Author Topic: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital games  (Read 68969 times)

Offline jonboy101

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #45 on: May 02, 2010, 11:54:32 am »
Yes.
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Offline Happy Cat

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #46 on: May 02, 2010, 12:52:02 pm »
Quote from: "Aki-at"
You guys realize that would be a rather large critical piece over Simon Jeffrey's reign, right?
The only person I can possibly think of who would hate the article is Cube
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Offline Sega Stylista

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #47 on: May 02, 2010, 01:32:15 pm »
I called that Simon Jeffrey Sega West failure two years ago when people were still defending it and admonishing me for criticizing it.

I would be more concerned about Sega Sammy if the stock price wasn't at a recent high.  I think Sega is in danger but also with a real shot at a turnaround though this is definitely the last chance they get.  I don't think the Digital thing is a smoke screen. . . they need Sega San Francisco to make the deals with Apple store (maybe Facebook, too) and Backbone to make the ports.
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Offline Sega Uranus

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #48 on: May 02, 2010, 02:31:17 pm »
Quote from: "Sega Stylista"
I called that Simon Jeffrey Sega West failure two years ago when people were still defending it and admonishing me for criticizing it.

I would be more concerned about Sega Sammy if the stock price wasn't at a recent high.  I think Sega is in danger but also with a real shot at a turnaround though this is definitely the last chance they get.  I don't think the Digital thing is a smoke screen. . . they need Sega San Francisco to make the deals with Apple store (maybe Facebook, too) and Backbone to make the ports.

This is far from SEGA's "Last shot" at anything. Financially they are doing fine - Really good even, and have many profitable games and services out at the moment that appeal to a wide range of audiences. Their biggest problems at the moment are mostly related to their Japanese branch, with most of their games being developed with only one region in mind. PSP is not a very successful global platform for instance, nor would Resonance of Fate ever have been considered a good seller, nor would it have ever been considered a good game.

I cannot believe you want Backbone to ever work with SEGA again on anything though. SEGA's worst releases in the past 5 years can be summed up as "Developed by Backbone" with such titles as Sonic Rivals, Sonic 1 conversion for Game Boy Advance, and all of those poorly assembled Vintage Collection ports.
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Offline Sega Stylista

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #49 on: May 02, 2010, 05:31:35 pm »
Quote from: "Sega Uranus"
Their biggest problems at the moment are mostly related to their Japanese branch, with most of their games being developed with only one region in mind. PSP is not a very successful global platform for instance, nor would Resonance of Fate ever have been considered a good seller, nor would it have ever been considered a good game.

I agree that is a major problem though I think part of that is from the legacy of the SJ Sega West that believed SOJ titles stay in Japan and western developed games get sold in the west.  Now that, that is gone I think they will make an internal japanese studio shift towards making great games with global appeal.

:cough PSU

Sega needs to find its niche in today's gaming market rather than adapt itself to it by shedding its image and ignoring past franchises which was tried and failed.

That being said, while Bayo, Vanquish, and Yakuza maybe niche western offerings Sega needs to believe in itself that it can make a mega hit title again with broad mainstream appeal that isn't casual crap.

Quote
I cannot believe you want Backbone to ever work with SEGA again on anything though. SEGA's worst releases in the past 5 years can be summed up as "Developed by Backbone" with such titles as Sonic Rivals, Sonic 1 conversion for Game Boy Advance, and all of those poorly assembled Vintage Collection ports.

I dislike Backbone, I'm just being practical.  They will have to continue to employ them for porting duties in cases of titles like SA and CT until they find another studio or develop an internal japanese studio that can make quality ports without being too costly and still profitable.
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Giant corporations. . . The assassin\'s underworld has become a commodity. A chance for profit AND entertainment for the masses. But shadows from the wilder days still linger. . .

Offline Barry the Nomad

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #50 on: May 02, 2010, 05:34:19 pm »
Backbone did Ultimate Genesis Collection, right? They can't be completely awful. As long as they simply emulate Genesis games.
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Offline Orta

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #51 on: May 02, 2010, 05:39:02 pm »
Quote from: "Barry the Nomad"
Backbone did Ultimate Genesis Collection, right? They can't be completely awful. As long as they simply emulate Genesis games.

