Author Topic: The State of the Earth  (Read 8131 times)

Offline crackdude

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Re: The State of the Earth
« Reply #30 on: July 28, 2010, 08:45:49 pm »
facts:

life span?

technology?

children rights?

commodities?

low crime?

medication?

no war?

Except for the dead US soldiers form Iraq, this is what most people in the world live like. Poverty. And you're telling me the world has never been better for things like technology?
Medication? Many would be happy to have water and food let alone medical care.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 pm by Guest »
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Offline Sega Uranus

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Re: The State of the Earth
« Reply #31 on: July 29, 2010, 03:07:44 am »
I am going to have to actually break into this topic because there is a lot of weird claims being made by all parties. I would argue the world is just as shitty as it ever was. Better for some, worse for most.

Of course people have improved, but only at the cost of others. While I sit here wondering what variant of a soda pop brand I want to buy and drink while I play with the next videogame I am going to purchase in a month, a father somewhere in the world is working all day long for basic food for his family just to make my next pair of socks I will wear out in probably a week.

Medical treatments and technical knowledge have obviously increased, but so has medical waste and new places to put them after they ruin thousands of people and animals homes. The more civilized of us needing more lumber to make more overpopulated homes, so we just take it without asking.

In SOME places women have better rights than they have ever, but at the same time more are sold practically right after birth into homes with people from all over the world coming to enjoy them in ways that were not possible years ago thanks to our great medical and technical enhancements... The same is true for boys, too.

And age expectancies have not increased, what has mixed up these numbers is that there were much more deaths of babies due to medical issues. Now instead we have medical anomalies barely living, while others slave over them only to waste their lives, or the kids who get fat and useless before puberty while they are pushed through school without actually learning anything and are given checks (from taxes good and honest people pay) to just exist for the rest of their lives. Take someone like CWC for instance. No one could have ever lived like that 500 years ago, he would be forced to do shit with his life and learn to be a person in general. I am sure we have all seen at least an hour worth of stuff related to him, in this case we are further proof that the world is truly not improving at all and most likely never will.

Sorry if I bummed anyone out with this post, but you all should know it by now.
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Offline MadeManG74

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Re: The State of the Earth
« Reply #32 on: July 29, 2010, 04:31:34 am »
Quote from: "Sharky"
I'm pretty sure I said it was ONE OF the biggest causes. Which I think it has been. Religious war still goes on today in the form of terrorism.

I disagree completely. I understand religion is a factor in many wars, but not a direct cause. You've mentioned the Crusades and Terrorism so far, which are the most obvious examples, but as I said most of the Crusades (if not all of them) were equally/more motivated by other matters and disguised as Religious causes. Terrorist attacks are sometimes caused by fanaticism, but there are many more factors as well.

And again, nobody likes fundamentalists, fundamentalism =/= religion as a whole. It's an extreme of a belief, and that's dangerous no matter what the belief is, much like Facism or Communism are extreme Right and Left wing politics. It doesn't mean that all politics are bad.

I'm probably rambling, but I hope I've made my point without sounding rude or argumentative!
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Offline Aki-at

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Re: The State of the Earth
« Reply #33 on: July 29, 2010, 08:00:15 am »
Quote from: "Sharky"
I'm pretty sure I said it was ONE OF the biggest causes. Which I think it has been.


It really has not. Take out the Crusades, the Muslim Conquests and the French Wars of Religion and you're already running low on wars started by or religion being a factor in causing it.

The expansion of empires, civil wars, independence and fighting over resources and trade routes are much much more common in history for the cause of armed conflicts.

Quote from: "Sharky"
Religious war still goes on today in the form of terrorism.

It's really a combination of things. Yes in the fact that people are doing it because they are Muslim, no in the fact they are not doing it simply because they are against non-Muslims. The terrorist acts originate due to fighting over land, land Israel now occupies, which they believe belongs to them and the Arabs believe it belongs to them. Further escalation in terrorism occurred due to the Afghan and Iraq wars. America has been an ally of Israel for quite some time and this is where the bad blood comes from, not because they are not Muslim. Due to the Palestine problem, both invasions, most of the Muslim world (Which see each others as family anyway) feel as if there is some serious problems against just them.

Take out this land problem and you'd find fundings cut off for most of these terrorist organizations almost instantly, of course for that to happen it mean Israel would cease to exist, which will not happen, so this will undoubtly continue for the ages.

These acts of terrorism are much more complicated then simply just "We must kill the non-believers!" most of it originates from the problems between Palestine and Israel and foreign policy of other countries. Most are funded by rich Arab who want their land back and people being cohaxed into it, as I said, a combination of things.

