Sega at AOU 2010.

[Team Andromeda]

none of those games was based on
Kawashima concept. Sega toys version is based on the actual device he created and it was a hit.

SIGH.... I’m simply pointing out that the concept of brain training games isn’t new, I seem to remember a few of the BBC Micro for starters . If SEGA did make a Brain Training game before 2005, then Kudos to SEGA
Shame they didn’t see the potential , before NCL to make take it to the consumer teams for the HH and made into the phenomenon it became with NCL , that is a lot of money that could have been SEGA’s.

Again, one more time games like Arabian Jewel looks so wow doesn't it.   And so does those girl dancing games and project diva. You've lost the debate mate, give it up. Pointing out three traditional arcade Sega games does not vindicate the dozen or so games that are using underpowered boards like the quiz titles and kiddie stuff and the others which are hardly pushing the lindbergh at all because they're simple revisions. Sorry but no arcade gamer thinks this is Sega's best line up.

1st off, I could point out that even RingWide  is far more powerful than the Wii or PSP , which SEGA  consumer Teams of late,  like to use ,and what isn’t kiddy about Monkeyball  Blitz , or step & Roll , both of whoch are  hardly using Cutting Edge tech.
I could also point,  that the likes of Jewel , is SEGA keeping its Arcade mechanical and Video Arcade  games Heritage  alive, which you seem to be so proud of ?. Never mind that , SAMMY which you support , own's SEGA,  is a bloody Pachinko and Slot machine company :roll:  .

Yet the consumer division has come up with new game engines.

I’ll hazard a guess , and say that VF 5 is running on a different engine to R Tuned Street Racing, that Virtual Tennis 3,  is running on a Different engine,  to Lets Go Jungle , that Too Spicy,  is running on a different engine,  to Race TV and I really could go on .
Only to say that... I couldn’t careless,  if a same engine is used , as long as the tech behind that engine is great , for eample... I’ve no problem with a same engine powering AC & Prince of Perisa, or the same engine powering  Resident Evil 5 & Lost Planet II , I want SEGA to share its best engines , always have since the Saturn days . Now I’ll just  say that SEGA Arcade Teams , are doing a great Job of making great engines , for not the most powerful hardware in the world .

Yearly updates? Don't make me laugh, this is the only new sequel that's appeared this gen after 3, RGGKENZEN was a spin off. And don't bother covering your dislike for nagoshi since you've made it clear on more than one occassion. If anybody been running anything to the ground was sonic team and Naka during his tenure and you didn't hardly criticise them on that. now all of a sudden you're trying to make out that Yakuza is being run into the groud

I don’t know why I bother , I really don’t . I’ve  already said  and made the distinction  one was a Spin off, ok?  Just all means   post me the dates that Yakuza Kenzan shipped in Japan , when Yakua III shipped in Japan , and when Yakuza IV is to ship in Japan . If that’s not yearly updates I don’t know what is .

At least the games be they sequels are something new and not a rehash of the same game released a year ago which the arcade division are the most guilty of.
No it doesn't. You are only intrested in that Let's go island game.

?. What’s really new about Monkeyball Blitz, or Step and Roll, what really new about the new Yakuza games ?. Nothing much new there , and it’s not like in 1999, AM#2 didn’t make its own Yakuza game . You strip the game to its bare bones , and the gameplay is pretty much the same , even down to being able to play games in the Arcades   .
What brand new IP have we got from the consumer Teams ?
You ‘ve no idea what games I’m looking forward, because you’ve mentioned hardly any of them .But if you ‘must’ know, I think Both Border Break , Lets Go Island look brilliant ,  VF 5 Final looks simply class, I’m loving the style and charm of both Shining Cross and Gunman Medal . On the Consumer side from R&D Japan , I'm looking forward to AfterBurner & Sonic on LIVE Arcade .