Sonic 3 & Knuckles is a four or five line function in C using the ROMs from both games. Yes, they are awful (by their reasons for not including S3&K in the collection anyway).
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Offline Barry the Nomad

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #52 on: May 02, 2010, 05:50:30 pm »
I don't speak techie. ;)
Are you saying that Sonic 3 & Knuckles is simple to emulate and yet they failed to include it? If so, I agree. They should have. But it's still a great compilation disc. Of course, the disc is great due to Sega classics, not because of Backbone as a developer.
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Offline MadeManG74

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #53 on: May 02, 2010, 06:03:06 pm »
Quote from: "Barry the Nomad"
I don't speak techie. ;)
Are you saying that Sonic 3 & Knuckles is simple to emulate and yet they failed to include it? If so, I agree. They should have. But it's still a great compilation disc. Of course, the disc is great due to Sega classics, not because of Backbone as a developer.

Yeah thats the thing, I don't imagine it's hard to emulate Mega Drive games on a 360. They also had rubbish achievements, so theres that.
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Offline Sega Uranus

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #54 on: May 02, 2010, 06:07:16 pm »
Quote from: "Sega Stylista"
Quote from: "Sega Uranus"
Their biggest problems at the moment are mostly related to their Japanese branch, with most of their games being developed with only one region in mind. PSP is not a very successful global platform for instance, nor would Resonance of Fate ever have been considered a good seller, nor would it have ever been considered a good game.

I agree that is a major problem though I think part of that is from the legacy of the SJ Sega West that believed SOJ titles stay in Japan and western developed games get sold in the west.  Now that, that is gone I think they will make an internal japanese studio shift towards making great games with global appeal.

:cough PSU

Sega needs to find its niche in today's gaming market rather than adapt itself to it by shedding its image and ignoring past franchises which was tried and failed.

That being said, while Bayo, Vanquish, and Yakuza maybe niche western offerings Sega needs to believe in itself that it can make a mega hit title again with broad mainstream appeal that isn't casual crap.

I do not think SEGA needs to find a 'Niche', I think they need to figure out what made their games appealing at all in the first place.

Back in the 90s, Phantasy Star was not designed to be like or even similar to something like Final Fantasy to try and emulate it's success. What the designers and developers set out to do was make something fun that looked cooler than the competition. The sci-fi setting in Phantasy Star was like nothing else on the market. It looked better, it sounded better, it was longer and much more challenging than the competition. It was a hit because the designers focused on their own concepts. Today new Phantasy Star games can be summed up as very similar to Final Fantasy, Monster Hunter and the like.

The same is true with something like Golden Axe. The original was made with the thought in mind that kids liked playing as heroic characters who used swords. The end result was that it looked, played and sounded better than the competition, again offering things the other games could not. Beast Rider was designed with God of War in mind, how they can get it to be as cool as that, and how they could ride off of sex appeal with Tyris Flare, remember how that game turned out?

The most obvious offender is Sonic the Hedgehog. Today his games are designed with nothing but kids in mind, seeing what kids would find cool. It all clashes with the original idea that Sonic should be for everyone, this is the main issue with Sonic I believe, outside of Sonic Team being fucking shit I mean.

I mean, just look at AfterBurner Climax. It does everything right. It follows everything the original did with expanding its basic concepts, but not to the point that it clashes with anything the original set out to achieve. It was designed to appeal to anyone and everyone and just be based around fun all the while doing something the staff wants to do, NOT taking other ideas or trying to emulate another successful design. What happened? It was a huge success, everyone loves it. This is truly the design in which made SEGA so great, not because they used to be or need to find their "Niche".

Oh, and sorry for the rantish post!
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Offline Orta

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #55 on: May 02, 2010, 06:13:16 pm »
Quote from: "Barry the Nomad"
I don't speak techie. ;)
Are you saying that Sonic 3 & Knuckles is simple to emulate and yet they failed to include it? If so, I agree. They should have. But it's still a great compilation disc. Of course, the disc is great due to Sega classics, not because of Backbone as a developer.

In short, yes. They have the emulator in place. If it's an emulator then it should be able to run any game you can pull off of the Mega Drive's library.

Merging Sonic 3 with Sonic & Knuckles is simple in terms of programming. They can do it on the fly, the 360 and the PS3 have more than enough memory; they don't even need to have the merged ROM on the disc. Then, it's just a matter of having the emulator run the merged rom.

As fas as I remember they cited a number of difficulties for not including S3&K in the collection. To me it doesn't make sense because if they can make an emulator, I'm sure they can code something this simple. There was this site poking fun at them because of that. They even had the code. I wish I could find it...

EDit: I just remembered S&K on XBLA has lock-on. Heh, there's your reason: €€€$$$£££
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Offline Sega Stylista

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #56 on: May 02, 2010, 11:17:45 pm »
Quote from: "Sega Uranus"
What the designers and developers set out to do was make something fun that looked cooler than the competition.

Simple but good premise.

