New Yakuza

[Team Andromeda]

Correct..people don't realize that the engines used for the YAKUZA games are expensive and that Sega wants to get back its investment by using the engine on every game they can..then they update. I

If you really want to make your money from your investment you share the code and pipelines of your next gen engine with the other teams in the group and use it on other games . Only SEGA Japan don't and it again shows how far and how behind the times there  are when nearly every other cop will use their major engine with-in  the other teams and on other games with that company.Not that the Yakuza 3 engine was that impressive in the 1st place . It took until Yakuza 5 for the game to really look great on the PS3.

If Sega had released all the SHENMUE titles on a yearly basis you'd get the same exact engine for that game

Not quite the same . Looking over how Shenmue was pushing the DC already to its limits (something the Kenzan/Yakuza III engine wasn't with the PS3) . Shenmue II was a vast improvement over Shenmue on the DC and you can bet AM#2 would have made Shenmue III and IV look that better too on the DC . Yakuza looked amazing on the PS2 and Part II pushed the PS2 hard - that is something we haven't really seen with the PS3 game (well Yakuza 5 does look good I guess ) and seeing Yakuza on the PS4 with outdated tech and using the same animation and routines is just lame for a company like SEGA who once used to lead on tech .

[size=78%]The hedgehog engine still looks hot as shit though, well it did when it was last used.[/size]

[size=78%]


Yep its really impressive . Sonic Team and the PSO - are most prob the only ones in the group that have decent engine pipelines and plans


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[Aki-at]

The hedgehog engine still looks hot as shit though, well it did when it was last used.
I suspect slapping in some next gen lighting and it could go on for years to come looking just as good as anything else.

The Yakuza engine they are currently using looks a generation behind.

The Hedgehog Engine isn't all that impressive either, low poly count and inconsistent frame rate. They had to downgrade the visuals further in Sonic Lost World just to boost it up to 60 fps. They'll probably brute force a PS4/Xbox One very to have the same fps like how the Yakuza team has with Ishin.

As for the Yakuza engine, it is a cross gen product but the engine is based on Binary Domain's. Neither game has impressive engines for today's standards, only The Creative Assembly has with Alien Isolation.

[ROJM]

I understand Sega has to remake the initial investment in the engine; I just was pointing out that the game looks slightly dated for this being Sega's big project at the moment. This is also their second PS4 Yakuza game, so I wish they'd push the tech more. It's just pride speaking. I understand why they do it.

Well were not living in the era where Sega use to sport five different game engines for five different games. Unlike others who need to keep their little crusade going, not many companies share their engines to get back their investment back. Also didn't Binary Domain share the same engine as YAKUZA5? BD failed. Sega has got back its investment on YAKUZA and YAKUZA alone so its a safe bet to use just that investment on one title. And let's not pander to fantasy as a certain member tends to do around here...YAKUZA engine has had changes throughout its use in the series run. Yet people blinded by Nagoshi hate keep harping its the same. Well SHENMUE was originally going to be an eleven part series USING the same engine. But  i bet no one here would have complained. YAKUZA hasn't even reached that number yet and people are acting like its under polished. Complete nonsense. Please people instead of listening to a fantasist do some research yourself and you will find many games have used the same engine..each title will have slight changes in the engine(except most EA games) So singling out YAKUZA doesn't make sense when its doing the same thing nearly every other video games company are guilty of.

The other reason i think were noticing it more JB is that YAKUZA is the only big Sega game being made on a regular basis..there isn't much of a diversity. That is a sting to pride as well console wise.

[ROJM]

The Hedgehog Engine isn't all that impressive either, low poly count and inconsistent frame rate. They had to downgrade the visuals further in Sonic Lost World just to boost it up to 60 fps. They'll probably brute force a PS4/Xbox One very to have the same fps like how the Yakuza team has with Ishin.

As for the Yakuza engine, it is a cross gen product but the engine is based on Binary Domain's. Neither game has impressive engines for today's standards, only The Creative Assembly has with Alien Isolation.

Exactly Aki..makes me wonder if ALIEN ISOLATION's engine would be used for other titles...

[Team Andromeda]

The Hedgehog Engine isn't all that impressive either, low poly count and inconsistent frame rate.

The game is using a huge number of polygons and in terms of lighting, motion blur , depth of field and various other effects it was lightyears ahead of most other SEGA Japan games . A inconsistent frame rate is just a lack of optimization but that's  the trouble with SEGA and making sure Sonic hits the Winter Deadline for the best possible sales  and not giving the team a soft release date 

Kezan was just lame on the PS3 , Panzer Dragoon Saga feature better water effects. never mind the likes of Orta  and the animation  in Kenzan was hardly PS3 quality .

Also didn't Binary Domain share the same engine as YAKUZA5

The same team *Roll Eye's .

You look at Capcom their MT Framwork engine was used in all of Capcom Japan 360 and PS3 games and for their 3DS games and now they have a new Next gen engine ready to go . Ubisoft is using Avil next to power Assassin's Creed Unity and the next Rainbow Six and has bought in the likes of Snowdrop to power its Clancy next gen games . EA has Frostbite 3 powering its Battlefield , Need For Speed and new Mass Effect Mirror Edge and Ignite engine  for its next gen  sports games , Konami has the Fox engine powering MGS and Pro Evo and so on , Square Enix have a new next gen engine powering their games and yet SEGA Japan doesn't have 1 next gen engine ready to go ...