Oh and no I don't like Nagoshi-san , but that doesn't stop one from praising a person or company . I dislike NCL with a passion , not a fan of Shigeru Miyamoto at all. I've always praised the Mario games though , and hold Mario IV up as sheer gaming perfection, just like Galaxy .
I love Moneyball & SpikeOut too , in fact I was playing Spikeout just the other night on LIVE (both Nagoshi-san productions)  . That's the difference , with me, I'll give credit where it's due , even if I don't like the company or Team

Now unless you're willing to debates the points fairly ,I'll not bother to respond to your post & and bad twists

[ROJM_old]

SIGH.... I’m simply pointing out that the concept of brain training games isn’t new, I seem to remember a few of the BBC Micro for starters . If SEGA did make a Brain Training game before 2005, then Kudos to SEGA
Shame they didn’t see the potential , before NCL to make take it to the consumer teams for the HH and made into the phenomenon it became with NCL , that is a lot of money that could have been SEGA’s.

Nobody said it was new concept,I was talking about a specific version. You're the one who had to try and spin it and make it look like you know what you were talking about when It has no bearing in the discussion at all. You were just showing off as usual.

 

1st off, I could point out that even RingWide  is far more powerful than the Wii or PSP , which SEGA  consumer Teams of late,  like to use ,and what isn’t kiddy about Monkeyball  Blitz , or step & Roll , both of whoch are  hardly using Cutting Edge tech.

SMB is more of a game anyone could play, a kid or adult could play it. Sonic is the same. Lilipri Yubi Puru Hime Chen,Mushi King, Dinosaur king and the like  however are specifically aimed at children, like RGG is aimed at adults and so on and so on. Not really much on variety since these card games are dominating now.

I could also point,  that the likes of Jewel , is SEGA keeping its Arcade mechanical and Video Arcade  games Heritage  alive, which you seem to be so proud of ?. Never mind that , SAMMY which you support , own's SEGA,  is a bloody Pachinko and Slot machine company :roll:

.

Yeah you'd be right if we were talking about UFO Catcher but since Arbian Jewel, Ami no and a few others use video screen graphics its hardly mindblowing tech that's been used to create them, just like the card titles. Something i have been saying all along. But of course you have to sideline the issue with me and others who happento disagree with you. And I never supported Sammy either so grow up. But the deal that happened hasn't been all bad for Sega which is all i care about really.

I’ll hazard a guess , and say that VF 5 is running on a different engine to R Tuned Street Racing, that Virtual Tennis 3,  is running on a Different engine,  to Lets Go Jungle , that Too Spicy,  is running on a different engine,  to Race TV and I really could go on .

The VF5 engine came out nearly four years ago now. VT3 the same and most of the titles you have named are the same too,the revisions are all based on an existing engine. So try again.

Only to say that... I couldn’t careless,  if a same engine is used , as long as the tech behind that engine is great , for eample... I’ve no problem with a same engine powering AC & Prince of Perisa, or the same engine powering  Resident Evil 5 & Lost Planet II , I want SEGA to share its best engines , always have since the Saturn days . Now I’ll just  say that SEGA Arcade Teams , are doing a great Job of making great engines , for not the most powerful hardware in the world .

No what you want is sega to stop being unique.You keep praising terible titles like RE5 and LP2 and want Sega to do that style. You keep comparing Heavy Rain as an example when all i see from that is a rip of Shenmue. Just like when GTA moved to 3D and did the same. I don't want sega reduced to that level. if anyone should be creating these type of games however it should be Sega west. Just like the old SOA use to do by creating some of the best western made video games on console, sega west should be trying to get the best ideas,the innovative programmers and game designs and so forth to at least get to that standing of what the old SOA and later SOE houses did. At the moment through unforseen circumstances like the cancellations of a few titles and just lack of ideas and real talent they have yet to do so.

 

. What’s really new about Monkeyball Blitz, or Step and Roll, what really new about the new Yakuza games ?. Nothing much new there , and it’s not like in 1999, AM#2 didn’t make its own Yakuza game . You strip the game to its bare bones , and the gameplay is pretty much the same , even down to being able to play games in the Arcades   .
What brand new IP have we got from the consumer Teams ?
You ‘ve no idea what games I’m looking forward, because you’ve mentioned hardly any of them .But if you ‘must’ know, I think Both Border Break , Lets Go Island look brilliant ,  VF 5 Final looks simply class, I’m loving the style and charm of both Shining Cross and Gunman Medal . On the Consumer side from R&D Japan , I'm looking forward to AfterBurner & Sonic on LIVE Arcade