Anyway, what about the Tamil Tigers? Or former problems like the Japanese Red Army and IRA? Or Chechnyan Separatists still in action? There are many many other terrorist organizations out there which have nothing to do with religion.
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Offline Barry the Nomad

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Re: The State of the Earth
« Reply #34 on: July 29, 2010, 08:23:43 am »
^ the Google Image search made me lol
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Offline crackdude

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Re: The State of the Earth
« Reply #35 on: July 29, 2010, 09:07:12 am »
Quote from: "Barry the Nomad"
^ the Google Image search made me lol
was it too cheesy? lol
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Offline Barry the Nomad

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Re: The State of the Earth
« Reply #36 on: July 29, 2010, 09:13:35 am »
Yeah, sorry, it was a bit cheezy. lol

Btw, bullfighting is being banned in Catalonia‎! Big step up for humanity!

+1 Earth better place
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Offline Sharky

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Re: The State of the Earth
« Reply #37 on: July 29, 2010, 05:35:10 pm »
Quote from: "crackdude"
blah blah blah

This is actually retarded... And you wonder why I repeat myself?

Yes there are still plenty of shitty places to live in the world... Note the word 'STILL' ... As in they haven't improved... But some places have, thus the world is better.

There were people staving and dying in africa 100 years ago... and there was also slave trade... Much less rights for woman, 'coloured' people or children the world over.

Hell in half of those pictures I see poor people benifitting from 2010... some of them are wearing western clothes... I see western made items everywhere.

 
Two of the most dencely populated countries, India and China are going though their own kind of industrial revolution... Which can only be a good thing, there for the world is getting better.

*Waits for you to still miss the point and point out more suffering in the world*



As for the religious argument, there has been more death in the world because of religion then because of athism... I'm sure at least we can agree on THAT.
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Offline crackdude

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Re: The State of the Earth
« Reply #38 on: July 29, 2010, 06:03:59 pm »
I'll reply to you backwards lol

Saying "there has been more death in the world because of religion then because of athism" is like saying there have been more road accidents involving cars than boats. The belief in nothing won't motivate anyone to do anything.
Though I think religion is not a major cause of war, I think it's highly influential. Hitler's rise to power was also largely due to the helping hand of catholic church, which also supported German troops throughout WW2. So I think influential, yes. But not the reason behind.

"*Waits for you to still miss the point and point out more suffering in the world*"
lol I'm not missing the point. It's just my opinion. As Sanus said, people have improved, but only at the cost of others. And in my opinion the fact that each year there are more and more "others" makes the world worse.
You say it's better cause every year there's more good stuff. True. But I believe there is more accentuated increase of the bad stuff. If not only because the population is rising. We can't look into mathematical figures only. More people means more suffering.

This argument will reach no end Sharky lol
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Offline MadeManG74

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Re: The State of the Earth
« Reply #39 on: July 30, 2010, 06:20:45 am »
Quote from: "Sharky"
As for the religious argument, there has been more death in the world because of religion then because of athism... I'm sure at least we can agree on THAT.

Atheists find other reasons to kill eachother.

Also, more charities are founded because of religion than atheism. Probably.
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Offline Sharky

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Re: The State of the Earth
« Reply #40 on: July 30, 2010, 06:52:05 am »
@ Crackdude... I can't be bothered to keep arguing about it. A lot of people have come in said their part and left and you've ignored all of them so your right theres not much point.


Quote from: "MadeManG74"
Atheists find other reasons to kill eachother.
But not because of atheism... I would like more then anything for there to be some kind of being that magics us all into a magical happy place that no one can see or hear but we all have to just have 'faith' in it existing... But I've read enough about science and the universe to come to my own conclusion that it's just very unlikely... I also believe that life and everything in the universe has no point to it what so ever. And Yet I think I'm just as nice as any religious person. (Nicer then most I've met.)

Quote
Also, more charities are founded because of religion than atheism. Probably.
Maybe... maybe... But I have far more respect for people that are good people because they just are. Not because they are scared of going to hell/not going to heaven.

I donated to charity last saturday.
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Offline MadeManG74

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Re: The State of the Earth
« Reply #41 on: July 30, 2010, 06:57:31 pm »
I think you missed my point, what I was saying is that if someone wants to start a war or kill someone then theres just about always going to be more reason behind it than just a difference of religious beliefs or anything that simple. There are people who will kill the name of religion just the same as people who may kill in the name of money or power or politics or racism or anything. It doesn't mean that religion is causing their killing, since there are far more religious people out there who don't kill anybody. It's not inherintly bad.

If you want examples of atheism involved in violence of death, look at Communist Russia and China. Of course there are more factors than atheism at work, but that's just the same as any of the examples involving religion that you mentioned.

And i think you really have a skewed view of religious people, most aren't constantly thinking in terms of fear or being forced to do good, most are just genuinely good people, partly because they've had the moral teachings of their religion instilled into them.

In any event, I'm cool if you don't follow a religion, I have no problem with that, but I just don't like people to think that religious people are al kooks or that it's a major cause of warfare when it really isn't.
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