SEGAbits Forums
Gaming => General Gaming Discussion => Topic started by: segaboy09 on March 13, 2011, 07:35:14 pm
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Join our fight for a Dreamcast 2 on facebook called
"Project Dreamcast 2". I have gotten made some bumper stickers, wristbands and maybe lanyards (to wear VMUs) if enough people support it. Thanks
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Who doesn't lol
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Ehhhhhh.... like a real campaign?
Pass. It'll never happen.
Better to enjoy retro Dreamcast gaming via playing old games you never got a chance to and buying new indie releases. Also, enjoy new SEGA games regardless of the console. That's the way to roll.
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At this point I'm kind of over it... If it happened, I would be delighted but I'm not exactly yerning for it anymore.
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That kind of wishful thinking can give you brain damage.
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That kind of wishful thinking can give you brain damage.
More like your lack of thinking will decay your brain, I prefer to remain optimistic thanks for the support.
Anything can happen with enough people backing it up.
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Ehhhhhh.... like a real campaign?
Pass. It'll never happen.
Better to enjoy retro Dreamcast gaming via playing old games you never got a chance to and buying new indie releases. Also, enjoy new SEGA games regardless of the console. That's the way to roll.
It will never happen with people like you not believing in it. Besides its gonna be a fun experience either way. I roll the same way but prefer to stand up and show my convection.
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Cause if you tryy YOU CAN DO ANYTHIIIIING!!!
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Ehhhhhh.... like a real campaign?
Pass. It'll never happen.
Better to enjoy retro Dreamcast gaming via playing old games you never got a chance to and buying new indie releases. Also, enjoy new SEGA games regardless of the console. That's the way to roll.
It will never happen with people like you not believing in it. Besides its gonna be a fun experience either way. I roll the same way but prefer to stand up and show my convection.
See, it's this kind of thinking that pisses me off. "It will never happen with people like you not believing in it." Bullshit. Simply, it will never happen. My "not believing" or "believing" is irrelevant. I don't believe because SEGA has said they have no intentions, and their business is now set up in a way that it cannot happen. We will never see a Dreamcast 2. The original Dreamcast is 13 years old and SEGA is a very different company compared to 2001. Getting back into the hardware biz would require a major overhaul of their departments and business heirarchy.
Even if SEGA did release a new console, however unlikely with the current SEGA, it would not be a "Dreamcast 2". It would have a brand new name and identity to compete with Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo. Take a look at Master System, Mega Drive, Saturn and Dreamcast. Not one was a "2". The best chance SEGA has is to wait until games go completely streaming. Then, either partner with a company and release a set top box an controllers, then feature a digital distribution channel. That way, they would have a third party create the hardware, and SEGA wouldn't have to press discs or create packaging.
Though that direction is even doubtful, as that is essentially XBLA and PSN right now, and Sony and MS have that all set up for SEGA already.
Personally, I'd like to see SEGA team up with a controller company and give us some official wireless pads. I'd also like to see PSN and XBLA give a little more identity to publishers downloadable games. Booting up a SEGA Channel within XBLA that lists only SEGA content, providing news, trailers and video features would be the next best thing and is completely possible for the current SEGA. Using a SEGA branded controller would make it even sweeter, and again that is completely possible.
Anyway, those are my thoughts. Please don't label me as the pessimistic nonbeliever. I simply am thinking logically. I think buying SEGA games and supporting the company is the best thing a fan can do right now.
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Segaboy, Sega do not need to have a console anymore the most important thing at the end of the day is videogames not the consoles. a real Sega fan will support Sega with or without a console.
As much as it seems unlikely to happen (in my opinion) the one thing that will convince Sega to make a new console is their games selling well, if you want to support Sega I suggest buying their great games because it is well documented that online petitions and campaigns just don't get results and are never taken seriously.
Truth is you never needed a Sega console to enjoy the best thing Sega had to offer and you still don't today... GAMES.
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You both make good valid points. I do buy there games to show my support. I'm taking some action, because I'm tired of just talking about it. Its gonna be fun eitherway. Obviously they are gonna most likely name the system something else, I went with Dreamcast 2 so it will be easily recognized by people. As for the Sega Channel (which I had by the way), games are now to large for downloading like that. So thats how we ended up with "PlaySega". Companies can do what ever they set there goals to, look at Microsoft. Who would have thought they would make a system like 10 years ago.
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I consider numbering consoles to be stupid. If SEGA ever made a "Dreamcast 2" I would get it, yeah, but I would freak out about the name.
The biggest reason PlayStation 2 beat Dreamcast was the DVD support first yeah, but the second reason was that it had brand recognition, not because it had good games. And it did not, for like two whole years.
Anyways, the only good thing about SEGA making a new console is that they would all be in one place (most likely some for mobile and PC still) so resources for higher quality games would be shared better. This would still be a pointless venture as SEGA would just lose so much money that they would be gone in three or four years.
tl;dr Not going to happen and I kind of do not want it to. I do not want to have to buy any new platform for years and years.
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I think I'd rather see SEGA Japan release more games in general.
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Hell I didn't even wanted to get into this gen of consoles, but my Xbox broke. Then my 360 broke. Now I hope to take my PS3 to the grave.
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Ì do gotta say that I hate having to own every single platform to be able to own each sega game.
I'd fully support a sega console just for that reason.
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Ì do gotta say that I hate having to own every single platform to be able to own each sega game.
I'd fully support a sega console just for that reason.
I agree 100% with you on that.
Also Barry had a good point about the controllers. The Dreamcast collection Sonic Adventure for the Xbox is hard to control with the 360 controller, I went back and popped in my Dreamcast copy. The analog stick is wayyy better on the DC. Same goes for Crazy Taxi
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I love the Dreamcast as much as the next guy, but the analog stick is pretty lousy and slipery.. The original Xbox's Duke has the best stick
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I'd rather see Sega break from Sammy and get purchased by Microsoft. Like all the rumors back in the day. Then there's a definitive Sega system, and loads of money to spend on R&D.
...Yeah obviously I only care about getting Shenmue III anymore but whatever.