.
Yet you failed misarably to porvide any significant IP from the arcades as well. I've been saying that the consumer teams are coming out with better games and better engines and techniques than the arcade division at the moment. This is a fact. Your all fave Ueda or whatever his name is seems to be getting things done as well. Sega shouldn't sell out their principles just to satisfy a so called sega gamer who basically wants them to be a glorified PC developer making carp like HR. As for RGG, if SHENMUE had been more succesful we would have gotten the same treatment, the difference being RGG is more open ended and not a game with a definate end unless thy try to spin it off. so criticising the game on that front is rather silly.
Yawn on the point of the discussion we were talking about what was on show on AOU and i do know what titles you were looking forward to because you've mentioned it before. Borderbreak came out over a year ago this is a revision of the same game. It shows no difference graphically or GP wise to the first one and in my opinion is complete carp to the gundam game its ripping off. LGI i'll give you looks good, but most ride games are meant to look good. Lost world another ride game also looked impressive. Shining Cross and VF5 again are simple revisions. I actually want a new game of VF ,you know like they use to do and not simply releasing a new version of the same board month after month. This is not sega's best AOU not by a long shot. Anyone who regularly goes on the arcades can attest to that. Unlike you.

Oh and no I don't like Nagoshi-san , but that doesn't stop one from praising a person or company . I dislike NCL with a passion , not a fan of Shigeru Miyamoto at all. I've always praised the Mario games though , and hold Mario IV up as sheer gaming perfection, just like Galaxy .
I love Moneyball & SpikeOut too , in fact I was playing Spikeout just the other night on LIVE (both Nagoshi-san productions)  . That's the difference , with me, I'll give credit where it's due , even if I don't like the company or Team

TA you were involved in a massive debate in the last forum when you blatantly slagged off Nagoshi and unfairly criticised his games. as far as i remember you consider this more Smilebit's game than anything else as well. And if that last  remark is directed at me then you know that isn't true since i praised Naka's last title for the Wii. The difference with me is i don't try to make one certain programmer greater and more important than he really is.

Now unless you're willing to debates the points fairly ,I'll not bother to respond to your post & and bad twists

Repeat what  i said and put it into your own words huh? :lol: How sad.
I'm not the one whose been twisting or bringing in things that isn't true and i dealt with you more than fairly. You're the one who replied to me, I didn't and wasn't originally talking to you in the first place as anyone can check.

Got it, get it, good.

[ROJM_old]

Sold the machines and what!? Nobody is giving a shit for SFC...

Again that is not the point I was making.

Jonboy said the game sold like shit, this statement is incorrect because the game did not actually sell like shit, because it sold at least over 2,000 units. If users are not coming back to try the game is a completely different statement to make (And one I did not point out) but SEGA feels happy enough to make an update for the game so there is some indication of them being happy with the title.

2 000 isn't great either and definatly not a big hit compared to other Sega arcade sales. Compare that number to the level of arcade centres in the cities alone and that's not even covering 10 percent.

[ROJM_old]

Why not just make a new series then? Seriously, it obviously looks nothing like the old Shining games, but it does not even look like the horrendous PlayStation 2 ones either. Where are the wolfmen, hawkmen, centaurs and men with big beards? Were there ever even any floating islands in a Shining game before?

I agree that the level art is great, fantastic even, but why must they change the franchise's style so much when they can just as easily call it a new franchise?!?

ARRRRGGGGGHHHH!!

At least you've got SFG to look forward to. :lol:

[Team Andromeda]

Right for the last time , I'll try and address your points openly and Honestly . Please when or if  you respond , do the same .

I was talking about a specific version. You're the one who had to try and spin it and make it look like you know what you were talking about when I

? I Admitted I didn’t know about the SEGA version - how one can square that , with trying to make out, one knows what he is talking about , I do not know .
I’ll ....say again , if SEGA Toys did make the game before NCL did in 2005, then Kudos to SEGA. Shame they didn’t take the Concept , to the Consumer R&D Labs like NCL  and make a game out of it , because that couldn’t have been a Potful of money for SEGA instead of NCL.

SMB is more of a game anyone could play, a kid or adult could play it. Sonic is the same.

