Why the Dream failed, Famitsu article

[Team Andromeda]

Now, i don't get why people just assume that the Saturn couldn't handle 3D well, or couldn't handle it as good as the PS.

To be fair, its the same deal with the PS and 2D - Where a lot of people think it can't do 2D , when it can and do it very well just not as good as the Saturn . The Saturn was in the same boat but for 3D and while it can do nice 3D it can't do it has good as the PS

It basicly means that developpers didn't understand squidly squat about the saturn. in other words they were too eager to make fast money, and didnt gave it a chance.

To be fair you can't blame some developers for going with SONY (more so after the great sales) SEGA should have done some things better with the Saturn (3d transparent effects for 1) but also its launch tools were poor and that should have been handled better and the likes of Clockwork Knight and Daytona USA should never have been rushed out (that did a lot to hurt Saturn image) .

The big trouble for the Saturn was everyone was getting used to C and PC development and the Saturn needed Assembly code to get the best out of the system, but that was never going to happen when the PS became the development lead platform for games

[Salsatuna]

To be fair, its the same deal with the PS and 2D - Where a lot of people think it can't do 2D , when it can and do it very well just not as good as the Saturn . The Saturn was in the same boat but for 3D and while it can do nice 3D it can't do it has good as the PS

To be fair you can't blame some developers for going with SONY (more so after the great sales) SEGA should have done some things better with the Saturn (3d transparent effects for 1) but also its launch tools were poor and that should have been handled better and the likes of Clockwork Knight and Daytona USA should never have been rushed out (that did a lot to hurt Saturn image) .

The big trouble for the Saturn was everyone was getting used to C and PC development and the Saturn needed Assembly code to get the best out of the system, but that was never going to happen when the PS became the development lead platform for games

I have developped an aversion for any Sony filled content. I am reaching overdose status.

"Imatitation is the sincerest form of flatery" .

The Sony's consoles are'nt just that good, people were filled with lies and all was very much overhyped.  The first PS was just sub-par compared to the Saturn.
As i see it, Sega is a traditional company. See it as a classic tailor, were you go if you want to have a custom made suit.  While Sony is a "prêt à porter" multinational.

Yes, Sega made mistakes in the past. Yes, not all Sega machines were 100% flawless as some had minor flaws so it didn't reach the perfection status. Yes, Sega, Markteting machine sucks and blows at the same time. Sega was like the single parent, who had to manage a painful divorce with 3 kids to feed.

Now, that last was a(lso a) metaphore.

Sega had so much fame, that it became a target. That's what happens when one is famous. Others get jealous.
A whole lot, if not the majority is based on lies and rumors, just to make it fail. Now, why would someone want that??? Who has to gain from it?

Yes, Sega, abandonned the Mega CD. Yes Sega abandonned its 32X. Yes, Sega abandonned its Saturn, a decent well built powerful, 32-bit machine. Yes, we can all keep holding to our grudges even 10 to 20 years later, and in doing so we are forced to buy sub-par consoles.

As for the MEGA-CD, many think it was a flop. Well history doesnt see it that way. History remembers it as the best selling peripheral based on the CD tech.
For the 32x, well everyone had the impression it was too expensive. Maybe it was. That there were not enough games for it. What should Sega do in that case?Kkeep making games in the hope that people will grow some brains? Sega did the only thing it could do. That's what happens when people doesn't buy your products.

The Saturn was victim of a lot things: competition, false rumors, misconceptions, fabricated lies, ...
Sega was a bit powerless against all that, it didnt understand where it was coming from. What does one do in that case?
Nowadays , we know what to do --> Public Relations . But even at that point there was too much negativity. So, I hardly doubt it would have matter.

The PS had a lot a consoles that just broke. That was the case with the PS2 aswell. While teh Xbox and the Xbox360 too had its fails, Microsoft did provide something that the others just didn't do: a 2year Warranty. Everything was covered in that warranty in regards to failures, while Sony just didn't do that. And i as i've mentionned before aftersales was still delivered to consoles outide of the warranty. It sure didn't cost you the price of a new console.

Sony was never punished for its failures. It even had (and still has) the public opinion behind it. Nothing related to the failures has ever been documented. Which is very strange. While there was and is an outcry if Sega and Microsoft even "farted" .

All this disgust me, it disgusts me to the very core of my being.