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I'd rather see Sega break from Sammy and get purchased by Microsoft. Like all the rumors back in the day. Then there's a definitive Sega system, and loads of money to spend on R&D.
...Yeah obviously I only care about getting Shenmue III anymore but whatever.
Meh no thanks, I actually have nothing against Sammy, they rake in some big cash and I'm not a fan of Microsoft.
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Ehhhhhh.... like a real campaign?
Pass. It'll never happen.
Better to enjoy retro Dreamcast gaming via playing old games you never got a chance to and buying new indie releases. Also, enjoy new SEGA games regardless of the console. That's the way to roll.
It will never happen with people like you not believing in it. Besides its gonna be a fun experience either way. I roll the same way but prefer to stand up and show my convection.
See, it's this kind of thinking that pisses me off. "It will never happen with people like you not believing in it." Bullshit. Simply, it will never happen. My "not believing" or "believing" is irrelevant. I don't believe because SEGA has said they have no intentions, and their business is now set up in a way that it cannot happen. We will never see a Dreamcast 2. The original Dreamcast is 13 years old and SEGA is a very different company compared to 2001. Getting back into the hardware biz would require a major overhaul of their departments and business heirarchy.
Even if SEGA did release a new console, however unlikely with the current SEGA, it would not be a "Dreamcast 2". It would have a brand new name and identity to compete with Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo. Take a look at Master System, Mega Drive, Saturn and Dreamcast. Not one was a "2". The best chance SEGA has is to wait until games go completely streaming. Then, either partner with a company and release a set top box an controllers, then feature a digital distribution channel. That way, they would have a third party create the hardware, and SEGA wouldn't have to press discs or create packaging.
Though that direction is even doubtful, as that is essentially XBLA and PSN right now, and Sony and MS have that all set up for SEGA already.
Personally, I'd like to see SEGA team up with a controller company and give us some official wireless pads. I'd also like to see PSN and XBLA give a little more identity to publishers downloadable games. Booting up a SEGA Channel within XBLA that lists only SEGA content, providing news, trailers and video features would be the next best thing and is completely possible for the current SEGA. Using a SEGA branded controller would make it even sweeter, and again that is completely possible.
Anyway, those are my thoughts. Please don't label me as the pessimistic nonbeliever. I simply am thinking logically. I think buying SEGA games and supporting the company is the best thing a fan can do right now.
Quite simply... A brilliant, spot on post
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I am not going to get into this discussion.
I'll just say this:
There is a gaint hole in the consumer games these days, sure we have the occasional Street Fighter and Tekken, but for the most part Arcades are seperate from consoles.
The Dreamcast had over a hundred arcade games in it's line up of 248 US games even the last official games for the Dreamcast were all naomi ports and recent indie games like Pink Bullets and Fast Striker are Arcade Neo-Geo ports and you don't have that in the crappy modern consoles of today.
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That is because they usually put them on download services, like XBLA.
And the arcade industry is on life support, even in Japan it is not doing too good at all.
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Barry said it better than most of us could have, but we don't want to see SEGA go out of business, and it's never going to happen, no matter what any of us say.
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The Dreamcast had over a hundred arcade games in it's line up of 248 US games even the last official games for the Dreamcast were all naomi ports and recent indie games like Pink Bullets and Fast Striker are Arcade Neo-Geo ports and you don't have that in the crappy modern consoles of today.
Every SNK game ever is going to PSN with online play, and XBLA has KOF98UM, 2k2UM, Fatal Fury: MotW, SamSho 2, Fatal Fury etc etc.
As for Indie games, there's far too many to even bother making a list to prove you wrong.
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You know I am not in to the whole digital download thing so you may have a point.
But as far as I know Border Break, Virtua Fighter Final Showdown and several other SEGA games are not available outside the arcades. I could list maybe 15 titles by SEGA alone.
Your XBLA examples are mainly Dreamcast ports but I do believe more recent SNK games are on XBLA (don't know for sure) also the indie games I stated were Arcade indie games.
You'd find more arcade ports on the Wii then on another digital service (again not in touch with digital downloads but that's what I have observed several naomi ports that were scheduled for Dreamcast moved to the Wii and not XBLA).
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That kind of wishful thinking can give you brain damage.
More like your lack of thinking will decay your brain, I prefer to remain optimistic thanks for the support.
Anything can happen with enough people backing it up.
It's funny you think I have a lack of thinking. Anyone who knows the bare basics about SEGA knows they had good reason to get out of the console market, and the competition has not gone away. I love all the SEGA consoles (Saturn the most) and have owned every console of theirs since the 80's (those produced in the US). I doubt you could say the same.
This is a really old debate that was given up a long time ago because SEGA is not a hardware company anymore.
So are you going to give SEGA financial backing, or are you just talking a petition? A petition is not backing, it's annoying. I could get a lot of people to sign a petition for Apple to design and Manufacture a car, but that doesn't mean they will do it.
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Say one of us wins EuroMillions. Who here would buy a chunk of Sega? I'm dead serious on this, there have been awarded jackpots of over 100 million euros (140+ million USdollars)
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If I won millions, I would fund Shenmue 3. Imagine the hero status that would bring!
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In all honesty, if I were a filthy rich millionaire, I would fund Shenmue III as well. And then tell Yu Suzuki to keep the change and make whatever else he wanted.
Two months later I would be bankrupt and homeless, but it would so be worth it.
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I doubt you'd be homeless. Imagine how many dorks would take you into their homes for your service!
You can live with us. I'll let you play my copy of Shenmue 3.
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Hell, with 100 million.. Give 60/70 million to Shenmue. 20million on performance sports cars. Another 6 million on a bitchin' beach house. Never work again. Get chicks. Buy complete game collections of Sega consoles.
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Better yet, after helping with Shenmue 3 and setting up a comfortable lifestyle, buy every SEGA game and console and establish the worlds first SEGA History Museum. Charge people at the door, and allow them to play any SEGA title on the original console. They pay by the hour. Of course, they must sign an agreement that says they are responsible for any damage to a game or console. Hell, I'd pay $10 for a few hours of playing some 3D Master System titles and some original SG-1000 games.