In a world lame and again SEGA Japan is left behind the rest on tech and boy does it show

fantasist do some research yourself and you will find many games have used the same engine..each title will have slight changes in the engine(

If people do that they'll see big improvements on games . Assassins Creed 1 to 3 saw vast improvements in tech and that game already looked better than Yakuza 3 . GTA 4 to GTA IV saw a huge jump and again GTA IV was already vastly more impressive than Yakuza, COD 2 on the the 360 to Call Of Duty IV saw huge jumps in tech and MT Framework saw a huge jump in performance from Dead Rising to the likes of Lost Planet 2 or RE 5

Well SHENMUE was originally going to be an eleven part series USING the same engine

The engine was already hugely impressive (something which Yakuza Kenzan 3/4 on the PS3 wasn't and neither is Yakuza on the PS4 )  and if the game came out on the same system with improvements no-one would have really cared as the main game engine was hugely impressive at the time . Just like no-one had issues with Sonic 1 to IV using the same main engine only with improvements.


The trouble is the Yakuza games on the PS4 aren't gen standards at all 

[ROJM]

I want SEGA to be like everybody else goddammitt and have no identity of their own!Yippee!

 

[Aki-at]

Please I am not going to discuss this with you. You just throw walls of text without looking at facts or shout out until the other side gives up. Find another sparring partner because I know you're clearly wrong in most of your arguments since you use relatively little evidence and your bias is shown on a fairly regular basis.

[Team Andromeda]

You just throw walls of text without looking at facts or shout out until the other side gives up

When a game as an inconsistent frame rate its usually a lack of optimisation and a game brought out before its really ready to leave the development kit - Just look at games like Ninja Gaiden 2 (360) , Daytona USA (Saturn)


The Hedgehog was able to handle loads of polygons and effects like HDR, Dynamic shadows , Motion blur and various other effects . Sonic Unleashed looks good . In comparison Kenzan, Yakuza 3,4 look pretty poor have worse lighting effects and the water effects in Kenzan are just totally lame.


Yakuza looks great in the cut scenes not so great in game . Sadly the best engine SEGA Japan made for the PS3 was only even used in one game for Val .










 






 

[ROJM]

And the propaganda against Nagoshi continues....

[MadeManG74]

Please I am not going to discuss this with you. You just throw walls of text without looking at facts or shout out until the other side gives up. Find another sparring partner because I know you're clearly wrong in most of your arguments since you use relatively little evidence and your bias is shown on a fairly regular basis.

Do you have a single fact to back that up?

[Sharky]

I don't know anything about the technical side of the Hedgehog Engine, but Sonic Generations was fucking beautiful on PC maxed out. Perhaps because it was cartoony graphics, but it looks almost flawless.

[Team Andromeda]

I don't know anything about the technical side of the Hedgehog Engine, but Sonic Generations was fucking beautiful on PC maxed out. Perhaps because it was cartoony graphics, but it looks almost flawless.

Haha it does and the look what Sonic Team wanted . Here' a nice feature on some of the tech


http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/series/3dcg/20090410_110682.html

[Aki-at]

Sonic Unleashed looks good? Please, stop mixing art direction for technical specifics. There's no point talking to you TA so stop bothering to reply to me, you often either don't understand the terms of discussion or keep shouting the same points that are not in anyway either relevant or have been disproved several times.

I don't know anything about the technical side of the Hedgehog Engine, but Sonic Generations was fucking beautiful on PC maxed out. Perhaps because it was cartoony graphics, but it looks almost flawless.

That's exactly what it is, people are muddling art direction with graphics when it comes to Sonic Generations/The Hedgehog Engine. By the same virtue Mario Kart is a fantastic piece of graphical engineering and pushes the Wii U above the Playstation 4/Xbox One when it just is not the case, Nintendo, like Sonic Team and Ryu Ga Gotoku Studio (Plus countless Japanese developers) hide technical short comings behind excellent art direction.

When you stop and slowly inspect the scenery, Sonic Generations has a lot of low poly models for a reason and the console versions suffered from horrible pop ups.

[Team Andromeda]

When you stop and slowly inspect the scenery

You can do that in any game and in many cases you will see low polygon models . It happens in games like Half Life II and even some of the best games on systems like Gear of War or Drakes 2





Also screen shots don't always show the full game off and the same game can look better or worse depending on different screen shots . I mean does Sonic Gen look poor in this

[ROJM]

Sonic Unleashed looks good? Please, stop mixing art direction for technical specifics. There's no point talking to you TA so stop bothering to reply to me, you often either don't understand the terms of discussion or keep shouting the same points that are not in anyway either relevant or have been disproved several times.

best Quote of the day.

That's exactly what it is, people are muddling art direction with graphics when it comes to Sonic Generations/The Hedgehog Engine. By the same virtue Mario Kart is a fantastic piece of graphical engineering and pushes the Wii U above the Playstation 4/Xbox One when it just is not the case, Nintendo, like Sonic Team and Ryu Ga Gotoku Studio (Plus countless Japanese developers) hide technical short comings behind excellent art direction.

Second best quote of the day.
For someone as experienced as TA claims to be he should know this by now since we have seen games using art to make up for technical shortcomings. The Megadrive and many of the Sega games that appeared on that is a class on its own on what they did to make for for various shortcomings of the MD..