But, as we are still talking about the Sega consoles after all those years. It surely has to mean something. History remembers only the brave. And maybe one day Sega will be treated as it should. And that others will be punished for their sins.

“It is better to fail in originality than to succeed in imitation.” Herman Melville

[Barry the Nomad]

I never said I like Microsoft but I said that I chose Microsoft over Sony. For obvious reasons. To be honest, Sega was the last brand I felt associated with. Evenmore, I do not identify myself with a brand. I buy something because of its quality and the purpose of it. Sega made quality products regardless of their marketing strategy.

Pretty much where I'm coming from. From Genesis through to Dreamcast, getting a new SEGA console and playing great games from them brought warm feelings to my heart. It sounds cheesy, but I'm certain you know exactly what I'm talking about.

Since the Dreamcast, there has not been a single piece of hardware that gave me that same feeling. I know it's not pure nostalgia, because I felt an association with SEGA's hardware even when it was brand new out of the box on release day.

Post-DC I went with the Xbox. I fucking hated Sony, and while I wasn't in love with MS I did respect that they were never in direct competition with SEGA. In fact, they won extra points for their controller design mimicking the Dreamcast controller, the fact that the Dreamcast had a Windows logo, and that Orta, JSRF, Crazy Taxi 3 and HotD III were all "Only On XBOX". In fact... all but HotD III still are!

Now I know a few of those things can easily be disputed as not meaning much, such as the Windows logo, but from a heart perspective it hurt like hell when the Dreamcast died, so as a SEGA fan I'd take any little bit of solace I could. Even if it was from a small SEGA/Microsoft connection.

---

I'm well aware that things have since changed. PS4, as much as I don't openly admit it, is doing a better job than the Xbox One. However, seeing as how I'm a SEGA fan first and hardly a Nintendo/Sony/MS fan, I really don't give a rats ass if Xbox One makes a 180 or if PS4 does some stupid "omglolrofl look theyre appealing to da gamerz wit dat funny tweet!" or Nintendo sells more or less Wii U's one month than they do another.

[Salsatuna]

Pretty much where I'm coming from. From Genesis through to Dreamcast, getting a new SEGA console and playing great games from them brought warm feelings to my heart. It sounds cheesy, but I'm certain you know exactly what I'm talking about.

Since the Dreamcast, there has not been a single piece of hardware that gave me that same feeling. I know it's not pure nostalgia, because I felt an association with SEGA's hardware even when it was brand new out of the box on release day.

Post-DC I went with the Xbox. I fucking hated Sony, and while I wasn't in love with MS I did respect that they were never in direct competition with SEGA. In fact, they won extra points for their controller design mimicking the Dreamcast controller, the fact that the Dreamcast had a Windows logo, and that Orta, JSRF, Crazy Taxi 3 and HotD III were all "Only On XBOX". In fact... all but HotD III still are!

Now I know a few of those things can easily be disputed as not meaning much, such as the Windows logo, but from a heart perspective it hurt like hell when the Dreamcast died, so as a SEGA fan I'd take any little bit of solace I could. Even if it was from a small SEGA/Microsoft connection.

---

I'm well aware that things have since changed. PS4, as much as I don't openly admit it, is doing a better job than the Xbox One. However, seeing as how I'm a SEGA fan first and hardly a Nintendo/Sony/MS fan, I really don't give a rats ass if Xbox One makes a 180 or if PS4 does some stupid "omglolrofl look theyre appealing to da gamerz wit dat funny tweet!" or Nintendo sells more or less Wii U's one month than they do another.

I know what you mean. Whenever I think of the Dreamcast, It brings up so much nostalgia. Every game i played was just fun. A very satisfying kind of fun. Something unreal. Maybe it was because the Dreamcast brought us to the next level. With its "Bing" videos, QTE's , VMU's, ....

When I think of the DC, i think of 2 games in particular, those two showed the potential and the uniqueness of the console.

The 1st one is Shenmue2, more so than Shenmue1, this game didn't feel like a game. I was personnaly invested into what was happening to Ryo. That game just oozes "epicness". This is the kind of game, that when you pick it up, and when you have the required IQ level to play it, you know you are going away on a voyage, an adventure. You know that you are going to do great things.
In our modern day, i had an almost similiar experience with "The Witcher2".