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You know I am not in to the whole digital download thing so you may have a point.
But as far as I know Border Break, Virtua Fighter Final Showdown and several other SEGA games are not available outside the arcades. I could list maybe 15 titles by SEGA alone.
Your XBLA examples are mainly Dreamcast ports but I do believe more recent SNK games are on XBLA (don't know for sure) also the indie games I stated were Arcade indie games.
You'd find more arcade ports on the Wii then on another digital service (again not in touch with digital downloads but that's what I have observed several naomi ports that were scheduled for Dreamcast moved to the Wii and not XBLA).
You are wrong. Just the last week I bought Death Smiles Delux, Pink Sweet and Mushihimesama, and what are they if they aren't Arcade ports ? and there's quite a few more Arcade shooters on the 360 in Japan from the likes of G.rev and Cave, never mind There were plenty of SEGA Coin Up games that were never ported to the Saturn or DC too. Blame SEGA for the non appearance of the likes of Bordered Down, Race TV ECT.
Yes its far easier when you're the platform holder, but instead of endlessly put out 16 bit collection again and again. The people at SEGA Japan should wake up to the fact that they could male some wonderful Arcade complication packs.
Still SEGA fans have been wishing for this, since the DC days
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Hell, with 100 million.. Give 60/70 million to Shenmue. 20million on performance sports cars. Another 6 million on a bitchin' beach house. Never work again. Get chicks. Buy complete game collections of Sega consoles.
Dude, with 100 Mill you could chuck it into a savings account with ~5% interest and have a yearly income of $5 Million.
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Isn't there a risk involved in that?
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Yes, I believe it's called 'ennui.'
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Deep.
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I'm pretty sure it's less risky than investing in sports cars.
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Yes its far easier when you're the platform holder, but instead of endlessly put out 16 bit collection again and again. The people at SEGA Japan should wake up to the fact that they could male some wonderful Arcade complication packs.
The compilations we have been seeing so much of lately are almost always cheap outsourced releases. Might not even have anything to do with SEGA Japan.
Also, we are now friends forever because you have DeathSmiles.
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You are wrong. Just the last week I bought Death Smiles Delux, Pink Sweet and Mushihimesama, and what are they if they aren't Arcade ports ? and there's quite a few more Arcade shooters on the 360 in Japan from the likes of G.rev and Cave, never mind There were plenty of SEGA Coin Up games that were never ported to the Saturn or DC too. Blame SEGA for the non appearance of the likes of Bordered Down, Race TV ECT.
Yes its far easier when you're the platform holder, but instead of endlessly put out 16 bit collection again and again. The people at SEGA Japan should wake up to the fact that they could male some wonderful Arcade complication packs.
Still SEGA fans have been wishing for this, since the DC days
So basically in your opinion nothing has changed since SEGA left the hardware industry? I personally hate the industry with big corporations sucking consumers dry.
Currently it feels like the Saturn days when the industry had it's head up it's ass in terms of value for money. With 2 greedy money minded companies running the grown up scene and a moronic cheap ass console running the kiddie scene.
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I doubt you'd be homeless. Imagine how many dorks would take you into their homes for your service!
You can live with us. I'll let you play my copy of Shenmue 3.
Yeah, but the dorks still live with their parents and they would kick him out. lol.
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So basically in your opinion nothing has changed since SEGA left the hardware industry? I personally hate the industry with big corporations sucking consumers dry.
That was happing with in the DC day's, I really don't get this beef with big Corporations, because people could have said exactly the same think in the 80's and how it was so unfair that massive Corps like SEGA and Nintendo were killing the likes of ZX Spectrum ECT, or SEGA with its advanced 3D, was killing smaller companies in the Arcades that just couldn't compete
Currently it feels like the Saturn days when the industry had it's head up it's ass in terms of value for money. With 2 greedy money minded companies running the grown up scene and a moronic cheap ass console running the kiddie scene
What that's got to do with lack of Arcade ports?
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Uh... SEGA = a big corporation.
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Uh... SEGA = a big corporation.
Yep and has been the case since 1980's with CSK and now SAMMY. Big corps just with other outside interests other than gaming.
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So basically in your opinion nothing has changed since SEGA left the hardware industry? I personally hate the industry with big corporations sucking consumers dry.
That was happing with in the DC day's, I really don't get this beef with big Corporations, because people could have said exactly the same think in the 80's and how it was so unfair that massive Corps like SEGA and Nintendo were killing the likes of ZX Spectrum ECT, or SEGA with its advanced 3D, was killing smaller companies in the Arcades that just couldn't compete
They went out with the Market Crash.
In the 80s and 90s video game was a niche big companies like Phillips and Panasonic failed to make a mark, and SONY with PS1 was the first big conglormerate to enter the industry.
Currently it feels like the Saturn days when the industry had it's head up it's ass in terms of value for money. With 2 greedy money minded companies running the grown up scene and a moronic cheap ass console running the kiddie scene
What that's got to do with lack of Arcade ports?
Nothing, that was a seperate point.
The point with this post was that durring te SATURN era SEGA had turned into a big dum fucking company exploiting consumers of hard earned money with new hardware after hardware.
Not giving a damn about people who bought 32X and abandoing it immediately. With the Dreamcast a small under dog entered the scene which gave you value for money.
4 Controller ports from the get go unlikely the fucking PS2 where you had to buy 2 multitaps for 4 controller ports.
Built in Modem.
Pack in Browser.
Pack in Sonic Adventure (or Chu Chu Rocket in England)
As well as a Generator or Dream on Demo Disk.
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On the other hand when I bought that shitty Xbox 360 Elite RE5, it didn't have basic stuff like rechargable battries or a wifi adapter all the things that PS3 ships with.
MS is the running winner in US so they didn't give a damn about how much money consumers have to spend. SONY isn't anything better either.
The industry needs an underdog who prevent the industry from losing perspective and look beyong the profit and loss account.
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They went out with the Market Crash.
In the 80s and 90s video game was a niche big companies like Phillips and Panasonic failed to make a mark, and SONY with PS1 was the first big conglormerate to enter the industry.