Quote
I mean, just look at AfterBurner Climax. It does everything right. It follows everything the original did with expanding its basic concepts, but not to the point that it clashes with anything the original set out to achieve. It was designed to appeal to anyone and everyone and just be based around fun all the while doing something the staff wants to do, NOT taking other ideas or trying to emulate another successful design. What happened? It was a huge success, everyone loves it. This is truly the design in which made SEGA so great, not because they used to be or need to find their "Niche".

Oh, and sorry for the rantish post!

Well niche made it sound too narrow in scope.  Sega will always have some niche stuff in their line up, but I think going with what is cool , cutting edge, and fun and making it accessible to everyone is the way to go. I probably meant more like identity than niche, like their brand differentiation point.  Are EA and Activision cool, not really?  Sega could be the cool one.  They have to rebuild the brand that way now, that is the challenge.  Right now Sega = Shit Sonic Games to 90% of the gaming population.  If you could erase that and start over with ABC, Bayo, Yakuza, Vanquish, etc. you could restart with Sega being cool and for everyone again.  Basically it comes down to quality and the fucking management realizing if they don't commit to it they won't have a company much longer.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 pm by Guest »

[size=150]SEGA DIGITALISTA[/size][/color]

Giant corporations. . . The assassin\'s underworld has become a commodity. A chance for profit AND entertainment for the masses. But shadows from the wilder days still linger. . .

Offline Team Andromeda

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #57 on: May 04, 2010, 04:13:51 am »
Quote from: "Sega Uranus"
Quote from: "Sega Stylista"
Quote from: "Sega Uranus"
Their biggest problems at the moment are mostly related to their Japanese branch, with most of their games being developed with only one region in mind. PSP is not a very successful global platform for instance, nor would Resonance of Fate ever have been considered a good seller, nor would it have ever been considered a good game.

I agree that is a major problem though I think part of that is from the legacy of the SJ Sega West that believed SOJ titles stay in Japan and western developed games get sold in the west.  Now that, that is gone I think they will make an internal japanese studio shift towards making great games with global appeal.

:cough PSU

Sega needs to find its niche in today's gaming market rather than adapt itself to it by shedding its image and ignoring past franchises which was tried and failed.

That being said, while Bayo, Vanquish, and Yakuza maybe niche western offerings Sega needs to believe in itself that it can make a mega hit title again with broad mainstream appeal that isn't casual crap.

I do not think SEGA needs to find a 'Niche', I think they need to figure out what made their games appealing at all in the first place.

Back in the 90s, Phantasy Star was not designed to be like or even similar to something like Final Fantasy to try and emulate it's success. What the designers and developers set out to do was make something fun that looked cooler than the competition. The sci-fi setting in Phantasy Star was like nothing else on the market. It looked better, it sounded better, it was longer and much more challenging than the competition. It was a hit because the designers focused on their own concepts. Today new Phantasy Star games can be summed up as very similar to Final Fantasy, Monster Hunter and the like.

The same is true with something like Golden Axe. The original was made with the thought in mind that kids liked playing as heroic characters who used swords. The end result was that it looked, played and sounded better than the competition, again offering things the other games could not. Beast Rider was designed with God of War in mind, how they can get it to be as cool as that, and how they could ride off of sex appeal with Tyris Flare, remember how that game turned out?

The most obvious offender is Sonic the Hedgehog. Today his games are designed with nothing but kids in mind, seeing what kids would find cool. It all clashes with the original idea that Sonic should be for everyone, this is the main issue with Sonic I believe, outside of Sonic Team being fucking shit I mean.

I mean, just look at AfterBurner Climax. It does everything right. It follows everything the original did with expanding its basic concepts, but not to the point that it clashes with anything the original set out to achieve. It was designed to appeal to anyone and everyone and just be based around fun all the while doing something the staff wants to do, NOT taking other ideas or trying to emulate another successful design. What happened? It was a huge success, everyone loves it. This is truly the design in which made SEGA so great, not because they used to be or need to find their "Niche".

Oh, and sorry for the rantish post!

That's one of the best and spot on Posts I've read. I'm not even sure SEGA knows its self, what makes a SEGA game. The worst part for me, is that even when SEGA try to emulate what is selling well inthe Market place, its in most cases an Inferior product
Worst still is how SEGA is being so hopeless outclassed in tech and Online, after being at the forefront on both since the Saturn days, right through the X-Box and Cube .

Maybe SEGA best days have gone forever
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 pm by Guest »
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Offline Sharky

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #58 on: May 04, 2010, 08:16:12 am »
Quote from: "Team Andromeda"

That's one of the best and spot on Posts I've read. I'm not even sure SEGA knows its self, what makes a SEGA game. The worst part for me, is that even when SEGA try to emulate what is selling well inthe Market place, its in most cases an Inferior product
Worst still is how SEGA is being so hopeless outclassed in tech and Online, after being at the forefront on both since the Saturn days, right through the X-Box and Cube .

