Author Topic: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"  (Read 35307 times)

Offline Happy Cat

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #15 on: November 14, 2014, 09:01:48 am »
I guess SOA and SONIC BOOM was a step too far for Sharky...No harm in it didn't offend me...understand Shark's frustration..

I also understand how Sharky feels. SEGA America has put out a ton of crap. It's obvious management or whoever is in charge of overseeing game development at SOA has no clue what they are doing.

Having said that, there is a lot of good people at SOA, maybe just not on management level. It's because of the hard work of a lot of people at SOA that Hatsune Miku games are even coming west, for example.

Can't say it's SEGA Japan's fault seeing as how SEGA Europe makes nothing but good games and decisions. It's obviously a problem within SOA themselves.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2014, 09:03:41 am by Happy Cat »

Offline SuperSonicEX

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #16 on: November 14, 2014, 09:08:56 am »
Shit how could I have forgotten Aliens: Colonial Marines?


And I also forgot to mention Secret Level, SoA bought them for fuck knows how much. Because they were good? No because they were located in the same city... They developed what, one game? Beast Riders- A total piece of shit... and then disbanded.

3 games actually, they were closed down before Iron man 2 was released.

Offline MadeManG74

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #17 on: November 14, 2014, 09:34:04 am »
Sharky, I know you're a mod and all, but can you not make topics with titles like that?


Wow, this place has sure changed...

Also, a negative topic about Sega? And it's not made by me!?

I can see where Sharky is coming from, although I feel kind of like Sega as a whole is just constant disappointments for me. SoA depends on bought studios, licensed games and Sonic Boom. SoJ makes skinner boxes and 95% bizarre shit that I don't want to play but sells by the truckload in Japan (the remaining 5% being VF and Yakuza. One of which we'll NEVER EVER get to play in English anyway).

As for SoA and the darkest days, hoo boy that was some bad shit. With regards to Secret Level, weren't they meant to be a middle-ware developer (whatever the fuck that means) and not a game developer? No idea why they would hot-potato a classic IP like Golden Axe to them, and then dump their licensed games (High profile titles) onto them as well.

Offline Moody

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #18 on: November 14, 2014, 09:37:07 am »
Some of this isn't SOA's fault though? From what I understand, the deal with Colonial Marines was more that Gearbox were dicking around and using money Sega gave them on Borderlands, then outsourcing it, then producing a trailer of lies, and finally Gearbox had to get a game out the door. That last stretch was mostly SOA demanding a release since they likely had contracts to fill and just wanted the game out already, but I think it had more to do with Gearbox just being distrustworthy and lying.

Toejam and Earl got mentioned somewhere in here, like how a DS game was proposed but rejected. From what I understand, Toejam and Earl 3 sold horribly, and they were pretty much a dated concept to begin with, so their rejection of it I can understand. This was during a time when Sega as a whole was still trying to recover from the fall of the Dreamcast and near-bankruptcy, so a game that sounded like it might be a failure would be something they don't want to put too much money into. Same reason they produced decided to forgo a new Jet Set Radio and instead make a new House of the Dead, it was simply a better business decision at the time. Also, they DID manage to get Toejam and Earl for All-Stars Racing, but by the time rights got secured, it was too far in development to add them. I assume the same deal went down for Transformed.

Beast Riders was a shitty game, there's no dancing around that. But Beast Riders was six years ago. More intricate fuck-ups have been made since a bad reboot. SoA's fault? Probably, but they've made worse decisions since and I dunno why you're still hung up on it.

Vector Man 3 was, again, likely going to fail (aren't the original Genesis games somewhat obscure now?) so they never went after it.

Mis-marketing of games has been a huge problem for SoA of late, I won't deny. I think they would be much better off marketing the relatively cheap to make HD re-releases of games more, and starting to branch out into letting other games breathe. A good marketing campaign can make or break a game, though they seem to be doing well enough not marketing them (The Typing of the Dead Overkill and Valkryia Chronicles PC have apparently sold very well despite really any marketing whatsoever), so I could be wrong.

As for Yakuza, well I can only assume its lack of appearance in the west is due to some sort of xenophobia and trepidation around very Japanese-centered games, as in games taking place in Japan. You'll recall quite a few games from the 90's up to the aughts getting a treatment to hide the fact they're in Japan, and this trend has only really started to lose itself recently, since I would say 2007 or 2008-ish. Which just leaves the xenophobia.

Bringing unproven Japanese games to the west is always a gamble for any company, for a number of reasons, and that's all I got to say on that.

Some of it does put the blame entirely at SoA's feet, but SoA is also a business, and a business arm of a company that's struggled since the mid-90's and has only recently come out of a slump. Sometimes fan demand can't be met because you need to pay bills, no matter how much you want to make that game.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2014, 09:38:39 am by Moody »

Offline JRcade19

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #19 on: November 14, 2014, 09:50:18 am »
Still waiting on My Universe at war and Alpha protocol sequels.....please?