The the likes of Spectrum did not at all, and no the PS was not SONY's or a Big Conglomerate 1st time to enter the Videogame industry. We had SONY and the likes of MS with the MSX, NEC with the PC-Eng and Philips with the CDI
The point with this post was that durring te SATURN era SEGA had turned into a big dum fucking company exploiting consumers of hard earned money with new hardware after hardware.
SEGA was always making new hardware in the 8 Bit and 16 bit days (Game gear, Mega CD ECT), and in those days a 4 to 5 year console life cycle was quite the norm.
Not giving a damn about people who bought 32X and abandoing it immediately.
SEGA continued to support the 32X for 2 years (God knows why) It should never have been made, but people say the same about the Mega CD, the Nomad, The Game Gear and even the DC.
With the Dreamcast a small under dog entered the scene which gave you value for money.
A new piece of hardware yet again, and small undergog ? $70 million one game project, $100 million on hardware development, $250 million on software development, $300 million on marketing (all money put up in the DC 1st year) SEGA was not the underdog (the likes of SNK could have only dreamed of spending that sort of money)
4 Controller ports from the get go unlikely the fucking PS2 where you had to buy 2 multitaps for 4 controller ports.
Built in Modem.
Pack in Browser.
Pack in Sonic Adventure (or Chu Chu Rocket in England)
This seems to be some anti SONY rant, rather than a debate on the Industry
On the other hand when I bought that shitty Xbox 360 Elite RE5, it didn't have basic stuff like rechargable battries or a wifi adapter all the things that PS3 ships with
And the wonderful DC didn't ship with Built in Rumble Pack , come to think of it neither does the PS3. Also consoles have their plus and minis points when it comes to hardware
MS is the running winner in US so they didn't give a damn about how much money consumers have to spend. SONY isn't anything better either
Both of them care and now this both of them are not charging consumers £60 per game like NCL or even SEGA did in the 16 bit days with the likes of Street Fighter II or Sonic IV
The industry needs an underdog who prevent the industry from losing perspective and look beyong the profit and loss account.
Well That's SEGA out then for starters and every corp is out to make money, why you think SEGA was or is any different I do not know. If the Underdog is your think why were even in the SEGA camp ?, they were hardly what anyone could call the underdog when compared to Commodore Atari and SNK in the 1990's.
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1. Do I want a new Dreamcast?
If by this you mean, a new SEGA console. Yes. Do I want it to be called Dreamcast 2? No.
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@ TA: Clearly you have valid points.
Which means either I am wrong or I haven't phrased things correctly.
SEGA with the Dreamcast was on the losing end, consumers hated the company the Japanese marketing campaign revolved around the uncoolness of SEGA. Their American market share was 1% thanks to an egg headed President who gave up too quickly and the consumer division internationally had not made a profit in quite some time. So SEGA was the underdog and they were operating with the consumers in mind.
Pack in Sonic Adventure + Demo Disk + Browser.
Built in Modem.
An Economical Price Tag.
All of this for a regular edition.
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Same thing with the Genesis, they were the underdog as they had the task to defeat 3 other competitors, while SNK was doing something different Nintendo had an illegal monopoly, and NEC was a bigger company financially and more tech savy.
You can read more on Tom Kalinske and his pitch before he became president, I am sure you may have already read it.
In the DC & Genesis period SEGA had the consumers in site, but once they got the money they lost perspective. It became all about the money (previously money was important but so were the consumers) so add ons like MegaCD and 32x were disasters, yet SEGA was so arragant that they released the SATURN without even informing Distributors and Developers.
They had lost sight of all Stakeholders and it was insane. Obviously none of the current 3 are as fucked up but they don't think about the consumer.
They have a million different bundles for varios prices which give you little value for money and the regular edition which is the most important one doesn't come with a pack-in game.
Nintendo never shipped with a Pack-In game but once SEGA started kicking their ass guess what happend, MARIO became a pack-in title.
Does that explain my point, once we can conclude this then maybe we can argue about the style of games SEGA made (arcade or otherwise).
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SEGA with the Dreamcast was on the losing end, consumers hated the company the Japanese marketing campaign revolved around the uncoolness of SEGA
And a lot of that was SEGA own making with the screw up of trying to think it could rip off consumers with 2 32 bit consoles.
So SEGA was the underdog and they were operating with the consumers in mind.
Like NEC was the underdog with the PC-Eng in the west ?
Pack in Sonic Adventure + Demo Disk + Browser.
Built in Modem.
An Economical Price Tag
Sonic was not pack in, for starers (and yes I have a DC from Japan, USA and UK) (I could also point out that in both the UK and America that VF was Pack in) , and given the Tech Sec on offer, the 360 was an Economical Price.
You can read more on Tom Kalinske and his pitch before he became president, I am sure you may have already read it
Oh Please, Tom would say anything other than admit he called it wrong inthe 32bit battle. In terms of Money in the bank, yes SEGA was the Underdog, but there again so is SONY NCL, Appel Vs Microsoft (maybe not so much now though lol)
It became all about the money
Its always about Money. SEGA didn't make games to lose millions , but to make millions
so add ons like MegaCD and 32x were disasters, yet SEGA was so arragant that they released the SATURN without even informing Distributors and Developers.
???. SEGA/MEGA was far from a disaster and you can blame the might Tom for the Saturn USA launch fuck up (SOA were too much for the 32X) . The Saturn was anything but a secret.
Nintendo had an illegal monopoly
SEGA too was fined for Price fixing and keeping it cart prices artificially High, thanks to the Console Monopoly both SEGA and NCL enjoyed
Nintendo never shipped with a Pack-In game but once SEGA started kicking their ass guess what happend, MARIO became a pack-in title
I seem to remember the Gameboy coming with Tetris . But don't get me started on NCL, they've always been a ripp-off company
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Maybe i'm not making my point clearly, or maybe your trying not to listen. I don't know.
Let's try this one last time.
I am talking about a comparatively smaller company, trying to gain market share by giving consumers more value for money.