To make out this isn't

 Isn't Aimed at kids , defies believe , and like Nagoshi-san said in his EDGE column  , Monkey ball was ported to the Cube , due to the NCL userbase being more for  children , fitting with the games “cute”  image and that the game was  “targeted to a younger audience”.
Now there's a lack of new IP coming from the Consumer labs , and you know it .

And I never supported Sammy either so grow up.

So you don't like Sammy ?, I take it Hajime Satomi isn't the man to sort SEGA out ? . Great if so , I agree with you .

The VF5 engine came out nearly four years ago now. VT3 the same and most of the titles you have named are the same too,the revisions are all based on an existing engine

So te Arcade teams don't share or use each other's engines then ?, and How old is the Kenzan engine now ?, Why is it ok for the Yakuza Team,  to re-use their  engine twice now  , but not for the VF 5 team?

No what you want is sega to stop being unique

They're doing a great job of that now , not much unique in both SEGA Consumer or Arcade line-up . I couldn't careless as long as it's good.

You keep praising terible titles like RE5 and LP2 and want Sega to do that style. You keep comparing Heavy Rain as an example when all i see from that is a rip of Shenmue. Just like when GTA moved to 3D and did the same. I don't want sega reduced to that level.

This is where you fall down . For starters Yakuza shares a lot on common with Shenmue , nothing much new there , I've not played LP II (the full game, for a good reason) I am though,  deeply impressed with its engine , use of On-Line , and planned features
I've brought up Heavy Rain once , maybe twice (so hardly keeping on bringing the title Up) and if you think its a Shenmue rip-off,  then you clearly haven't played the game .It plays nothing like Shenmue at all , the controls (bar the rip-off QTE's , also used in Yakuza) and gameplay is quite , quite different , more like Fahrenheit.  Quantic Dream Omikron shipped before Shenmmue, and was one the 1st games to usher in worlds living worlds populated with NCP's .

Yet you failed misarably to porvide any significant IP from the arcades as well

That isn't my problem with the Consumer or Arcade teams , You're the one that keeps on saying nothing new from the Arcade Teams . I'm simply pointing out , there's nothing much new form the Consumer Teams either .

Your all fave Ueda or whatever his name is seems to be getting things done as well

So the man that likes no have a go at people for any lack of SEGA Knowledge , doesn't know Ueda-san 1st name . Tut ,tut .

Sega shouldn't sell out their principles just to satisfy a so called sega gamer who basically wants them to be a glorified PC developer

Then what SEGA are doing working onthe PC Tech based consoles that is the 360 and PS3 I do not know .

As for RGG, if SHENMUE had been more succesful we would have gotten the same treatment, the difference being RGG is more open ended

Yakuza isn't more opened ended at all , you can't go anywhere in game map , anytime you want to , just like Shenmue , and nothing compared to a vast open world like in Fallout III , and after Shenmue the Yakuza experience isn't that new at all. Like I say , AM#2 are class

Borderbreak came out over a year ago this is a revision of the same game. It shows no difference graphically or GP wise to the first one

Kind of like the deal with Yakuza games then ?.

blatantly slagged off Nagoshi and unfairly criticised his games

I don't like the man , I don't think he's fit to lead the Consumer Teams . I so wish it was Yu Suzuki or more so , Masayoshi Kikuchi. But that won't , or doesn't stop me praising games Nagoshi-san have worked on, and there's not many praising SpikeOut on the X-Box ,and no it wasn't a Smilebit game , it was in development long before Smilebit joined AV , and Monkeyball had nothing to do with any of the Smilebit team .

The difference with me is i don't try to make one certain programmer greater and more important than he really is.

Sigh.. I totally look up to and respect  Naka for his programing Skills. For which,  I think he was one of the best ever at SOJ. His PS engine onthe Master System and Sonic Mega Drive  engine took the piss , and the NiGHTS engine was incredible .
 No different from how I admire and respect the likes of Dave Perry for his Mega Drive game engines, John O'Brien for his Mega CD engines , or Geoff Crammond for his stunning engines on the Amiga and PC.

[Barry the Nomad]

You're all sounding like a bunch of Sega Nerds!!!

[jonboy101]

I'm going to be away from my computer for about a week, but I'm going to jump back into this argument when I get the chance. I don't care how man pages back.