Offline Radrappy

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #20 on: November 14, 2014, 10:02:06 am »
Some of this isn't SOA's fault though? From what I understand, the deal with Colonial Marines was more that Gearbox were dicking around and using money Sega gave them on Borderlands, then outsourcing it, then producing a trailer of lies, and finally Gearbox had to get a game out the door. That last stretch was mostly SOA demanding a release since they likely had contracts to fill and just wanted the game out already, but I think it had more to do with Gearbox just being distrustworthy and lying.

This is what's known as being a shitty publisher.  It was their job to monitor their own investment.  And money fiasco aside, let's get real; these people have no fucking idea what quality control means anyway. 
« Last Edit: November 14, 2014, 10:03:49 am by Radrappy »

Offline SuperSonicEX

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #21 on: November 14, 2014, 10:26:18 am »
Still waiting on My Universe at war and Alpha protocol sequels.....please?

I would so want an AP sequel. especially with more Steven Heck.

Offline ROJM

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #22 on: November 14, 2014, 11:06:37 am »
Some of this isn't SOA's fault though? From what I understand, the deal with Colonial Marines was more that Gearbox were dicking around and using money Sega gave them on Borderlands, then outsourcing it, then producing a trailer of lies, and finally Gearbox had to get a game out the door. That last stretch was mostly SOA demanding a release since they likely had contracts to fill and just wanted the game out already, but I think it had more to do with Gearbox just being distrustworthy and lying.

Toejam and Earl got mentioned somewhere in here, like how a DS game was proposed but rejected. From what I understand, Toejam and Earl 3 sold horribly, and they were pretty much a dated concept to begin with, so their rejection of it I can understand. This was during a time when Sega as a whole was still trying to recover from the fall of the Dreamcast and near-bankruptcy, so a game that sounded like it might be a failure would be something they don't want to put too much money into. Same reason they produced decided to forgo a new Jet Set Radio and instead make a new House of the Dead, it was simply a better business decision at the time. Also, they DID manage to get Toejam and Earl for All-Stars Racing, but by the time rights got secured, it was too far in development to add them. I assume the same deal went down for Transformed.

Beast Riders was a shitty game, there's no dancing around that. But Beast Riders was six years ago. More intricate fuck-ups have been made since a bad reboot. SoA's fault? Probably, but they've made worse decisions since and I dunno why you're still hung up on it.

Vector Man 3 was, again, likely going to fail (aren't the original Genesis games somewhat obscure now?) so they never went after it.

Mis-marketing of games has been a huge problem for SoA of late, I won't deny. I think they would be much better off marketing the relatively cheap to make HD re-releases of games more, and starting to branch out into letting other games breathe. A good marketing campaign can make or break a game, though they seem to be doing well enough not marketing them (The Typing of the Dead Overkill and Valkryia Chronicles PC have apparently sold very well despite really any marketing whatsoever), so I could be wrong.

As for Yakuza, well I can only assume its lack of appearance in the west is due to some sort of xenophobia and trepidation around very Japanese-centered games, as in games taking place in Japan. You'll recall quite a few games from the 90's up to the aughts getting a treatment to hide the fact they're in Japan, and this trend has only really started to lose itself recently, since I would say 2007 or 2008-ish. Which just leaves the xenophobia.

Bringing unproven Japanese games to the west is always a gamble for any company, for a number of reasons, and that's all I got to say on that.

Some of it does put the blame entirely at SoA's feet, but SoA is also a business, and a business arm of a company that's struggled since the mid-90's and has only recently come out of a slump. Sometimes fan demand can't be met because you need to pay bills, no matter how much you want to make that game.

I mentioned TJ AND EARL and by the time them came forward on a proposal it was when Sega wanted to re activate old IP. The SARAS doesn't make sense either since they could have easily included them in the sequel or various ports had they really secured the rights...no i'm sorry but it didn't play out that way at all.

GA and others are just a list of the screw ups made..UNIVERSE AT WAR and ALPHA PROTOCOL was also mentioned..the latter
because Sega wanted it ship before the game was really..and then didn't give it the proper media support.
Also SOA has a bad habit of cancelling good games and going ahead with bad ones..CYPHER COMPLEX is a perfect example..that game could have been great but got canned while others that were baloney didn't.

There may be good people on the ship..but so was good people on the titanic..it still didn't save it did it from the idiots who didn't dodge the obvious danger or made it actually unsinkable in the first place.


Offline MadeManG74

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #23 on: November 14, 2014, 11:09:10 am »
I would so want an AP sequel. especially with more Steven Heck.

Alpha Protocol was so fucking good (despite being rough as guts in some areas), I wish we could get a sequel or spiritual successor.