And a lot of that was SEGA own making with the screw up of trying to think it could rip off consumers with 2 32 bit consoles.
That is my point, the mighty loose perspective of the consumers are only concerned with their profits. An underdog in this context can be defined as someone who is trying to break in to the market by doing everything right.
Oh Please, Tom would say anything other than admit he called it wrong inthe 32bit battle. In terms of Money in the bank, yes SEGA was the Underdog, but there again so is SONY NCL, Appel Vs Microsoft (maybe not so much now though lol)
I think you like arguing?
As I was clearly talking about his pitch after getting the job.
My entire argument is "as companies get bigger, they forget the interest of the consumers and are simply about maximizing profits and minimizing investments".
Its always about Money.
Ofcourse!! Everything is about money!!! But the way you go on to make it is what I am talking about.
- Drop the price of the Genesis and put the best game as a pack in!
This is giving value for money, in return consumers will confidently give you money. Given how the current market is getting segregated (Wii for Parents, PS3 for the International Markets with games like Valkyria Chronicles and Yakuza, and 360 by Americans for Americans with those FPS games and all).
Given how they have engineered the new gaming land scape, they are essentially working on different segments with in the market without going head to head.
I don't play the current games all that much so I can't give 3rd party examples but those who play Yakuza and Valkyria Chronicles don't play Halo or Gears of War.
Those who do own all 3 consoles, so they are the biggest losers of all.
10 years ago I only had a Dreamcast.
15 years ago I only had a Playstation.
Now I've owned all three (sold the wii recently, thinking off selling the Shi60).
Bottom line the current hardware runners are rip-off's, over pricing as their is no one to challenge them and force them to bring their A game.
That is my point!
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I am talking about a comparatively smaller company, trying to gain market share by giving consumers more value for money.
Maybe I should make it pretty clear then . MS lost like £4 billion on selling the X-Box console always at Huge loss, Im sure SONY have lost millions on until very recently selling the PS3 at a huge lose. So you're really going to fall down on that side, because both SONY and MS have offered value for money with their console hardware . Also even with games costing £30 Million to make, both MS and SONY ask less than what SEGA or NCL asked for 16 bit games
An underdog in this context can be defined as someone who is trying to break in to the market by doing everything right
Developing both the saturn and 32X is not doing anything right at all, far from it. So again on that point, I will not agree
I think you like arguing
I like debating, huge difference . I think you like blaming everyone else bar SEGA for the failure of the DC
as companies get bigger, they forget the interest of the consumers and are simply about maximizing profits and minimizing investments
So you must have hated SEGA since the 16 bit days then
- Drop the price of the Genesis and put the best game as a pack in
Again I could list you tons of In-pack deals both MS and SONY have done with the X-Box, PS2, PS3 and 360
so I can't give 3rd party examples but those who play Yakuza and Valkyria Chronicles don't play Halo or Gears of War.
Blame SOJ for that, for starters . And how about those who played Sonic, SOR II,dynamite headdy, Road Rash, Red Zone, Gynoug couldn't play the likes of Final Fantasy, R-Type, Axleay ECT . There is always going to be exclusives. All I will say is this generation of consoles there is far less
Bottom line the current hardware runners are rip-off's, over pricing as their is no one to challenge them and force them to bring their A game
That is more to do with the price of developing console hardware this day and age . Lets look at the Arcades (since your such a fan) Where is the challenge to SEGA dominance in the Arcades, Its pretty much a 3 horse race there too (like the consoles) and again owe a lot to the cost of developing and making Arcade games and hardware in this day and age
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Maybe I should make it pretty clear then. MS lost like £4 billion on selling the X-Box console always at Huge loss, Im sure SONY have lost millions on until very recently selling the PS3 at a huge lose. So you're really going to fall down on that side, because both SONY and MS have offered value for money with their console hardware . Also even with games costing £30 Million to make, both MS and SONY ask less than what SEGA or NCL asked for 16 bit games
Now that is a good point powerful enough to derail my entire statement.
But for the sake of fun let's continue to the remaining points.
An underdog in this context can be defined as someone who is trying to break in to the market by doing everything right
Developing both the saturn and 32X is not doing anything right at all, far from it. So again on that point, I will not agree
Yes, SEGA completely fucked up in that regard. I've never denied or argued that point. In fact my entire argument was that SEGA got rich and blind lost sight of the consumers and started an internal rivalry instead.
as companies get bigger, they forget the interest of the consumers and are simply about maximizing profits and minimizing investments
So you must have hated SEGA since the 16 bit days then
There isn't any thing likely about SEGA post the Genesis except maybe a few games here and there. Although I think things got back to with the Dreamcast.
- Drop the price of the Genesis and put the best game as a pack in
Again I could list you tons of In-pack deals both MS and SONY have done with the X-Box, PS2, PS3 and 360
Can you quote pack ins for regular editions, I glanced Gamestop before making that statement and couldn't see pack ins for the economical bundles. This multiple bundle fiasco that MS gave birth to sucks.
so I can't give 3rd party examples but those who play Yakuza and Valkyria Chronicles don't play Halo or Gears of War.
Blame SOJ for that, for starters .
I am sure several J games are SONY exclusive, just like many western games are Microsoft.
That is more to do with the price of developing console hardware this day and age . Lets look at the Arcades (since your such a fan) Where is the challenge to SEGA dominance in the Arcades, Its pretty much a 3 horse race there too (like the consoles) and again owe a lot to the cost of developing and making Arcade games and hardware in this day and age
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I am not a fan of the Arcades, I haven't been to one in years. My grip is Arcade games aren't getting ported as often as they used to. It bloody well took half a decade for After Burner to get ported.
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You are wrong about Nintendo. The NES came with SMB/Duck Hunt long before the Genesis came out.
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And the genesis came out with Altered Beast.
I was talking about packing the best in with the hardware without extra charges or manipulative bundle offers.
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SEGA completely fucked up in that regard. I've never denied or argued that point. In fact my entire argument was that SEGA got rich and blind lost sight of the consumers and started an internal rivalry instead
Yes in the 16 bit days.
