get why people bash reviewers
LOLZHAVEZFUNZ

That isn't really the case when you have to shell out 60 big bucks on a product.

Then don't.
Buy used or pirate or something. Play a demo.

Normally I get a demo, if not I try to pirate. And if I like it, I buy it...used (except for Sega usually). Play lots of stuff, pay less, fuck reviews.