Offline ROJM

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #24 on: November 14, 2014, 11:10:01 am »
Quote
As for SoA and the darkest days, hoo boy that was some bad shit. With regards to Secret Level, weren't they meant to be a middle-ware developer (whatever the fuck that means) and not a game developer? No idea why they would hot-potato a classic IP like Golden Axe to them, and then dump their licensed games (High profile titles) onto them as well.

They were brought in addition to their middleware tech..they were always meant to make games though..

Offline ROJM

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #25 on: November 14, 2014, 11:12:17 am »
This is what's known as being a shitty publisher.  It was their job to monitor their own investment.  And money fiasco aside, let's get real; these people have no fucking idea what quality control means anyway. 

Nah GBX was on a con job from the start..you can't blame SOA for that regardless. GBX went out of their way to deceive Sega of america even when they pt the project on hold and then re started the project.Can't blame SOA for that one entirely..

Offline George

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #26 on: November 14, 2014, 11:27:31 am »
I don't mean to sound like I'm backing up SEGA of America, but really, talk about not knowing all the details. I mean, half the shit that is being talked about in this topic are like years and years old and considering that SEGA's management changes every few years, its not even the same people doing this shit. I think the license shit deals where just relics of the bad Simon Jeffery SEGA.

On one hand we don't have Phantasy Star Online 2, but IMO I think SEGA Japan already had some deal with Asiasoft. I mean, how weird is it that SEGA America announced over a year before Asiasoft did, that PSO2 was coming to America and then all of a sudden nothing. Then Asiasoft starts promoting that they will run the first ever English Phantasy Star Online 2 servers. A brand new company will put in their system in place etc. Isn't it strange that SEGA America has no issue bringing Phantasy Star 0, Phantasy Star Portable 2, but somehow fails to bring over a main series number? Especially when they know in finical reports that free-to-play and digital sales are on an increase for the company?

I think its easier to see the negative side of all of this and say "SEGA didn't bring me this and this and this" while not really seeing what brought SEGA into not bringing so-so title. I mean, they brought over 5 Yakuza games and they continued to sell mediocre. The truth is, SEGA America isn't really much of a company and has been known as SEGA West. One side does most of the gaming, the other mostly focuses on outsourcing and community team for what it seems.

SEGA is also stopping the release of just random games (Remember when they released 40 titles a year and only 1 got promotion?) I think its better to have a smaller, more focused release of games. Don't get me wrong, some turds will slip through (Sonic Boom) but honestly it has been more 'hits' than 'misses' with SEGA this year and I hope they bring that attention and care to future games they decide to create in the future.

Its easy to see all the shit they did in the last 20 years, but ignore the positives.

Offline pirovash88

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #27 on: November 14, 2014, 11:28:54 am »
I can definitely agree with Sharky's frustration, that's why i gave you a kudos for your gnarly rant..

Haven't been excited with a Sega published game for a long time, aside from Alien Isolation which actually seems to be a very good game.

I was never interested in Sonic Boom since they first unveiled it and am not surprised it's a total piece of shit. We all need to come to the realization that SOA is not the same Company they used to be and SOJ had a large part in that regard. I just don't understand how anyone can look at Sonic Boom and think "yeah, that's the fucking direction i think Sonic should go, people will totally dig this".. Seriously, it's an embarrassment..
Gamertag: Pirovash88 Twitch.TV/Pirovash88

Offline MadeManG74

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #28 on: November 14, 2014, 11:34:54 am »
I don't mean to sound like I'm backing up SEGA of America, but really, talk about not knowing all the details. I mean, half the shit that is being talked about in this topic are like years and years old and considering that SEGA's management changes every few years, its not even the same people doing this shit. I think the license shit deals where just relics of the bad Simon Jeffery SEGA.

True, but I thought Sharky was just letting off some steam, bennet.

They were brought in addition to their middleware tech..they were always meant to make games though..

I remember someone going on about 'THEY BOUGHT THEM FOR MIDDLE WARE!!!!'
and I was like 'WHAT THE FUCK IS MIDDLEWARE!?'
But okay, I didn't know they wanted them to make games from teh get go. They shouldn't have given those greenhorns good IPs like Golden Axe though. I still think the old Golden Axe games are dog-shit, but still, everyone seems to like them for some reason.


Offline George

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Re: Sharky's corner of negativity: "SEGA of America f***ing sucks"
« Reply #29 on: November 14, 2014, 11:37:49 am »
The funny thing about Simon Jeffery, I thought his plan was solid. I mean, make Marvel movie games? This was announced before the whole big 'Avengers' thing, but I knew the movie franchises where going to be big. He just fucked up when it came to development, using studios that had no talent and not being able to make a marketable product in like 2 years of development time. But if Thor, Hulk, Captain America and Iron Man games where good, I could see them selling like 10+ million considering how popular the characters are and how much consoles they where on.