Gay Marriage Congratulations and Debate

[Moody]

How does my opinion kill people in the U.S.?

Gay people and basically any non-straight person is around five times (if not more) likely to be murdered in the United States alone.

I'm just tired of this "I'm gay, so I'm proud" stuff. I can't believe people compare it to civil rights.

So you're saying you just don't like gay people being open? What's wrong with that? Oh yeah, it's not "natural", apparently. Except it completely is. And gay rights IS a civil rights issue, civil rights doesn't end at black people. And even if it did, it hasn't ended for them anyway.

The gay community has created its own vibrant culture. By reducing the differences in opportunities and experiences between gay and heterosexual people, this unique culture may cease to exist.

And how? How are gay people reducing opprotunities and experiences for straight people? If anything, the discrimination against gay people at their jobs, schools, home life, social life, etc. is reducing OUR opprotunities. I genuinely don't understand how that affects straight people at all. And you really think, you really genuinely think that heterosexual people are the ones keeping the gay "culture" alive? Really?

I just get tired of hearing about it. Believe it or not, I actually think it's almost kind of a good thing that they legalized it just because I don't want to hear it.

You can stop hearing about our struggles when we stop struggling. And if you think the struggle ends at marriage, you're incredibly wrong.

People should not have to pay their taxes for something they think is wrong.

As Jrcade said, your taxes aren't paying for marriages. At all. You know what your taxes are paying for though? Drone strikes on innocent citizens in Iraq and other places in the middle east. It's also fuelling the war efforts there. Do you think you should be paying for that?

Legalizing this advances the homosexual agenda and unfairly tells its opponents that they are bigots.

It's almost as if telling an entire group of people they shouldn't have rights is a shitty thing to do.

Once again, this is my opinion. I also must say that your opinion is fine too. Let's just try not to take this too far, ok?

I'm having a civil debate. I don't think that's taking things too far.

[Sharky]

Homosexuality has been studied in mammals, birds, fish, reptiles and insects. It's as natural as it gets. If anything is unnatural its marriage... Marriage is nothing more than a man made social concept. So many marriages end in divorce because the sad truth is we're not designed to be a monogamous species. For most people 'love' has an expiry date and a lot of people get that 7 year itch; time to move on, time to sow our oats in someone else.

Marriage is unnatural and stupid and if gays want to the right to be as unhappily married as the rest of us then I say why the hell not?!

[Sharky]

Just a note, I split this topic from the Random Thoughts Topic as I can see this becoming quite the debate and it isn't in keeping with the theme of the Random Thoughts topic.

[JRcade19]

I was about to say...."SHARKY Y U NO 1ST AMENDMENT"

But then I saw this and was like..."ok.gif"

[pirovash88]

Being gay is not natural?

The fuck am I reading this garbage for?

Honestly I'd rather this thread be closed. For the simple reason that I don't want to dislike someone because of their views. I want to come here and not worry about whether someone does or does not agree with how my brother lives his life.

This is a great site and I'd rather not even get into this.

[JRcade19]

I can agree to closing the thread if it is so wished.

My original post in the thoughts thread was as was stated in the OP, a simple congratulations. Debate was not intended. I did expect some responses, but not to the actual level of what I received relative to the simplicity of the statement(A simple Congrats).

[Moody]

It's partly my fault, I was curious how everyone felt about it. I pretty much invited bigots to come in here and start talking shit. What can you do, I guess.

But yeah still, all the bigots can continue having their shitty opinion on why me and my friends shouldn't exist or have rights, and I'll continue quietly hating them. I mean hey, it's just my opinion.

[JRcade19]

It's a touchy subject. I myself should have probably made a separate thread for it even at the most simple of statements, so I'll share some of the blame here as well for failing to due diligence.

[Barry the Nomad]

Funny how somebody with a Star Trek username can have such opinions...

[Sharky]

I think we'll keep the thread open for the time being as having an outdated opinion isn't breaking the rules... At the first sign of a turn towards mindless insults- which I hope it doesn't, then we'll close it.

PCM and Spock are totally wrong in my opinion, but people aren't born 'bigots,' it's something they are taught. Often by parents, piers or religion. It doesn't necessarily make them bad people, just misguided. Thoughtfully challenging their beliefs is better than closing the thread and silencing them and in turn maybe cementing those beliefs.