The 2nd game is, Ecco the Dolphin. Though being a Dolphin is quite an abstract thought. The developpers succeeded into creating a very believable world and an even more amazing story. They even managed to add Time-travelling to it, which is something very complex to do, and it stuck.
I even felt anger and sadness, when i saw the polution and the trapped dolphins. Everything that was happening, was really weighing on my conscience.

As for the Xbox, yes me too i found solace with games as JSRF, it is still a great game, huge game, one that i havent even finished yet. Even Gunvalkyrie i liked. though the game was short.
But in your list you forgot to mention ---> Shenmue2 (and 1 as a film).
As I played the game, a game that didn't looked as crisp as on the DC, I started to feel a void. Like something was yet familiar, but off. And it wasn't the English Dub.
It was only when i got to the Dojo, where Xiujing Hong (http://www.giantbomb.com/xiuying-hong/3005-1820/ )was going to teach me (Ryo)some new trick, that it hit me.

I was looking down on my xbox controller to see the directions of that new combat move on the VMU screen!?

That moment was like having an epiphany. As it was then, that I have realized what we all have lost...

[Nameless 24]

I never really felt "love" for a console to be honest.

Although I think the DS Lite is the best looking console I've ever owned, I don't associate myself with loving a console in terms of design really. I see it for playing games, and that's what SEGA are excellent at!

Even when I bought a Playstation 3, I associate Valkyria Chronicles with it, as it really did stand out for me.

[Barry the Nomad]

The Dreamcast design is beautiful, I definitely fell in love* with it. Still love it.

*I should note, this is not love in the same way as loving a person. I mean it like "loving" a movie or "loving" a city you live in.

[ROJM]

The PS had a lot a consoles that just broke. That was the case with the PS2 aswell. While teh Xbox and the Xbox360 too had its fails, Microsoft did provide something that the others just didn't do: a 2year Warranty. Everything was covered in that warranty in regards to failures, while Sony just didn't do that. And i as i've mentionned before aftersales was still delivered to consoles outide of the warranty. It sure didn't cost you the price of a new console.

Sony was never punished for its failures. It even had (and still has) the public opinion behind it. Nothing related to the failures has ever been documented. Which is very strange. While there was and is an outcry if Sega and Microsoft even "farted" .

Exactly, the flaws with sega systems and even everyone else's systems can be expected flaws when dealing with electronic equipment. But the Sony flaws was ridiculous and over the top and still is the highest in gaming history. The 360 failure rate is the highest for the current generation but that is insignificant compared to the PSX and PS2s that encounted problems and stopped working at a drop of a hat. This is a fact and there's no point of it being disputed no matter what sony PR spin, sony fan boys or sony apoligists like TA will have us believe.

[Trippled]

When the Dreamcast died, Arcades were dying out at the same time.

Personally I think it made sense. It was an end of an era.

[crackdude]

When the Dreamcast died, Arcades were dying out at the same time.

Personally I think it made sense. It was an end of an era.

I believe in this as well. The last arcade-based console.

[Team Andromeda]

xactly, the flaws with sega systems and even everyone else's systems can be expected flaws when dealing with electronic equipment. But the Sony flaws was ridiculous and over the top and still is the highest in gaming history. The 360 failure rate is the highest for the current generation but that is insignificant compared to the PSX and PS2s that encountered problems and stopped working at a drop of a hat. This is a fact and there's no point of it being disputed no matter what sony PR spin, sony fan boys or sony apoligists like TA will have us believe.

It's quite funny to see you 'try' and be one of the SEGA gang and have a bash at SONY; I wouldn't say too much but you're always the one  since the XBox days, saying SEGA should always be with SONY, The XBox isn't that great and so on.Some of us have been XBots from day one  but overlooking that fun bit of hypocrisy.... I would just point out a few things ...

XBox Thomson drive was every bit as bad as the poor lens inside the PS and sure the PS2 had issues but fixing an out-of-aligned lens is a hell of a lot easier than the terminal TROD of death.
I'll have a bet now that there's far more working launch PS and PS2 still to this day, than they are launch 360 consoles 

The last arcade-based console.

The DC in fact, marked the dawn when SEGA used console powered hardware for the Arcades

In fact, they won extra points for their controller design mimicking the Dreamcast controller, the fact that the Dreamcast had a Windows logo, and that Orta, JSRF, Crazy Taxi 3 and HotD III were all "Only On XBOX". In fact... all but HotD III still are!