There isn't any thing likely about SEGA post the Genesis except maybe a few games here and there.
The mega Drive is when SEGA was cash rich and one of the fastest growing companies in Japan , and when the battle between SOA and SOJ began.
Can you quote pack ins for regular editions,
What do you mean by regal editions , because in the 16 bit days not every Mega Drive came with a game, some SEGA Mega Drive Packs would include 2 Joypads instead.
If we're going to list official bundles, then MS JSRF/SEGT X-Box was brilliant value, MS HALO, Reach , FF13, Forza III , COD MW II 360 Bundles were all brilliant value
My grip is Arcade games aren't getting ported as often as they used to. It bloody well took half a decade for After Burner to get ported.
Again blame SEGA. Cave are more than happy to regularly port their games to the 360. Shame SEGA don't follow suite.
I am sure several J games are SONY exclusive, just like many western games are Microsoft
Not, Which western 3rd party games are exclusive to MS from 3rd parties. I can think of Splinter Cell and that's about it , well there's Metro too I guess
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Glad to finally see us on the same page.
I never bought the original puke box. Although the bundles you mentioned do sound very nice. But the recent bundles of 360 Core, Arcade, Elite (and I don't know if they were any more) was pure bull shit.
I was kicked in the nags after I found out the most expensive 360 RE5 360 bundle which cost me about 500$ came with 1 controller that even without rechargeable batteries and then the absence of a wireless adapter.
Elite bundle was for impulsive fools such as myself. It is worse then the Saturn bundles back in the day.
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I never bought the original puke box.
So has a SEGA fan, you missed out on Orta, JSRF, SEGA GT, HOTD III, Gunvalkyrie (some of the best titles SEGA ever produced), never mind the likes of O.TO.GI 1 and II (some of the best titles SEGA ever published) ??
All because of some silly beef with MS or SONY
But the recent bundles of 360 Core, Arcade, Elite (and I don't know if they were any more) was pure bull shit
Now you're being very silly. £250 for a 240 Gig Hard Drive, 360 console with wirelesses N built in, 2 wireless Joypads, Headset and a copy of Brand new £50 game is incredible value for money. Sony PS3 bundles are also very good vaule for money considering you're getting a fantastic BluRay player too
I was kicked in the nags after I found out the most expensive 360 RE5 360 bundle which cost me about 500$ came with 1 controller that even without rechargeable batteries and then the absence of a wireless adapter
$500? Dear GOD for one that was never the official price and however sold you that, seen you coming, But if one to you your logic.
How did people who just bought a Mega Drive Model 1 felt, after Seeing SEGA bring out a cheaper and better Model with Mark II - A console that could output Sterto through the AV cable for starters. How did SEGA fans feel that SEGA Europe or America never bundled in the 6 button pads (even with the SF II Mega Drive Bundle) and you moan about rechargeable batteries (which cost £10) lol. And you must have been pissed that SEGA asked you to pay for the Vibration Pack, or the BB adaptor (both of which was included with the X-Box)
What the fools that paid over £270 quid for the Launch Mega CD, only to see an more reliable and cheaper model come out, not long after . SEGA played the same game it's self , they all do, and how much did the Muli-Mega and WonderMega cost ?, both over an eye watering £300 (Oh please do remember SEGA did its own Limited Edition RE DC console pack in Japan)
So I do wonder why you were ever a SEGA fan in the 1st Place. You should have been a Atari Jag, CD32 fan in the 1990's , backing the real underdgog's of that age
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You are wrong about Nintendo. The NES came with SMB/Duck Hunt long before the Genesis came out.
This is the version of the NES I had.
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Me too. This was my order of consoles owned
Sears Branded Atari 2600 > NES > Sega Master System > Amiga 500> Sega Genesis > 32X > Sega CD > Super Famicom > Saturn > PS1 > N64 > Dreamcast > XBOX > Gamecube > GBA > Saturn #2 > Xbox 360 > Dreamcast #2 > Wii > PS3 > DS > PSP > DS #2 > PSP Go > Super Famicom #2
My first Saturn died, and I sold the Genesis1/32X/Cd set. Sold my first Dreamcast, but was remorseful.
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So has a SEGA fan, you missed out on Orta, JSRF, SEGA GT, HOTD III, Gunvalkyrie (some of the best titles SEGA ever produced), never mind the likes of O.TO.GI 1 and II (some of the best titles SEGA ever published) ??
All because of some silly beef with MS or SONY
I don't have a problem (don't like the synonym Beef - as I like Beef, it isn't something bad. How does it denote a problem?) with MS or SONY. Well maybe Sony, I had one back in the day (I was a fan - "BOY")
I missed on some great games, but I played some great ones on the Dreamast that kept me busy, even when I bought the PS2 I was still playing CVS2 on it.
I was simply never interested in the X-Box and the way MS dumped it, I was right not to buy it. I bought the 360 for the backward computability which SONY had abandoned, to catch on the games I had missed out on. Unfortunately MS kicked me in the nuts with that (though I did enjoy Max Payne 2 but not the SEGA games, I wanted to buy Sonic Heroes but the compatibility had to many issues).
But the recent bundles of 360 Core, Arcade, Elite (and I don't know if they were any more) was pure bull shit
Now you're being very silly. £250 for a 240 Gig Hard Drive, 360 console with wirelesses N built in, 2 wireless Joypads, Headset and a copy of Brand new £50 game is incredible value for money. Sony PS3 bundles are also very good vaule for money considering you're getting a fantastic BluRay player too.
Okay so previously I was just silly, lol. I'm not going to go in Pounds cause in Asia foreign Exchange will spike it to an insane level so let's stick with $.
However the current bundles you mention are much nicer, but the 360 I bought in Summer 2009 was outdated (compared to then line up of PS3's) and over priced.
As it didn't come with 2 controllers, rechargeable batteries, Wireless adapter or even FREAKING HDMI cables!!! So I was screwed (but it is my fault for not looking into all the details, I just assumed ELITE would have more then just disk space).