[Happy Cat]

some quotes from various sources over the internet:

Gov. Greg Abbott of Texas, a Republican, issued a directive to state agencies saying that employees should not be penalized for refusing to act in violation of their beliefs. “No Texan is required by the Supreme Court’s decision to act contrary to his or her religious beliefs regarding marriage,” he said in a statement.

Gov. Bobby Jindal of Louisiana, a Republican candidate for president, warned that the court decision “will pave the way for an all-out assault against the religious freedom rights of Christians who disagree.”

Sen. Ted Cruz is ready to rain on the parade of Texas citizens celebrating the Supreme Court decision on Friday to legalize same-sex marriage throughout the country.

    On Saturday, the 2016 Republican presidential candidate said he “absolutely” believes that his state’s country clerks should deny marriage licenses to same-sex couples if they have a religious objection, in an interview with The Texas Tribune.

    “Ours is a country that was built by men and women fleeing religious oppression,” Cruz told the newspaper, “and you look at the foundation of this country — it was to seek out a new land where anyone of us could worship the Lord God Almighty with all of our hearts, minds and souls, without government getting in the way.”

to think that these people have power. It makes it all the more funny that the law got passed without their input, which is part of the reason they are so mad.

oh, and this is pretty good:

[Moody]

Is anyone else severely unsurprising that these are all coming from Texas? Let's be real, it would've probably taken them another thirty years before they made it legal in their state.

[MadeManG74]

I think it's great that it's legal in the US. It contradicts the teachings of most churches, yes, but that's why Church and State are seperate in the first place. Churches don't need to allow it, just as they don't need to allow divorce either.

The one thing that is kind of strange is the way this came about. I understood that this decision was always at a state level, but to be overridden at a national level like it was is a sign that power is being removed from the states. I don't know enough about the US legal system but I imagine that can have repercussions later on. Considering it happened right after the Confederate flag was banned (itself being a symbol of states rebelling against the federal government) is probably a coincidence, but some feel it's all related.

Either way, I think gay marriage is a perfectly fine to legalise, happy it happened. In terms of homosexuals adopting or having children I'm still unsure of it. I'll openly admit that I don't know much about the subject, but it just feels to me that a child of either gender needs to have a male and female parent to balance them? Maybe that's not true, but just 'feels' important to me. Something I haven't wrapped my head around yet.

I am kind of tired of everyone changing their facebook avatars to rainbows and businesses putting up rainbow flags though. It just reeks of slacktivism and hashtag acitivism. It's especially funny because my gay friends are the ones who haven't changed their display pics and have carried on. I feel like it's almost a race for attention more than any real support.

I feel the same way about pride parades. Every one I've seen has become so commercial and more of a 'Freak Show' than anything to do with supporting people, sadly.

[Sharky]

In terms of homosexuals adopting or having children I'm still unsure of it. I'll openly admit that I don't know much about the subject, but it just feels to me that a child of either gender needs to have a male and female parent to balance them? Maybe that's not true, but just 'feels' important to me. Something I haven't wrapped my head around yet.

whether or not children need both male and female role models is beside the point when you take into account how many children are growing up with a single parent. (And growing up fine.) There are a LOT of single parents out there... It's ridiculous to argue that a single parent is better than two, whether they're two of the same sex or opposite. Plus in the case of most children up for adoption they have neither.

[seanieb]

I found this thread completely randomly testing things, and I braced myself before I clicked it, but like looking at a car accident you just have to look.

I was raised in a single parent home and I'm definitely gay, and I've also fielded a lot of stereotyping from it. I tend to be pretty moderate on this kind of stuff but I wanted to acknowledge the whole fallacy of a family unit. I can be fairly sure in my situation my life would be certifiably harder if we had to keep my father around.

Love, morality and being raised right takes a good parent and a loving home, the composition doesn't matter. We should be thrilled that there's a whole huge swarth of loving homes that have opened up to children in the system, not lamenting that they'll somehow be corrupted by living in a non-traditional family more than not knowing what a stable home is.

I also had the fortune to be at the supreme court pretty close to the ruling, it was amazing! (I'm in the green shirt, nothing like DC to make you feel under dressed)


Marriage has always been defined as a federal institution, you claim it on your federal taxes. If we're gonna be on the same playing field, then everyone should be in "civil unions" and marriage can return to it's ceremonial roots. But the Christians I talked to on the steps of the Court simply deflected me saying "why should we give up what we've had for hundreds of years". I think some people just don't understand that it's not okay to decide that some people are just second-class citizens.