The XBox was DC mark II in all but name and still the console that's got the best out of SEGA since they went 3rd party . Not only were games like Orta, JSRF, SEGA 2001 amazing games , they were graphically up there with anything else around .

[Trippled]

The DC in fact, marked the dawn when SEGA used console powered hardware for the Arcades

Which is why I'm annoyed at current Sega not bringing out more out of their Arcade heritage, when post 2000, all the consoles were powerful enough to do Arcade perfect ports of their stuff. Ports once every blue moon is too little.

The XBox was DC mark II in all but name and still the console that's got the best out of SEGA since they went 3rd party . Not only were games like Orta, JSRF, SEGA 2001 amazing games , they were graphically up there with anything else around .

I'd say the PS2 was Saturn Mark II, with Virtua Fighter, the Sega Ages series (+Nights Remake), Sakura Wars, Sega Rally 2006 etc.

[Team Andromeda]

Which is why I'm annoyed at current Sega not bringing out more out of their Arcade heritage, when post 2000, all the consoles were powerful enough to do Arcade perfect ports of their stuff

Yep spot on

I'd say the PS2 was Saturn Mark II, with Virtua Fighter, the Sega Ages series (+Nights Remake), Sakura Wars, Sega Rally 2006 etc

Well I wouldn't agree with you so much there , but I would say the PS2 was a Saturn mark 2 in terms of having a difficult development environment, poor launch tools, costly development kits and not being great at using C+ or PC code .

[Nameless 24]

The Dreamcast design is beautiful, I definitely fell in love* with it. Still love it.

*I should note, this is not love in the same way as loving a person. I mean it like "loving" a movie or "loving" a city you live in.

I admire many consoles designs and appearances for sure, but I am not really into technology as much as I'd hoped.

I understood your meaning of love for the consoles. Sadly I don't like where I live, lol.

However, I do love SEGA in that way, but mostly for their franchises and universes in their games.

[Centrale]

I really like the design of the Dreamcast itself, but I was disappointed that they broke from their prior color scheme (at least in the West) of black consoles. Of course, nowadays almost all consoles are black, but it was more of a defining characteristic of Sega consoles back in the day.

When I recently got a Dreamcast, I opted for the black Sega Sports edition so my collection of Sega consoles will look more consistent. Also, I sidestep the issue of nasty yellowing that happens to light-colored plastic over the years.

There was a special edition black Dreamcast that came out in Japan without the Sega Sports logo, and it looks fantastic, but I wouldn't be surprised to see it selling for $1000 or more these days. I can live with the logo, as the Sega Sports editions are pretty plentiful and usually only about $20 more than a regular DC.

One thing I personally don't like on the DC is the Windows logo. I don't consider MS to be a friend of Sega at all -- more like they were mildly parasitic.

[ROJM]

It's quite funny to see you 'try' and be one of the SEGA gang and have a bash at SONY; I wouldn't say too much but you're always the one  since the XBox days, saying SEGA should always be with SONY, The XBox isn't that great and so on.Some of us have been XBots from day one  but overlooking that fun bit of hypocrisy.... I would just point out a few things ...

My views on sony has always been clear. Obviously still sore that i proved you wrong that sega games didn't sell well on the xbox compared to game cube and Ps2? Which was always what i said. And i always said that sega should create more exclusives to platforms and not go multiplatform.And still i'm correct on that since we have seen how MP has worked for them. I've always been true blue. I dont need to lie about others not being so. But since you think that a SNES is better than an MD and that sony didn't do anything wrong during the DC era goes to show who is and isn't part of the sega gang.And that use of term is laughable in itself because all you've done as usual is derail a nice thread and tried to blacken Sega's name as usal. Not bad for someone whose faverite system is the system with the least sega made games on it.

XBox Thomson drive was every bit as bad as the poor lens inside the PS and sure the PS2 had issues but fixing an out-of-aligned lens is a hell of a lot easier than the terminal TROD of death.
I'll have a bet now that there's far more working launch PS and PS2 still to this day, than they are launch 360 consoles 

You can bet but you are wrong and you know it. Why are you defending such a piutyiful machine? why do you attack sega fans who state what sony did wrong? If you prefer sony then why do you even come here?