I was kicked in the nags after I found out the most expensive 360 RE5 360 bundle which cost me about 500$ came with 1 controller that even without rechargeable batteries and then the absence of a wireless adapter
$500? Dear GOD for one that was never the official price and however sold you that, seen you coming, But if one to you your logic.
Hold on a damn second, just because they say it is 399.99 doesn't mean it is that price.
Their is 7% tax and then I was informed it only has ROD Warranty if anything else in the hardware goes wrong I needed to purchase a 70$ warranty. I did this at BestBuy have a receipt for it and that warranty came in handy cause the controller went bad after the 1st week (for some reason the LEFT command was being registered without me moving the Analog Stick or D-Pad).
I bought the 360 over PS3 for it's backward compatibility which I was screwed out off for the most part as games that I wanted to play Head Hunter 2, Crazy Taxi, Gun Valkyrie weren't compatible (I knew it then, but I thought MS would get there).
How did people who just bought a Mega Drive Model 1 felt, after Seeing SEGA bring out a cheaper and better Model with Mark II A console that could output Sterto through the AV cable for starters.
I wouldn't be pissed and I'm not pissed that a better 360 was released. I am Pissed that the elite I bought had nothing except disk space.
How did SEGA fans feel that SEGA Europe or America never bundled in the 6 button pads (even with the SF II Mega Drive Bundle)
I thankfully got mine with 2 6 button controllers, it was a dick move by SEGA not to include it, if they actually did that to Americans.
and you moan about rechargeable batteries (which cost £10) lol.
I had a red controller so I couldn't buy the White Battery pack, I had to buy 2 Red Controller with Rechargeable Batteries for over 50$ a pop.
And you must have been pissed that SEGA asked you to pay for the Vibration Pack
Not at all, I loved buying Rumble Packs, Jump Pak, Puru Puru, Vibration Pack and so on. I actually collect the various accessories that went into the socket.
or the BB adaptor (both of which was included with the X-Box)
Had a newer batch of DC's been produced without Broad Band (after it had become, which it never did) I would have been, especially in the Xbox years.
What the fools that paid over £270 quid for the Launch Mega CD, only to see an more reliable and cheaper model come out, not long after. SEGA played the same game it's self , they all do, and how much did the Muli-Mega and WonderMega cost ?, both over an eye watering £300 (Oh please do remember SEGA did its own Limited Edition RE DC console pack in Japan)
Look i'm not some idiot, technology gets better with time and cheaper too. Better models are released (that's why I won't buy the 3DS anytime soon).
With the 360 things were different, especially the Elite bundle which practically offered nothing more than hard disk space.
With the PS3 things were even worse as it got worse with time, sure it has Mat Finish so you don't get the awful finger prints all over it but the PS2 backward compatibility is gone.
I recently bought a 300$ PS3 after months of research with Original box and everything.
So I do wonder why you were ever a SEGA fan in the 1st Place. You should have been a Atari Jag, CD32 fan in the 1990's , backing the real underdgog's of that age
SEGA was very good to me, as mentioned my MD2 came with 2 controllers and Sonic 2. While I was busy with my MD2 the market quickly threw out SEGACD,32x and Saturn, so years later when I was ready for the next experience my only option was PS1.
Then I bought DC in 2001 May (Pakistan found out by fall that it had been discontinued), and I assumed it was my fault for not buying the Saturn. Of course now I know the whole story but I was only 12.
Good talking to you.
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How does it denote a problem?) with MS or SONY. Well maybe Sony, I had one back in the day
When people use terms like this
I never bought the original puke box
I bought the 360 for the backward computability
Why since you never owned a X-Box ?
I was simply never interested in the X-Box and the way MS dumped it, I was right not to buy it.
Yo missed on classic and 4 year support is hardly dumping a system.
As it didn't come with 2 controllers, rechargeable batteries, Wireless adapter or even FREAKING HDMI cables!!! So I was screwed (but it is my fault for not looking into all the details, I just assumed ELITE would have more then just disk space).
Did our DC's come with 2 joypads, VGA cable or a 'FREAKING' Scart or S-Video cable , did it come with a Rumble pack too ?. OMG we were all so screwed .
And you would assume right that the ELITE was more than disc space. It was the 1st 360 with HDMI support , and it came with a HDMI cable
I am Pissed that the elite I bought had nothing except disk space.
see answer above
Hold on a damn second, just because they say it is 399.99 doesn't mean it is that price.
We’re happy to (officially) announce the Exclusive Red Xbox 360 Resident Evil Limited Edition Console.
Available the same day Resident Evil 5 ships to store shelves, Friday, March 13, Xbox 360 fans will be able to pick up the bundle featuring an exclusive red Xbox 360. Included will be the Limited Edition red Wireless Controller, black Xbox 360 Headset, a 120 GB Hard Drive, exclusive premium “Resident Evil 5” theme (downloadable via Xbox LIVE) and more all included at no additional charge for the price of US $399. (ERP) Supplies are very limited, so if you want in on this action, you may want to pre-order soon.
http://http://majornelson.com/2009/02/24/officially-announcing-the-resident-evil-limited-edition-console/
The bundle contains:
Xbox 360 Elite Console with Exclusive Red Finish
Matching red wireless controller
120GB hard drive
Resident Evil 5
Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix
Exclusive Resident Evil Premium Theme
Xbox 360 black wired headset
HDTV-ready component HD AV, HDMI and Ethernet cables
You were ripped off by $100 and Kept the HDMI cable & SF HD . BOY did they see you coming
I had a red controller so I couldn't buy the White Battery pack
I have Silver and just buy the Black one
I thankfully got mine with 2 6 button controllers
Only SOJ offically included the 6 button pad. SOA and SOE did not.
I loved buying Rumble Packs, Jump Pak, Puru Puru, Vibration Pack
And yet don't like buying a battery pack :roll:
Had a newer batch of DC's been produced without Broad Band
SEGA were still producing DC after it brought out the BB adaptor, yet never inclucded them and also remember both SOJ and SOE only included the 33K modem.
Better models are released
Yes they are, so why the Beef with MS ? They're only doing just what SEGA did in the past .