Maybe SEGA best days have gone forever

Well thats because when Sega trys to emulate the competition they are not doing what they do best.

I couldn't say if Segas best days are behind them (Although probably since having a console is probably the hight of any videogame company) but I can happily say their worst days are... From 2003 too 2006 I hardly baught anything Sega made. While 2010 I have baught more just in the last 4 months then I did in 3 years during that period.

-Bayonetta
-Yakuza 3
-Nepoleon TW
-Sega Racing
-After Burner Climax

(Had Valkyria Chronicles 2, Phantasy Star Portable 2 or Yakuza 4 came out in the UK and not just Japan I'd have had all of those two)


As for 'Sega Style' and 'everyone outclassing them' Sega easily still hangs onto the medal for best SRPG and probably even best JRPG of this generation so far and Virtua Fighter 5 is yet to be topped in the 3D fighter arena. While I know you are not the biggest fan the Yakuza series is VERY Sega to me and I don't think any other company comes even close to doing what that game does even if the tech is dated now.

Total War or Football Manager may not be original Sega games but they are the top of their genres.

I think Segas arcade division are the best they have been right now since the Naomi days.

I'm not saying Sega are on top of their game or even as good as the competition right now... but at the end of the day they still make and publish Sega-ish games and thats what matters to me.
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Offline Team Andromeda

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Re: SEGA hit by 73 people layoff, more focus on digital game
« Reply #59 on: May 04, 2010, 11:45:59 am »
Quote
Well thats because when Sega trys to emulate the competition they are not doing what they do best

I'm Sorry sharky my good mate, I just don't agree . Streets Of Rage was SEGA emulating the Comp , and SEGA made a game that was Far better, and just took the piss with SOR II.  SEGA was ripping off Track and Field with Decathelte, and with it... SEGA made one of the best sporting games ever produced . SEGA was ripping off Diablo with PSO, and it ranks as the one of the true Highpoint of SEGA.

Virtual Racing , Virtual Cop Daytona USA , Panzer Dragoon were in many ways SEGA's answer to Drivers Eye's, Lethal Enforcers  Ridge Racer, Star Fox , and it really didn't get any better than those days. Ok, most prob I'm might be the only one, but I loved SEGA GT series too.
SEGA always been great at taking other IP's and putting its own Spin on it .  

Quote
I couldn't say if Segas best days are behind them (Although probably since having a console is probably the hight of any videogame company) but I can happily say their worst days are... From 2003 too 2006 I hardly baught anything Sega made. While 2010 I have baught more just in the last 4 months then I did in 3 years during that period.

-Bayonetta
-Yakuza 3
-Nepoleon TW
-Sega Racing
-After Burner Climax

Bayonetta isn't a SEGA game , I haven't even played Sega Racing, much less seen it in any Arcades (so can't really comment on that) . Its hard to find any fault with the Arcade Staff and their games, Consumer Divisions, it's a Different story.
Yakuza 3 isn't as good as Yakuza II imo, which was for me the highpoint of the series, and also a technical showcase -In how to get the best out of the PS2 (I can't say the same for Yakuza III).  
Yakuza 1& II, OutRun Coast To Coast, SEGA GT Online, VF 4 Evo all came out in the dark days,you speak off. To me they're as good, if not better than anything SEGA produced of late.

Quote
Sega easily still hangs onto the medal for best SRPG and probably even best JRPG of this generation so far and Virtua Fighter 5 is yet to be topped in the 3D fighter arena. While I know you are not the biggest fan the Yakuza series is VERY Sega to me and I don't think any other company comes even close to doing what that game does even if the tech is dated now.

Val Is brilliant, but its years old, and to me I enjoyed Blue Dragoon more as an RPG.  What so depressing about VAL, is rather than Build on it , and take it forward and improve Canvas , SEGA cut it down, and bring it to the PSP (which I don't think as resulted in better sales).
VF 5 is class , so is VT III , its always tends to be, with the Arcade side making games. How can AM#2 be so word class in the Arcades and push what is in effect a cheap Pentium 4 with VF 5 (that looks better than any next gen fighter), yet most of SEGA consumer teams,are not able to push the Wii I do not know  .

I loved the 1st 2 Yakuza games ,  but the series is becoming stale, taking backwards step in terms of tech and Animation, and offering more of the same , The same shops , the same locations (for the most part), and like Sonic being miked far much, and the teams not given enough development time.

This year as been the worst ever for me as a SEGA consumer fan, it really has.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 pm by Guest »
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