With the 360 things were different, especially the Elite bundle which practically offered nothing more than hard disk space.
Offering a 100 Gig Bigger Hard Drive and HDMI out was a big deal to me
SEGA was very good to me, as mentioned my MD2 came with 2 controllers and Sonic 2. While I was busy with my MD2 the market quickly threw out SEGACD,32x and Saturn
And if you buy a Slim 360 MS would be very good to you with the packs they're offering . It really is no different , same for SONY
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puke box
Because it was basically a PC, with a DC controller down to the VMU Slots and abandoned immediately after the next console came out.
I bought the 360 for the backward computability
Why since you never owned a X-Box ?
Why else? I thought I'd eventually get to play HH:R, Sonic Heroes, CT3, JSRF and so on.
Yo missed on classic and 4 year support is hardly dumping a system.
Compared to PS2's 10 year support?
Did our DC's come with 2 joypads, VGA cable or a 'FREAKING' Scart or S-Video cable , did it come with a Rumble pack too ?. OMG we were all so screwed .
DC didn't come in an elite edition and I bought it for less than 150$ with Sonic Adventure, Web Browser 2.0, and Generator Pack in.
By the way vibrators were really cheap.
The bundle contains:
Xbox 360 Elite Console with Exclusive Red Finish
Matching red wireless controller
120GB hard drive
Resident Evil 5
Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix
Exclusive Resident Evil Premium Theme
Xbox 360 black wired headset
HDTV-ready component HD AV, HDMI and Ethernet cables
You were ripped off by $100 and Kept the HDMI cable & SF HD . BOY did they see you coming
It was actually my sister, I was in Pakistan at the time and I was lucky to get the thing as it was a preorder item only and it has better resale value than a normal 360, so my investment wasn't that bad.
I bought it off Best Buy not the store you'd expect to con customers. It is weird cause my 360 was sealed, I ripped off myself and the only thing missing was the HDMI cable it had normal cables only.
I did the math you have to pay significantly 30$ tax so it is 430$ retail price. That additional warranty was legit as well.
Still no where near enough value for money!
You are right though I should've been a more intelligent buyer, shouldn't have gotten impulsive and bought an elite. But the thing is I've always bought a console for Resident Evil, so I couldn't pass the opportunity to buy an actual RE system.
In hindsight the unsatisfactory conclusion to the series, also added to my disdain for 360.
Only SOJ offically included the 6 button pad. SOA and SOE did not.
Then they were dicks, but we all know that 2 years into the Genesis SEGA was wearing their own ass like a hat. Fortunately Pakistan didn't suffer to bad at the hands of SEGA's ignorance, shop keepers still regularly stock brand new Genesis's (made under license in Taiwan with built in games - but no TecToy fancy touches) but very very few shop keepers stocked more than a handful of the add ons as they didn't sell well, so once they sold out they never ordered more.
An Average Pakistani gamer thinks the SEGA CD and Saturn are one in the same.
I loved buying Rumble Packs, Jump Pak, Puru Puru, Vibration Pack
And yet don't like buying a battery pack :roll:
As I told you I bought 2 Red controllers with rechargeable batteries.
I have a dc collection and having all color rumble packs and vmu is important to any collectors.
SEGA were still producing DC after it brought out the BB adaptor, yet never included them and also remember both SOJ and SOE only included the 33K modem.
With a quote:
The Dreamcast Broadband Adapter (often abbreviated to BBA) is an accessory that was released for the Dreamcast. The console originally came equipped with a 56 or 33.6K modem for use with dial-up Internet access but the release of the broadband adapter on January 10, 2001 allowed the Dreamcast to utilize broadband Internet access. The device can be used for web browsing, gaming and all of the other functions accessible using dial-up access. Shortly after its release, the adapter also became one of the items used to copy Dreamcast GD-ROMs, much faster than was previously possible.
Dreamcast had been out of production long before 2001, they did produce limited edition R7 units though... It was a 60$ Peripheral for a Dreamcast that was selling for 75 - 100$. Packing it in would be insane. Where as having it in an Elite 360 in 2009 would've been courteous.
And if you buy a Slim 360 MS would be very good to you with the packs they're offering . It really is no different , same for SONY
The 360 is a disappointment to me, if you want to know more in detail pm me your ID and we can do it over MSN.
:)
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Because it was basically a PC, with a DC controller down to the VMU Slots and abandoned immediately after the next console came out
And just what do you think the DC was ?. If that wasn't a console using PC Parts to Power it's inners. And the slots in the X-Box were for the Memory card, and the reason why you couldn't do the same for the 360 was due the fact the pad was wireless.
Why else? I thought I'd eventually get to play HH:R, Sonic Heroes, CT3, JSRF and so on.
Why not just buy a X-Box?, far cheaper and every title guaranteed to work. I don't remember the DC being able to play Saturn games either .
Compared to PS2's 10 year support
So we like SONY now ? How long as MS supported the 360 I think we're in to year 6 (has long as SEGA ever supported it own consoles) and they show no signs of dropping the system.
DC didn't come in an elite edition
No we just have Limited or Special Editions , including the SEGA Sports DC, the Biohazard DC, Metallic Silver DC (stunning system) and GOD knows how many more.
btw Rechargeable batteries are really cheap
It was actually my sister
Doesn't matter , whoever it was. They ripped you off and saw you coming . One can hardly blame MS for that.
I did the math
Really , yet paid $500. Keep it coming
I have a dc collection and having all color rumble packs and vmu is important to any collectors
Really explain why nearly all official DC rumble packs were the same (Grey Colour). I should also point out that you can buy multi Coloured rechargeable Battery packs
Dreamcast had been out of production long before 2001
Nice try, but SEGA were still selling the DC in 2001 and the BB adaptor came out before SEGA pulled the Plug .
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I hope next gen Sega returns to the console industry! :)
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I want Sega to return, with all their first party studios and all that jazz. Not gonna happen, but it has happened in my dreams.
Richard Branston buys them out and saves us all. What a bad ass.
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Just play SEGAGAGA. Get the best interns, make the best games, bask in fake SEGA glory.